BlueGoose
off to a rocking start
Member since April 2011
Posts: 4
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Post by BlueGoose on Feb 6, 2013 22:01:13 GMT -5
Just a question I have searched the forums and have not found any reference to using Diamond Powder/Grit as a tumbling grit in a ROTARY tumbler. Has someone tried it and posted results?
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Post by johnjsgems on Feb 6, 2013 23:03:05 GMT -5
It should work well but would be very expensive. Diamond by the carat, silicon carbide by the pound.
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Post by Toad on Feb 6, 2013 23:52:46 GMT -5
Thinking about trying it for polish only
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Minnesota Daniel
freely admits to licking rocks
A COUPLE LAKERS
Member since August 2011
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Post by Minnesota Daniel on Feb 7, 2013 0:33:21 GMT -5
If I did the math right, a tablespoon of diamond polish weighs about 140 carats.
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BlueGoose
off to a rocking start
Member since April 2011
Posts: 4
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Post by BlueGoose on Feb 7, 2013 1:49:59 GMT -5
Maybe I am confusing the issue but from experience **holding a small Montana Agate against a silicon carbide wheel will wear a groove quickly--- pressing that same agate against a diamond plated wheel same grit will eat the agate and the wheel will be ready for more! SC breaks down into smaller sharp pieces and if left long enough will put a Simi polish on rocks without ever changing the sludge.
WHAT HAPPENS with diamond? For example A 3# bbl with Crushed agate the kind the will require at least twice thru on 60/90 SC That would be about 1/2 cup of grit(16 tbls. to a cup) as a rough measure grit is 1# per cup so 1/2 # grit at a RETAIL of $15 for 5#= $1.50 cost [Rock Peddler today $14.45 not counting shipping} Diamond Powder 60/70Mesh $22 for 100 carets 20 grams{ eBay Today TechDiamond.}If I put in 10 carats about $2.20 worth----WHAT HAPPENS?? Will it be ineffective? Will it chew up the agate and keep on grinding? Will it break down and disappear into diamond dust ?
HAS ANYONE TRYED USING DIAMOND?? IF NOT IS ANYONE WILLING TO TRY?
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Steve
has rocks in the head
Member since June 2005
Posts: 506
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Post by Steve on Feb 7, 2013 2:04:10 GMT -5
I'm not willing to try it, but my guess is that the diamonds will become embedded in the barrel and will bury themselves to the point of not being effective at grinding, but will be effective at scratching in later stages. Just a guess and not based on evidence or experience.
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jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Feb 7, 2013 6:51:10 GMT -5
Extraction of the diamond from the slurry would be a huge task.Maybe you could reuse the slurry in the polish mode.Look into the Lotto machine.I have bunch of rotaries and get dang good polish w/AO and sugar.But not like that Lotto.And i'm going to get a lotto to polish a big pile of tumbled stuff that needs more shine.It is a real fast machine too. I agree,the diamonds will probably get lost in the rocks,barrel,seams etc.A good many pounds of rock can probably dwarf the amount of diamond dust.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2013 16:22:57 GMT -5
I have considered using diamond for polish and re-using the solids. But the 0.3 micron AlOx from The Rock Shed seems to shine anything. And diamond isn't any smaller. Cr@p how small can ya go?
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Post by deb193redux on Feb 7, 2013 16:27:33 GMT -5
Even if the diamond did not break down like SiC, it whould soon be coated in the mud it had made. As noted above, to rinse the mud and reuse the diamond, you would need an efficient way to extract the diamond from the mud.
if you could get media that had embedded diamonds, and gradually wore down to expose more diamonds, and was large enough to retrieve form the slurry with a sieve, well then ....
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snuffy
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Member since May 2009
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Post by snuffy on Feb 7, 2013 16:45:18 GMT -5
Personally, I cant imagine getting anything shinier than with the ao from the rockshed. Might be just me! snuffy
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Minnesota Daniel
freely admits to licking rocks
A COUPLE LAKERS
Member since August 2011
Posts: 891
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Post by Minnesota Daniel on Feb 7, 2013 22:43:48 GMT -5
BlueGoose,
It's easier to visualize a comparison of diamond grit to SiC if you convert carats to cups (or tbls/tsp). Ten carats of diamond grit, as you propose, is less than a quarter teaspoon. I think that it would work pretty much like a quarter teaspoon of SiC would before it, the SiC, started to break down. Diamond is hard, it cuts better/faster than SiC, but it will cleave. It will eventually break down, just not as quickly as SiC. Almost all the grinding though I suspect would actually be rock to rock, because there wouldn't be near enough diamond surface area to do much of the cutting. The fact that diamond cuts better and won't break down as quickly as SiC does not overcome that problem. I think you'll have to use a similar volume of diamond grit as you would SiC grit-- closer to a $100 worth of it. If you did that, my prediction would be that it might only take a couple days to grind the rocks enough to move them to the 120/220. I'm sure diamond grit would last a lot longer than SiC and could be re-used, but as others have pointed out, you'll need to figure out a way to separate it from the mud in the slurry.
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Feb 8, 2013 0:00:03 GMT -5
I agree.Not enough coverage.Cut way back on silicon carbide and it takes forever.
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Post by mohs on Sept 29, 2016 19:12:21 GMT -5
This is an interesting topic
I always wondered if a grease table would work to recover diamonds from the slurry? Or What if you used diamonds, plus a water/ oil mixed to create the slurry? Would the oil float to the top of the barrel with the diamonds? Skim it off ? Diamond recovered?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2016 14:42:38 GMT -5
No.
But you could probably pan it off.
Another thing to consider is diamond has perfect cleavage like SiC. How tough is it in comparison? Or will it break down nearly as fast?
Due to a little thread necromancy, I will add new info.
Diamond bulk is by the kilogram ($150ish)
SiC bulk is 55# ($80ish)
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richardh
spending too much on rocks
Member since June 2016
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Post by richardh on Sept 30, 2016 17:09:47 GMT -5
No actual knowledge here but wouldn't the diamond grit slowly break its self down as diamond particles interact with each other? If diamond particle concentration is low it would probably be a slow process since probability of these interactions is low but at higher concentrations (possibly the sorts required to get a decent grind) they might be significant.
I would also imagine diamond grit recovery would be significantly less than 100% likely making using it impractical economically.
If you really want to speed your tumbles a grinding wheel might be your best bet.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Oct 1, 2016 7:39:18 GMT -5
These diamonds could easily be recaptured at 2.2 mm(almost 3/32"). Don't think they would ever change in size by quartz gems rolling in a tumbler. They are not sharp like SiC though.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Oct 1, 2016 7:42:40 GMT -5
Don't be surprised if mono-crystal diamonds get bigger and cheaper. Need sharp edges for tumbling.
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richardh
spending too much on rocks
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Post by richardh on Oct 1, 2016 7:59:20 GMT -5
These diamonds could easily be recaptured at 2.2 mm(almost 3/32"). Don't think they would ever change in size by quartz gems rolling in a tumbler. They are not sharp like SiC though. True Quartz shouldn't harm them but they could harm each other.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Oct 1, 2016 8:56:33 GMT -5
Under the tumbling pressures probably not richardhI think diamond cuts diamond only when subjected to extreme pressure. What is surprising is the fact they braze or melt metal to make diamond sintering. Would think the heat of molten metal would crack them. And then diamond sintered wheels can take extreme grinding pressures on rough/hard bouncy surfaces and it does not crack or shatter the little crystals. Must be some durable crystals. Are you down in the basement ? I make metal jewelry in a little shop in my stone wall basement/cellar. Wife calls it the dungeon and me a mole.
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richardh
spending too much on rocks
Member since June 2016
Posts: 391
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Post by richardh on Oct 2, 2016 19:11:40 GMT -5
Under the tumbling pressures probably not richardhI think diamond cuts diamond only when subjected to extreme pressure. What is surprising is the fact they braze or melt metal to make diamond sintering. Would think the heat of molten metal would crack them. And then diamond sintered wheels can take extreme grinding pressures on rough/hard bouncy surfaces and it does not crack or shatter the little crystals. Must be some durable crystals. Are you down in the basement ? I make metal jewelry in a little shop in my stone wall basement/cellar. Wife calls it the dungeon and me a mole. It would be an interesting experiment to see what happens. I wonder why SiC breaks down when it is the hardest material in the tumbler. All of my work is done in the back yard, I'm definitely not allowed to do anything in the house. A basement would be nice but very few houses have them in the Houston, TX area.
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