chassroc
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Post by chassroc on Aug 28, 2013 12:50:33 GMT -5
I read an interesting article with the premise, "Let Congress decide whether to go to war with Syria".
What a smart and crafty move that would be for Obama. Dump it in Congress's lap and let them decide.
Obama's been trying to keep us out of the Middle East where there are land mines in every American move.
Democracy basically means more government by the religion of peace.
We get blamed for the action we take and we get blamed for those we don't take.
But the pressure for action this time is extreme; whatever action we take will cost money and lives.
And there is always the possibility of getting sucked into a Global conflict.
The President has been smart to let others spout the Moral Outrage rhetoric, but he will likely have to take some action to prevent the spread of Chemical Warfare and Dirty Bombs. I'd prefer he did not, but I dont see how he can ignore what is going on.
The smart course of action would be to let Congress debate and decide if it is worth taking action. It would likely draw the country together as the country would have to back the President when action is finally taken. It would be similar to what Bush and Cheney did leading up to their invasion of Iraq. There was intense pressure for members of Congress to back the administration to show Saddam we meant business. If you didn't back Bush and Cheney you were branded unpatriotic ,cowardly, and un-american. The smart money bet that you fell in line with the administration or you were run out of town.
If Congress dictates that action is needed the President gets a mandate to unite America.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2013 13:00:20 GMT -5
and if he fails to get that mandate? Then what?
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chassroc
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Post by chassroc on Aug 28, 2013 13:05:17 GMT -5
He wins
He has done a good job staying out of the regional conflicts and has no desire to get sucked in here
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2013 13:14:01 GMT -5
If he attacks Syria without congressional mandate, he wins?
Seems Ofama can do no wrong, ever, under any circumstance.
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grayfingers
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Post by grayfingers on Aug 28, 2013 13:15:48 GMT -5
He wins He has done a good job staying out of the regional conflicts and has no desire to get sucked in here Well whaddya know, he even talks about nation building, forcing democracy on them. . .
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chassroc
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Post by chassroc on Aug 28, 2013 13:29:52 GMT -5
If he attacks Syria without congressional mandate, he wins? Seems Ofama can do no wrong, ever, under any circumstance. no ... if he leaves it to Congress and Congress does not give him a mandate, he does not interfere ... he wins, Congress dithers charlie
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2013 13:33:41 GMT -5
So then, you agree with me that if he "interfere's" without a mandate from congress, then he is not so smart.
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chassroc
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Post by chassroc on Aug 28, 2013 13:36:50 GMT -5
Bill...hard to understand you...did you actually view the video you posted? Not a single mention of nation building Not a single mention of forcing democracy on them(and no mention of Obama's birth certificate either)
He talks about Humanitarian aid - food , shelter and medicine to refugees
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2013 13:43:36 GMT -5
@0:58 push for a democratic Syria without Assad....
sounds like nation building too me.
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grayfingers
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Post by grayfingers on Aug 28, 2013 14:00:22 GMT -5
Yup, Actually, he said "Push for the Transformation to a democratic Syria" Gotta love that word. Seems like that was what Bush said about Iraq, no? And if memory serves, that was deemed by the left to be all that, and more.
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Don
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Post by Don on Aug 28, 2013 14:01:06 GMT -5
Isn't the president constitutionally obligated to go through congress for this kind of thing anyway?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2013 14:07:57 GMT -5
Isn't the president constitutionally obligated to go through congress for this kind of thing anyway? Ofama is a constitutional scholar, how could he ever do anything un-constitutional? How could you even consider questioning his authority? Actually Don, it seems to me that the actual goal is to end the USA as we know it, destroy the constitution and that pesky second amendment. Those in power then step in and start a new "transformation democracy" with an entirely new constitution. One that is likely already written and will be lacking the basic human right to self defense using centuries old technology. Firearms. The path is now becoming clear. Attack Syria, piss off Russia/China get bogged down in a war that bankrupts us.... the rest is simple......
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Post by helens on Aug 28, 2013 14:27:08 GMT -5
What 'war' with Syria? All we're talking about are a couple of missile strikes, hit a few munitions dumps so they don't have them, which amounts to a slap on the wrist. They do this every day over there to each other. War REQUIRES an Act by Congress. We aren't even close to war.
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Don
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Post by Don on Aug 28, 2013 14:42:05 GMT -5
so launching missiles into another country, destroying facilities and killing people isn't an act of war? What was 9/11 then, a howdy doody from Al Qaeda?
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grayfingers
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Post by grayfingers on Aug 28, 2013 14:42:54 GMT -5
(4) the term “act of war” means any act occurring in the course of— (A) declared war; (B) armed conflict, whether or not war has been declared, between two or more nations; or (C) armed conflict between military forces of any origin. . . www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2331
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Post by helens on Aug 28, 2013 14:55:50 GMT -5
Armed conflict whether or not war has been declared requires 2 sides fighting.
Bombing is 1 sided.
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Don
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Post by Don on Aug 28, 2013 15:05:06 GMT -5
the people dying won't think so.
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grayfingers
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Post by grayfingers on Aug 28, 2013 15:11:44 GMT -5
Wiki says, War is an organised and often prolonged armed conflict that is carried out by states or non-state actors. It is characterized by extreme violence, social disruption, and economic destruction. War should be understood as an actual, intentional and widespread armed conflict between political communities, and therefore is defined as a form of political violence or intervention. The set of techniques used by a group to carry out war is known as warfare. An absence of war is usually called peace.
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chassroc
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Post by chassroc on Aug 28, 2013 15:15:24 GMT -5
@0:58 push for a democratic Syria without Assad.... sounds like nation building too me. Not to me..sounds like American priciples
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2013 15:18:01 GMT -5
Merriam Websterwar intransitive verb warred war·ring Definition of WAR 1: to be in active or vigorous conflict 2: to engage in warfarewar·fare noun \ˈwȯr-ˌfer\ Definition of WARFARE 1: military operations between enemies : hostilities, war; also : an activity undertaken by a political unit (as a nation) to weaken or destroy another <economic warfare> 2: struggle between competing entities :
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