fireforged
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since December 2015
Posts: 215
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Post by fireforged on Nov 28, 2018 11:32:23 GMT -5
Here is a piece of tiffany stone that I am struggling with to cab. There are many tiny pits in the top that I am trying to get out. By the time I am done there may be more super glue than stone in this piece. I acquired the two small slabs recently and am trying to make something with them. You can see just how pitted and fractured they are. This stuff just makes you tear out your hair and in the end you don't have something you can sell or put in a piece of jewelry.
IMG_0733 by Rodney Mace, on Flickr
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Post by rockpickerforever on Nov 28, 2018 12:15:25 GMT -5
Here is a piece of tiffany stone that I am struggling with to cab. There are many tiny pits in the top that I am trying to get out. By the time I am done there may be more super glue than stone in this piece. I acquired the two small slabs recently and am trying to make something with them. You can see just how pitted and fractured they are. This stuff just makes you tear out your hair and in the end you don't have something you can sell or put in a piece of jewelry.
You don't get them out, you work around them, or fill them. Some material is just not conducive to making good cabs.
Personally, I'd pitch it and get some better material to work. Will save you from tearing your hair out, lol.
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fireforged
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since December 2015
Posts: 215
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Post by fireforged on Nov 28, 2018 12:46:17 GMT -5
I hear you. I guess I am a glutton for punishment. At this point I am just testing my limits.
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mossyrockhound
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since January 2011
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Post by mossyrockhound on Nov 28, 2018 12:58:57 GMT -5
It is not cheap. Also be aware that it is toxic. It is wise to use breathing protection as it is not good to inhale the beryllium that is integral to the stone. I have good luck selling Tiffany but have only ever gotten it through larger estate purchases so do not have a good handle on what it sells for on its own... Maybe check solds on e-bay to get an idea. Bill Yes! Be careful! My Dad died of beryllium poisoning. It is VERY toxic. I have some tiffany stone but won't cut it since my Dad died.
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Post by rockjunquie on Nov 28, 2018 16:39:11 GMT -5
It is not cheap. Also be aware that it is toxic. It is wise to use breathing protection as it is not good to inhale the beryllium that is integral to the stone. I have good luck selling Tiffany but have only ever gotten it through larger estate purchases so do not have a good handle on what it sells for on its own... Maybe check solds on e-bay to get an idea. Bill Yes! Be careful! My Dad died of beryllium poisoning. It is VERY toxic. I have some tiffany stone but won't cut it since my Dad died. Sorry for your loss. I am glad, however, that you chose to share that. It really drives home the need to be safe. The last tiffany I cut, I brainfarted and forgot the mask. I won't do THAT again.
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Tommy
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Member since January 2013
Posts: 12,594
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Post by Tommy on Nov 28, 2018 17:44:42 GMT -5
Yes! Be careful! My Dad died of beryllium poisoning. It is VERY toxic. I have some tiffany stone but won't cut it since my Dad died. I am also sorry for your loss - and this begs the question was your Dad exposed through the lapidary hobbies or did he work around it?
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Tommy
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Post by Tommy on Nov 28, 2018 17:48:59 GMT -5
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gemfeller
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Post by gemfeller on Nov 28, 2018 18:00:49 GMT -5
Supply/demand I guess. Tiffany is attractive material but I think the prices being asked in that shop and elsewhere are insane. Or maybe my sense of values is entirely out of whack with the rest of the consuming world.
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mossyrockhound
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since January 2011
Posts: 1,278
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Post by mossyrockhound on Nov 28, 2018 18:22:28 GMT -5
Yes! Be careful! My Dad died of beryllium poisoning. It is VERY toxic. I have some tiffany stone but won't cut it since my Dad died. I am also sorry for your loss - and this begs the question was your Dad exposed through the lapidary hobbies or did he work around it? Not sure whether or not he worked with it in our shop. I was told he worked around it at the Hanford area (but I can't confirm that because everything he did there was classified). All I know for sure is that experts concluded that it was beryllium that killed him and there was a settlement from the government because of it. It was a horrible death.
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Post by vegasjames on Nov 28, 2018 19:21:05 GMT -5
It is not cheap. Also be aware that it is toxic. It is wise to use breathing protection as it is not good to inhale the beryllium that is integral to the stone. I have good luck selling Tiffany but have only ever gotten it through larger estate purchases so do not have a good handle on what it sells for on its own... Maybe check solds on e-bay to get an idea. Bill Yes! Be careful! My Dad died of beryllium poisoning. It is VERY toxic. I have some tiffany stone but won't cut it since my Dad died. Yes, beryllium is very toxic but there is only traces in Tiffany stone and some Tiffany stone will not have any at all since it so trace in the stone. Something like 0.04%.
I also think it is a lot less toxic bound as a mineral. For example look at the beryls like emerald and aquamarine. These contain beryllium as well but I have never seen any reports of beryllium toxicity from faceting these stones or cabbing Tiffany stone.
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Post by vegasjames on Nov 28, 2018 19:24:15 GMT -5
Supply/demand I guess. Tiffany is attractive material but I think the prices being asked in that shop and elsewhere are insane. Or maybe my sense of values is entirely out of whack with the rest of the consuming world. I agree, but this goes back to my point if their trying to maintain the illusion that it is more rare than it really is. That is why they rarely mention the other places that it has been found and carefully word it that the only place it is "mined" is Brush-Wellman mine. Just because that is the only active mine mining it does not mean it is the only place it is found.
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Post by vegasjames on Nov 28, 2018 19:27:01 GMT -5
I am also sorry for your loss - and this begs the question was your Dad exposed through the lapidary hobbies or did he work around it? Not sure whether or not he worked with it in our shop. I was told he worked around it at the Hanford area (but I can't confirm that because everything he did there was classified). All I know for sure is that experts concluded that it was beryllium that killed him and there was a settlement from the government because of it. It was a horrible death. Hanford was a major radiation test site on the general population for a long time. The government was deliberately releasing radioactive gas from Hanford for over 50 years to test the effects on the general population before the testing was exposed. If I recall right this got exposed in the media sometime in the early 90s.
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mossyrockhound
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since January 2011
Posts: 1,278
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Post by mossyrockhound on Nov 28, 2018 21:33:58 GMT -5
Not sure whether or not he worked with it in our shop. I was told he worked around it at the Hanford area (but I can't confirm that because everything he did there was classified). All I know for sure is that experts concluded that it was beryllium that killed him and there was a settlement from the government because of it. It was a horrible death. Hanford was a major radiation test site on the general population for a long time. The government was deliberately releasing radioactive gas from Hanford for over 50 years to test the effects on the general population before the testing was exposed. If I recall right this got exposed in the media sometime in the early 90s. You're right. My siblings and I are official "down-winders". I think that's what's wrong with me - at least partially (joking). I still get letters from the government about this, but I have never responded.
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Post by beefjello on Nov 29, 2018 19:01:27 GMT -5
It is not cheap. Also be aware that it is toxic. It is wise to use breathing protection as it is not good to inhale the beryllium that is integral to the stone. I have good luck selling Tiffany but have only ever gotten it through larger estate purchases so do not have a good handle on what it sells for on its own... Maybe check solds on e-bay to get an idea. Bill Yes! Be careful! My Dad died of beryllium poisoning. It is VERY toxic. I have some tiffany stone but won't cut it since my Dad died. Wow, sorry to hear.. that's scary!
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Post by beefjello on Nov 29, 2018 19:04:48 GMT -5
Super drool worthy pix.. but carrrrazzzy-assed price tags there!!
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Post by beefjello on Nov 29, 2018 19:15:23 GMT -5
My little contributions to this thread.. A cool and different little Tiffany slab that gemfeller gifted me a few years back.. I cut this cab from it A 6 lb beauty I bought from a member here years ago It just sits waiting for me to polish it. Bought this from an old Utah rockhound's estate long ago. I was told it's ore from a beryllium mine (bertrandite). Very heavy chunk (60 plus lb) and very purple. I have yet to cut it.. not sure I ever will.
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Post by vegasjames on Nov 29, 2018 20:13:21 GMT -5
My little contributions to this thread.. A cool and different little Tiffany slab that gemfeller gifted me a few years back.. I cut this cab from it A 6 lb beauty I bought from a member here years ago It just sits waiting for me to polish it. Bought this from an old Utah rockhound's estate long ago. I was told it's ore from a beryllium mine (bertrandite). Very heavy chunk (60 plus lb) and very purple. I have yet to cut it.. not sure I ever will. Some great pieces there. Really like that cab.
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Post by rockjunquie on Nov 29, 2018 20:17:04 GMT -5
Hanford was a major radiation test site on the general population for a long time. The government was deliberately releasing radioactive gas from Hanford for over 50 years to test the effects on the general population before the testing was exposed. If I recall right this got exposed in the media sometime in the early 90s. You're right. My siblings and I are official "down-winders". I think that's what's wrong with me - at least partially (joking). I still get letters from the government about this, but I have never responded. Holy Moley! That's wild! My God, that has to weigh heavy on you with every little symptom of whatever. How does that make you feel- your own government doing that to you? SMH. Amazing that that happened. My siblings and I used to watch the crop dusters in our backyard. We used to live in the middle of a bunch of fields in the mid 60's. The bi planes used to fly up and over the huge redwoods dividing the fields and fly right by us with their pesticide foggers wide open. Us kids loved it and mom never knew any better. I often wonder what all that ddt and such did to us long term.
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mossyrockhound
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since January 2011
Posts: 1,278
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Post by mossyrockhound on Nov 29, 2018 22:05:37 GMT -5
You're right. My siblings and I are official "down-winders". I think that's what's wrong with me - at least partially (joking). I still get letters from the government about this, but I have never responded. Holy Moley! That's wild! My God, that has to weigh heavy on you with every little symptom of whatever. How does that make you feel- your own government doing that to you? SMH. Amazing that that happened. My siblings and I used to watch the crop dusters in our backyard. We used to live in the middle of a bunch of fields in the mid 60's. The bi planes used to fly up and over the huge redwoods dividing the fields and fly right by us with their pesticide foggers wide open. Us kids loved it and mom never knew any better. I often wonder what all that ddt and such did to us long term. Actually, I just forget about what the gov't did to us. However, I've been left with a VERY strong distrust of our government, at least those working in the AEC/NRC. The locals also used to run the DDT sprayers up and down our streets to kill mosquitos. We used to run behind the trucks because you couldn't see us in that thick fog (and us kids thought that was neat!). Amazing that we're still alive isn't it? All that said, the Tiffany stone is very pretty (and overpriced). I just don't want to work any of it.
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Post by vegasjames on Nov 29, 2018 22:27:31 GMT -5
You're right. My siblings and I are official "down-winders". I think that's what's wrong with me - at least partially (joking). I still get letters from the government about this, but I have never responded. Holy Moley! That's wild! My God, that has to weigh heavy on you with every little symptom of whatever. How does that make you feel- your own government doing that to you? SMH. Amazing that that happened. My siblings and I used to watch the crop dusters in our backyard. We used to live in the middle of a bunch of fields in the mid 60's. The bi planes used to fly up and over the huge redwoods dividing the fields and fly right by us with their pesticide foggers wide open. Us kids loved it and mom never knew any better. I often wonder what all that ddt and such did to us long term. Here is an article on the experiments:
Not the only time the U.S. government has tested hazardous substances on its own citizens. There is testing of the effects of radiation on military and civilians from the above ground testing here in Southern Nevada as Yucca Flat, the biological warfare experiments on U.S. cities with synthetic bacteria in the 50s. The LSD testing on prisoners and military personnel in the 60s on. The Tuskegee, Alabama syphilis experiments, etc, etc, etc.
Even the "AIDS virus" was manufactured by the U.S. government. The request for its production is in the Senate Subcommittee Hearings for Chemical Biological Warfare Appropriations for 1970, Part 6, July 1, 1969 page 1. In regard to this man-made virus they state in this document:
"Most important of these is that it might be refractory to the immunological and therapeutic processes upon which we depend to maintain our relative freedom from upon which we depend to maintain our relative freedom from infectious disease".
When finished it was supplied to the World Health Organization (WHO), under Article IX of the treaty banning biological warfare agents that allowed exchange for "peaceful purposes". The WHO was also working on producing synthetic viruses to selectively wipe out the immune system by wiping out T4 cells (CD4), B cells or antibodies. HIV is believed to wipe out CD4 cells by wiping out CD4 cells. In their documents published in the Bulletin of the WHO 1972 and a Federation Proceedings 1972 article co- sponsored by the WHO they discussed not only producing these synthetic viruses but introducing them through "routine vaccinations" in humans focusing on "sibships" (brothers and sisters and "families". Africa was chosen for the testing of these synthetic viruses because they were looking for a "clean genetic pool", thus little outside genetic mixing and this is where they were conducting their Expanded Program on Immunization (EPI) for the introduction of these viruses through the contaminated vaccines. AIDS appeared in 18 countries all at the same time and all of these countries were participating in the EPI. During the EPI there were also outbreaks of weaponized versions of Ebola, Marburg's disease and Lassa fever that all disappeared on their own after the vaccine program was halted. There are no vaccines or cures for these viruses so there disappearance can only be linked to the halting of the introduction of these viruses through the vaccines that the WHO had been told several times previously were contaminated by these vaccines. The link between the outbreak of AIDS and the vaccines made front page news around the world except for the U.S. References:
Request for the "AIDS virus" by the U.S. government:
Hearings Before a Subcommittee of the Committee on Appropriations House of Representatives "Synthetic Biological Agents" Tu., July 1, 1969 Part 6 page 1. I went to the university library's government documents division and copied this request for the production of the virus.
Discussion of production of synthetic viruses and introduction through vaccines in routine human vaccinations by the WHO:
Virus-Associated Immunopathology: Animal Models and Implications for Human Disease Part 1
Biological Significance of Histocompatibility Antigens v31 Fed Proc, 1972 pp. 1087-1104 In this article as part of their discussion on introducing the synthetic viruses they write:
"One would be to study the HL-A type defined bacterial and viral antigens during preventative vaccination".
These documents can be found in the medical library.
All stored blood samples taken before the start of the EPI showed no AIDS virus. Yet the people who these blood samples were taken from developed AIDS after receiving the WHO's smallpox vaccines during the EPI. During the EPI 100 million Africans and 14,000 Haitian workers were given the contaminated vaccines.
The next test site was the United States. The vaccine trial here used experimental hepatitis vaccines and the trial was headed by a Russian doctor named Wolf Szmuness. Szmuness left Russia in 1968 and a year later when this all started was appointed the head of the New York City Blood Bank, the largest blood bank in the world. So how does a Russian doctor get appointed the head of the world's largest blood bank in the U.S. a year after leaving Russia in the middle of the Cold War?
Szmuness was the one who chose the homosexuals for the experiment stating that they were easy to access, had been eager volunteers in previous experiments and there would not be an uproar when they start dying. Under his parameters to be a volunteer the test subjects had to be gay or bisexual, monogamous, no previous exposure to hepatitis B and had to BE UNDER THE AGE OF 40. I emphasize the last part for a very good reason. Under the original definition of AIDS by the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) the CDC clearly stated that if the person was over the age of 40 they could not have AIDS. So how did they come to this conclusion when this was a completely new syndrome that they supposedly knew nothing about including contractability yet they are claiming that people could not have AIDS if over the age of 40?
The first study in 1978 was conducted in New York. In 1980 more tests were run in Los Angeles, San Francisco, Chicago, Denver and St. Louis that are all the original hot spots for AIDS in the U.S.
By the end of the study in 1984 56% of the test subjects had full blown AIDS. Keep in mind that when doing a study roughly 50% of the test subjects get whatever is being tested and roughly 50% a placebo. So it is not surprising that 56% of the test subjects ended up with AIDS.
This link between the outbreak of AIDS in the vaccine recipients was reported in the Journal of the American Medical Association . Interestingly I coped these from the medical journals when the link was first reported. But I have since tried finding these same articles on PubMed and when I went to go look for them they were nowhere to be found.:
Human T-Cell Lymphotropic Virus Type III infection in a Cohort of Homosexual Men in New York City
There is still tons more evidence of the AIDS virus being man-made and not from a monkey. The SIV virus is not even closely related to HIV with only around 40% of the genetic markers for HIV. Viruses do not suddenly jump from 40% to 100%. More like 40.1%, 40.2%, 40.3%......... So where are all the intermediate viral strains if it came from a monkey? They don't exist. Why did the form of KS in the US start showing up in Africa instead of the form of KS in Africa showing up in the US showing movement of the virus from the US to Africa? Why didn't we have AIDS previously being that green monkey kidneys were used long before AIDS in the manufacturing of penicillin and some human vaccines? How did AIDS appear in 18 countries all at the same time? Did the monkey really get around that much?.................
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