|
Post by tims on May 15, 2017 22:04:08 GMT -5
Big storm tonight and the power went out momentarily. I had to run some errands but luckily thought to check my QT-12 before leaving, and it was sitting motionless ... motor whining but not rolling. I reset the barrel and it seems ok, but it got me to thinking, what if it happened when i was asleep or away from the house for hours?
Anyway, does anyone have an economical solution for this situation? I've considered a UPS but i wouldn't trust an inexpensive one to power the tumbler for long, and i don't want to spend hundreds of dollars. Unplugging the tumbler at night and when i'm out of the house also isn't appealing. What do you seasoned vets do to protect your tumblers from a temporary outage?
|
|
quartz
Cave Dweller
breakin' rocks in the hot sun
Member since February 2010
Posts: 3,341
|
Post by quartz on May 15, 2017 22:31:00 GMT -5
Have a look at start buttons on clothes dryers, they are a simple mag switch. Mine is rated 15 Amp / 1/2 hp. Easy to mount and wire up.
|
|
|
Post by tims on May 16, 2017 0:37:40 GMT -5
I found a GFCI cord with manual reset that is my price range. Here's the Amazon link with RTH affiliate code (i think): Inline GFCI Cord.
|
|
|
Post by MrMike on May 16, 2017 4:47:35 GMT -5
I found a GFCI cord with manual reset that is my price range. Here's the Amazon link with RTH affiliate code (i think): Inline GFCI Cord.Don't think GFCIs will trip due to power loss although I'm no electrician. Go with quartz Larry's suggestion of a start button/switch.
|
|
Wooferhound
Cave Dweller
Lortone QT66 and 3A
Member since December 2016
Posts: 1,423
|
Post by Wooferhound on May 16, 2017 8:06:35 GMT -5
You need to put Oil on your tumbler once a month.
|
|
|
Post by youp50 on May 16, 2017 11:27:25 GMT -5
Not a seasoned vet, you did get me thinking though.
There are many switches available in the 3 or 4 dollar range. Low voltage protection switches. As in the dryer switch. You push a button, complete a circuit, energize a magnetic coil, close the contacts, tumbler tumbles. Power goes away, magnetic coil de-energizes, contacts open, tumbler will not tumble until you reset the switch.
My build will include a micro switch on the cabinet doors. It will keep little fingers from pinch points inside the cabinet. The micro switch I will use will also open on loss of power and need to be reset. More inline with the price of a GFCI, than a magnetic switch.
|
|
unclesoska
freely admits to licking rocks
All those jade boulders tossed in search of gold!
Member since February 2011
Posts: 934
|
Post by unclesoska on May 16, 2017 11:45:02 GMT -5
The motors for the QT/12 run hot by design. When power is lost, the motor stops. Once power is restored, motor will run, but due to the heavy load (QT12)may not start the barrel rolling again. It just needs a push. On the other hand, if power is restored and the motor isn't humming, it's the thermal overload that shut the motor down when it got TOO hot. Solution: Unplug motor, allow to cool all the way down, plug it back in , give barrel a push and you're back in business.
|
|
|
Post by tims on May 16, 2017 19:47:16 GMT -5
I found a GFCI cord with manual reset that is my price range. Here's the Amazon link with RTH affiliate code (i think): Inline GFCI Cord.Don't think GFCIs will trip due to power loss although I'm no electrician. Go with quartz Larry's suggestion of a start button/switch. The reviews on this state that it trips on power loss, and I see many people in the comments stating that they bought it for just this purpose. It would also be handy for other equipment so i'm gonna give it a shot.
|
|
|
Post by tims on May 16, 2017 19:52:25 GMT -5
The motors for the QT/12 run hot by design. When power is lost, the motor stops. Once power is restored, motor will run, but due to the heavy load (QT12)may not start the barrel rolling again. It just needs a push. On the other hand, if power is restored and the motor isn't humming, it's the thermal overload that shut the motor down when it got TOO hot. Solution: Unplug motor, allow to cool all the way down, plug it back in , give barrel a push and you're back in business. Read a thread about someone losing a motor to this when they didn't notice it had stopped and the thermal overload didn't keep the motor from frying. Not sure what make of tumbler it was.
|
|
|
Post by youp50 on May 16, 2017 20:43:29 GMT -5
GFCI's are required on construction jobs. I cannot recall any that do not disconnect on loss of power requiring a manual reset.
|
|
quartz
Cave Dweller
breakin' rocks in the hot sun
Member since February 2010
Posts: 3,341
|
Post by quartz on May 16, 2017 23:40:42 GMT -5
I have a "Defiant" brand plug-in GFCI from Home Depot, yellow in color on the front for the sake of identification. I just tried it and it does NOT disconnect when the power goes off, reset not required.
|
|
|
Post by MrMike on May 17, 2017 4:40:08 GMT -5
Interesting, none of our GFCI outlets trip when the power goes out.
|
|
|
Post by youp50 on May 19, 2017 1:00:23 GMT -5
You are riresetting after plug in or loss of powerght about the GFCI outlets, the breakers and outlets in my home do not require a reset.
In the construction industry I just retired from, GFCI's are required on all cords. They are supposed to be the first off the power source. Reason being if someone else would put a splitter in your line of cords, they would be protected from a fault. Many companies buy gfci's with three way cord outlet. If we are one cord from the outlet, we will put the 3 way on our end. It will save time, as we will have 3-4 1/2 inch grinders plugged in.
I do not recall any that did not need to be reset after initial plug in at the start of shift or after power loss.
|
|
|
Post by gmitch067 on May 19, 2017 1:56:40 GMT -5
All of my tumblers are connected to a power strip which is connected to a GFCI outlet in my garage (2-QT66, and 2-3A tumblers). I have only had that GFCI breaker trip once - when I was restarting my QT66 with a 12 lb barrel. I pushed the breaker back in to reset the circuit. It has been a few weeks since that happened... No probs since.
My neighborhood in Vacaville CA has new home construction still going on, and power outages lasting from 5 min to 4 hrs are not uncommon. I have considered buying a UPS but it is not cost effective for me to do so. If a power outage occurs while I am out (which has not happened - YET) I am plum out of luck and will probably not find out until I can hear the problem or do my weekly tumbler checks. If the slurry has time to harden, the sound of the tumbling action will change markedly and you will be alerted to open each tumbler barrel to manually stir up the contents before resuming normal operation.
I have purchased a small Reliance "Power Out!" alarm cube which monitors 115VAC at the wall plug in my hallway. If the power goes out, I first silence the thing's (puny) alarm, and then proceed to the garage to manually shake up each drum until the power comes back on... or I open and clean out each unit and call it quits for the day. I have had to go through this event twice since January 1st (when I started this hobby).
|
|
|
Post by youp50 on May 19, 2017 5:00:21 GMT -5
All of my tumblers are connected to a power strip which is connected to a GFCI outlet in my garage (2-QT66, and 2-3A tumblers). I have only had that GFCI breaker trip once - when I was restarting my QT66 with a 12 lb barrel. I pushed the breaker back in to reset the circuit. It has been a few weeks since that happened... No probs since. My neighborhood in Vacaville CA has new home construction still going on, and power outages lasting from 5 min to 4 hrs are not uncommon. I have considered buying a UPS but it is not cost effective for me to do so. If a power outage occurs while I am out (which has not happened - YET) I am plum out of luck and will probably not find out until I can hear the problem or do my weekly tumbler checks. If the slurry has time to harden, the sound of the tumbling action will change markedly and you will be alerted to open each tumbler barrel to manually stir up the contents before resuming normal operation. I have purchased a small Reliance "Power Out!" alarm cube which monitors 115VAC at the wall plug in my hallway. If the power goes out, I first silence the thing's (puny) alarm, and then proceed to the garage to manually shake up each drum until the power comes back on... or I open and clean out each unit and call it quits for the day. I have had to go through this event twice since January 1st (when I started this hobby). Electrical codes generally require garage outlets to be GFCI protected. I am not an electrician, but I know how to spell it. I have been told by electricians that sometimes a couple of GFCI's in series won't work. One or the other trips often. I am not much on reading directions, why do you shake or clean out if you lose power? I recently got hammered (again) on the ebay. A used Lortone single 3 pound barrel was purchased for Grandkids, it had drive issues. A couple of pulleys, belt and drive motor I was operating a used unit with the price tag of a new. While things were sorting out, the thing did quit turning. I just got it going again. The load seemed out of balance for a moment, then settled back into its unreliable former self. I am moving next week, there are two barrels on coarse grind. I was going to clean out, I think I will move them full and observe what happens. They may be weeks before i get them turning again.
|
|
zekester55
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since March 2017
Posts: 111
|
Post by zekester55 on May 19, 2017 5:09:15 GMT -5
I only had a few minutes to look this morning, but I did find this: Pump alarm
Expensive, but I wonder in today's connected world if a bit more research won't find cheaper device of similar capability. Along the same vein, while you may not want to buy a UPS for your tumbling operation, you may well have one already for your computer system; is there a way to leverage that system to notify you remotely (send an email or text) to let you know that power went down? This is a timely thread, as hurricane season starts here on the east coast, and the tornadoes have been picking up in the midwest and south. I've also been thinking about whether to leave things running or not if I have to go on travel for a few days. I had a Thumler AR-2 barrel roll off and bind the motor a few weeks ago, which caused thermal shut down, which caused some concern. I was also wondering what happens if power goes down and the barrels just sit for a few hours (or days). If they are watertight, then they should be air tight, so does the slurry harden? My covington has a vent hole for off gassing, so that's the one I'd worry about most in that case.
|
|
|
Post by MrP on May 19, 2017 6:05:40 GMT -5
I set my tumblers up on a relay that drops out when the power goes out. The tumblers will not start up again unless I push a momentary start button. I set this up because I lost a motor once when the power went out and came back on.
It is homemade. Used a double pole relay, ran the coil wire through 1 contact, put a momentary switch inline with the hot to the coil. When you operate the momentary switch it picks up the relay which is then held in by the contact being closed to the coil. When the power goes off the relay drops out and has to be reset manually. It has worked twice for me. I only use it for rotary tumbles because a vibe will always restart after a power outage.....................................MrP
Read more: forum.rocktumblinghobby.com/thread/71025
|
|
|
Post by gmitch067 on May 24, 2017 12:34:28 GMT -5
Depending on the type of rocks being tumbled and grit being used, the slurry thickness will change markedly from a thin watery mix to a thick frothy consistency. I am presently embroiled in getting through my first use of a new UV-10 and learned that feldspar rocks (Amazonite, Moonstone, etc...) are ones that develop a very thick slurry - the type that settles into a concrete like mold on the side of the vibe or tumbler if left unattended for lengthy periods.
It is not concrete... but, the fine particles and leftover grit bind together so tightly that it might as well be. Water just bounces off when you try to loosen the mess with a spray bottle. It requires you to manually pry it apart (gently! I use a plastic spatula handle so it doesn't score the drum) to redistribute the load before re-energizing the vibe or tumbler drum. The tumbler or vibe action should dissolve the remaining chunkies.
Sooo... If you find yourself moving and want to transport the tumbler drums mid-tumble, spend some time to open each drum and stir the mix before continuing. It might save you a drive belt. By stopping the tumble, removing the rocks and ceramics, and doing a through cleanup (love dem zip-lock bags!), I eliminate any uncertainty. I can always redo the stage at another time. It also gives me some touchy-feely time with my little shiny friends! ... well... SOON to be shiny...
|
|
zekester55
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since March 2017
Posts: 111
|
Post by zekester55 on May 28, 2017 9:08:24 GMT -5
So I just had a motor fail on a Lortone QT-66, it was discovered bound, smoking and still drawing power. I am going to pursue a monitoring system. What should I do with the barrel that was running? Does it need to be emptied, or can it remain sealed until I have a replacement motor, and then be re-run?
|
|
|
Post by gmitch067 on May 28, 2017 9:55:04 GMT -5
So I just had a motor fail on a Lortone QT-66, it was discovered bound, smoking and still drawing power. I am going to pursue a monitoring system. What should I do with the barrel that was running? Does it need to be emptied, or can it remain sealed until I have a replacement motor, and then be re-run? I would just empty the contents, give them a good cleaning, and put them in a zip lock bag with a note detailing which stage they were in. Then when the QT66 is back in commission, rerun that stage. If that solution is not feasible, put the drum aside unopened. MAKE SURE to open the drum and carefully stir the contents first before continuing the aborted run. If the type of rocks was such that produced a thick slurry, it might be a challenge to get the mess stirred back off the side-wall of the drum. Be careful and use a plastic or fiberglass reinforced stir stick. I use the handle from one of my kitchen spatulas. Protect the integrity of the drum and avoid a stir stick prone to breaking apart and skewering your hand! I hope this helps you.
|
|