ethos
starting to shine!
Member since February 2020
Posts: 28
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Post by ethos on Feb 8, 2020 23:57:39 GMT -5
I have had a few runs turn like almost 100% foam consistency, i have tried the borax solution and it turns it to a soapy watery consistency, not sure if this is the intended end result or not. any advice would be appreciated.
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Post by RocksInNJ on Feb 9, 2020 8:03:34 GMT -5
There’s a recent thread about this that may help, but have you tried less water?
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Post by knave on Feb 9, 2020 9:39:17 GMT -5
Try 2 TBSP/ LB of rough grit Water to bottom of top layer 1 TBSP borax
Let it run for a full week before you check on it. Good luck, knave
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Fossilman
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2009
Posts: 20,676
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Post by Fossilman on Feb 9, 2020 10:00:40 GMT -5
Sometimes its the material that makes the stages foam up... What stages are doing this?
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ethos
starting to shine!
Member since February 2020
Posts: 28
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Post by ethos on Feb 9, 2020 12:47:48 GMT -5
it has done it in stage 1, 2 and 3 (only happened once on 3 when i redid the prepolish and polish stages because the first batch of grit i got was a gift from family that was only silicon carbide that goes 60, 150, 500 and 1000 and i didnt know until i had purchased my new lortone tumbler). it turned super foamy when i did my first batch of red and blue tigers eye.
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ethos
starting to shine!
Member since February 2020
Posts: 28
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Post by ethos on Feb 9, 2020 12:50:14 GMT -5
There’s a recent thread about this that may help, but have you tried less water? I have tried less water but i didn't go with to much less as i was following the Lortone instruction manual so i was already below the top layer of rocks and was worried using to little would be just as bad as to much, well minus the fact that its easier to add than to remove lol.
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Post by Starguy on Feb 9, 2020 14:09:30 GMT -5
ethosI only use borax as a cleaner/burnisher after the polish is complete. The borax powder I use creates a very thick foam. All other stages, I use only rocks grit and water. I will use plastic pellets as cushioning in stages 2 through polish.
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
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Post by jamesp on Feb 9, 2020 14:59:15 GMT -5
If you add clay or clay based kitty litter to thicken the slurry it will often stop the watery slurry from splashing about internally and causing bubbles. Any detergent is asking for foam. Dyed rocks can foam. Is blue tigereye dyed ? Another common reason for foam is mixing alkaline rocks with acidic water(most common) or vice versa and causing a common ph reaction. For instance I tumbled concrete. My tap water is acid ph 6. As the concrete grinds the slurry went from alkaline ph 7.5 to ph 12. In 4 hours the cap was ready to blow off. Added a lot of baking soda to the water BEFORE adding the water to the concrete chunks and all went well because I was mixing alkaline water with alkaline (rocks) concrete. And there is probably 592 different chemical reactions that could be blamed for foam too lol. I also tumble lots of highly alkaline petrified coral. I have to add baking soda to the ph 6 slurry water BEFORE adding it with the coral to avoid similar reaction. I got to where I just add a bit of water with no abrasive and tumbled the soft lime alkaline skin off the silicified neutral ph coral under the skin. This is the results of removing the lime coating after a day rolling
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ethos
starting to shine!
Member since February 2020
Posts: 28
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Post by ethos on Feb 9, 2020 15:01:30 GMT -5
ethos I only use borax as a cleaner/burnisher after the polish is complete. The borax powder I use creates a very thick foam. All other stages, I use only rocks grit and water. I will use plastic pellets as cushioning in stages 2 through polish. I only tried it because i had searched other posts on the site and that was what some people had recommended was adding a tablespoon of borax to fix the foam.
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stewdogg
spending too much on rocks
Member since January 2020
Posts: 388
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Post by stewdogg on Feb 10, 2020 9:16:12 GMT -5
I was the one with the foam issues lately. I did find that the solution for me was to use much less water (I’m still only on stage 1 coarse) and a tablespoon of dry sweep/kitty litter. I filled the water to about the half way mark of the rock fill. Another thing I did was to use filtered water. Our tap water smells strongly of chlorine and I’m sure there’s other things in the water that throw off the Ph balance of the mix off. Good luck and just keep experimenting till you find the correct solution.
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Post by joshuamcduffie on Feb 10, 2020 10:20:48 GMT -5
I really don't think that the foam is a problem. I feel like the grit sticks to it.
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Feb 10, 2020 11:49:39 GMT -5
I really don't think that the foam is a problem. I feel like the grit sticks to it. Yep Joshua it can slow the grind in my experience. 60/90 may very well stick but 46 and 30 and larger needs a dense heavy slurry to keep it suspended high in the barrel where most of the grinding takes place. Foam reduces slurry density. I have had too many slow grinds when foam was present. Just my opinion. And science of particle suspension in mining slurries(colloidal/kaolin clay slurries for target particle extraction in mining applications).
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Post by knave on Feb 10, 2020 11:58:17 GMT -5
jamesp Frac sand is round and gets injected at extreme pressures to hold open the fissures deep underground. Some premium and valuable sand is mined in my home county. But the shipping is the killer. We don’t have oil here. They grade and screen the particle sizes and clean the dirt out and then dry the sand. So you end up with nearly perfect round silica balls of equal size.
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Post by joshuamcduffie on Feb 10, 2020 12:56:17 GMT -5
I really don't think that the foam is a problem. I feel like the grit sticks to it. Yep Joshua it can slow the grind in my experience. 60/90 may very well stick but 46 and 30 and larger needs a dense heavy slurry to keep it suspended high in the barrel where most of the grinding takes place. Foam reduces slurry density. I have had too many slow grinds when foam was present. Just my opinion. And science of particle suspension in mining slurries(colloidal/kaolin clay slurries for target particle extraction in mining applications). That's my problem, I haven't used big enough grit yet! I am meaning to order some 46/70 SiC. I'm finding that using the bigger tumbler I'm demolishing the 60/90 SiC to the point where it doesn't have any gritty feel when I clean it out.
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Feb 10, 2020 14:12:16 GMT -5
Yep Joshua it can slow the grind in my experience. 60/90 may very well stick but 46 and 30 and larger needs a dense heavy slurry to keep it suspended high in the barrel where most of the grinding takes place. Foam reduces slurry density. I have had too many slow grinds when foam was present. Just my opinion. And science of particle suspension in mining slurries(colloidal/kaolin clay slurries for target particle extraction in mining applications). That's my problem, I haven't used big enough grit yet! I am meaning to order some 46/70 SiC. I'm finding that using the bigger tumbler I'm demolishing the 60/90 SiC to the point where it doesn't have any gritty feel when I clean it out. I was hoping you would say that. I went down the line, started at 80, then 60, then 46 then 30. Now running 10 and bigger using poly barrels. The finger test you did is dead accurate. Move to bigger barrels(and/or higher speeds) and you see how quickly the grit gets eaten. Way faster if you add a 1/2 to 1 pound rock in the mix. The 10 grit or bigger takes you into a time release situation where it takes a long time to break down.
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Feb 10, 2020 14:21:42 GMT -5
jamesp Frac sand is round and gets injected at extreme pressures to hold open the fissures deep underground. Some premium and valuable sand is mined in my home county. But the shipping is the killer. We don’t have oil here. They grade and screen the particle sizes and clean the dirt out and then dry the sand. So you end up with nearly perfect round silica balls of equal size. Never knew such existed. I know river sand is mined for rounder sand for mortar to make troweling easier.. And crushed granite sand is for interlocking strength in concrete with Portland.called sharp sand. Had to look it up. Check out these little round babies. Frack sand. I want a tiny sling shot now. Perhaps a glacier product ?
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victor1941
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since November 2011
Posts: 1,974
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Post by victor1941 on Feb 10, 2020 14:31:47 GMT -5
Just a note that frac sand is not only mined but is a major industry in central Texas because of it's use in the oil and gas industry.
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Post by joshuamcduffie on Feb 10, 2020 15:15:03 GMT -5
Has anyone ever tried the "Grit Saver" or "Grit Miser" product? I see it available at Johnson Brothers for $5/lb. You mix 4 parts grit with 1 part Grit Saver. The claim is that:
"Saves on Grit cost Makes Grit-slurry cling to workpiece Faster process time Easy to clean & wash off the parts"
Anyone have any experience with this product?
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Post by knave on Feb 10, 2020 16:03:24 GMT -5
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Post by knave on Feb 10, 2020 16:04:28 GMT -5
Has anyone ever tried the "Grit Saver" or "Grit Miser" product? I see it available at Johnson Brothers for $5/lb. You mix 4 parts grit with 1 part Grit Saver. The claim is that: "Saves on Grit cost Makes Grit-slurry cling to workpiece Faster process time Easy to clean & wash off the parts" Anyone have any experience with this product? How does a $5/lb product save on grit cost?
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