reeniebeany
starting to spend too much on rocks
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Member since January 2020
Posts: 125
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Post by reeniebeany on Jun 6, 2020 20:58:05 GMT -5
Hopefully the pictures will come across, I just signed up for the Cloudinary thing. My DH pulled a very large, very old stump out of the back yard with the excavator. I was on big rock and root cleanup duty. I picked up this chunk thinking it was garbage left by the previous occupants. (We have picked up bags of garbage and broken stuff out of the woods!) It turned out to be 4.2 pounds of blue/purple rock. We are about 1.25 miles across the DNR from the Cadman High Rock quarry as the raven flies (we have ravens not crows). I am stilling trying to learn about the rocks around here, but I am guessing it is some kind of agate. We get lots of smaller pieces in the 2 inch crushed clear rock we get from Cadman. Part of the rock is covered with this cement like layer. It is friable enough that I can scrape it off with a metal pick, but it is tedious and I don't want to scratch it. (Or slip and gouge myself - more likely.) My question: If I had a vibratory tumbler, could I use it to get that layer off? I don't want to cut it, and it sure isn't going to fit in my 3 pound tumbler. And I like it square, don't want it round. A number of the rocks around here have spots or layers of the brown cement like dirt. I also have a lot of rocks (mostly from Cadman) that I don't want round, but I do want shiny.
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jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Jun 6, 2020 22:03:45 GMT -5
Tumblers are perfect for removing softer coatings from hard rocks. Try road gravel for your cleaning media and use no abrasives. You should be pleasantly surprised. It all depends on the softness of that brown coating as to your level of success.
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quartz
Cave Dweller
breakin' rocks in the hot sun
Member since February 2010
Posts: 3,340
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Post by quartz on Jun 6, 2020 22:34:39 GMT -5
I have had good result using a hand held engraver for this sort of project, mine is fairly old and is somewhat like a mini jackhammer compared to the new ones I've seen. There might be good ones out there. This would depend on the hardness of the material as mentioned above, soft stuff may well tumble off, second step would be the engraver. That is a nice chunk of rock.
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reeniebeany
starting to spend too much on rocks
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Member since January 2020
Posts: 125
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Post by reeniebeany on Jun 7, 2020 10:08:14 GMT -5
Thanks! Hand engraver sounds like a plan. And cheaper than a vibratory tumbler, since I don't have one yet. This rock is much more blue than what we usually get out of Cadman. Most of those have layers that are more purple. This guy has amber, purple and blue in various levels of translucency. Some day, when things are back more normal, I can join a rock club and learn more about what I am looking at.
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Post by aDave on Jun 7, 2020 12:05:50 GMT -5
Do you have any acid around to see if a drop will cause the material to fizz? If it does, a diluted solution can be used to soak. If you don't have acid, see if you can get a reaction with vinegar. Then go from there.
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gatorflash1
spending too much on rocks
Active in Delaware Mineralogical Society, Cabchon Grinding and Polishing, 2 Thumlers B's and a UV-18
Member since October 2018
Posts: 375
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Post by gatorflash1 on Jun 7, 2020 12:59:35 GMT -5
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reeniebeany
starting to spend too much on rocks
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Posts: 125
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Post by reeniebeany on Jun 7, 2020 18:54:26 GMT -5
Do you have any acid around to see if a drop will cause the material to fizz? If it does, a diluted solution can be used to soak. If you don't have acid, see if you can get a reaction with vinegar. Then go from there. Hmmmm Citric acid, lactic acid, oxalic acid, acetic acid (vinegar), maleic acid off the top of my head. I also have citric in the form of citrisurf metal cleaner. I see I need to brush up on my chemistry!!
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Post by aDave on Jun 7, 2020 20:22:49 GMT -5
Do you have any acid around to see if a drop will cause the material to fizz? If it does, a diluted solution can be used to soak. If you don't have acid, see if you can get a reaction with vinegar. Then go from there. Hmmmm Citric acid, lactic acid, oxalic acid, acetic acid (vinegar), maleic acid off the top of my head. I also have citric in the form of citrisurf metal cleaner. I see I need to brush up on my chemistry!! Sorry, I guess I wasn't specific. I was thinking more along the lines of diluted muriatic if you had it laying around for a pool. I used vinegar to soak a bunch of pet wood that we got a few years ago. It worked well on the matrix that encrusted it, but the standard stuff you can buy at the market was a bit weak (5-6% if I recall correctly), so I found some industrial (30%) vinegar on Amazon. It's a bit pricey for a gallon, but I wanted to work with that instead of muriatic. You might not want to spend over $20/gallon for one rock, but it could be an option for you if you find that it might work. Just soak and walk away.
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whyofquartz
spending too much on rocks
So, Africa is smaller than I expected...
Member since December 2019
Posts: 316
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Post by whyofquartz on Jun 8, 2020 10:29:16 GMT -5
Hmmmm Citric acid, lactic acid, oxalic acid, acetic acid (vinegar), maleic acid off the top of my head. I also have citric in the form of citrisurf metal cleaner. I see I need to brush up on my chemistry!! Sorry, I guess I wasn't specific. I was thinking more along the lines of diluted muriatic if you had it laying around for a pool. I used vinegar to soak a bunch of pet wood that we got a few years ago. It worked well on the matrix that encrusted it, but the standard stuff you can buy at the market was a bit weak (5-6% if I recall correctly), so I found some industrial (30%) vinegar on Amazon. It's a bit pricey for a gallon, but I wanted to work with that instead of muriatic. You might not want to spend over $20/gallon for one rock, but it could be an option for you if you find that it might work. Just soak and walk away. I was able to find pickling vinegar which is 9% for about the same price as regular white vinegar at the grocery store here in Texas. I need to get more, I have lots of rocks to de-lime
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reeniebeany
starting to spend too much on rocks
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Post by reeniebeany on Jun 8, 2020 10:30:55 GMT -5
We might have muriatic, we inherited a lot of stuff from an Uncle who was a machinist, gunsmith, and all round talented guy. Concentrated acetic I am pretty sure we don't have, store vinegar ranges between 4-5 %.
The lactic I have is food grade 88% and will burn unprotected skin, so it might show a reaction if there is one to be had.
This is very interesting and I appreciate the input from everyone!
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reeniebeany
starting to spend too much on rocks
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Member since January 2020
Posts: 125
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Post by reeniebeany on Jun 17, 2020 15:30:17 GMT -5
Do you have any acid around to see if a drop will cause the material to fizz? If it does, a diluted solution can be used to soak. If you don't have acid, see if you can get a reaction with vinegar. Then go from there. No apparent reaction with lactic acid or vinegar. But dang! I am having a great time cleaning up some of the sparkly rocks that have a thin calcite layer on top. I am going to go back to my second string pile and start soaking those puppies. THANKS for the tip. My DH found me an ancient Burgess vibra tool that was my uncle's. I will strap on the safety glasses and give that a whirl too. Ultimately, I may hold the bulk of the work till the hubby can help me make a tumbler with a big pvc barrel. We have been working on re-plumbing some of our new (to us) house. I have been eyeballing the parts when we go to the home store... Though we did just get a new wet masonry saw and it might make a nice paperweight...too many options.....
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Post by pauls on Jun 17, 2020 17:03:33 GMT -5
Good for you, Try Oxalic acid in your chemical arsenal for cleaning rocks, it's great for rust stains.
That's great about your Tile saw, my tile saw regularly transitions from tile saw to rock saw and back again, though I think (hope) I have finished cutting tiles so it has a nice thin Lapidary blade on it now.
Make yourself a tumbler, it is a easy, cheap project to do and will give you a lot of satisfaction. There are heaps of tumbler build threads here if you need to see what others have done and we are always willing to help if you have a question.
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reeniebeany
starting to spend too much on rocks
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Member since January 2020
Posts: 125
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Post by reeniebeany on Jun 17, 2020 19:48:09 GMT -5
I have used Oxalic on a stone with iron stain in the past. I use it to bleach wood, or remove iron stains from wood, so I tried it on a stone that picked up rust from an adjacent stone.
Does the bleaching effect happen on rocks other than iron or rust stains?
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Post by pauls on Jun 18, 2020 1:42:35 GMT -5
Oxalic doesn't bleach stones, it just chemically alters the iron to a soluble form.
I love that purple stone keep us updated when you do something with it.
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kyoti
has rocks in the head
Member since June 2020
Posts: 542
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Post by kyoti on Jun 20, 2020 8:23:18 GMT -5
If you ever want to try muriatic acid but don't want to deal with the storage or rust problems associated with it you can try this. I've had good luck using it to do acid polishing on harder stone like Agate or quartz. .
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