Fossilman
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2009
Posts: 20,709
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Post by Fossilman on Nov 12, 2022 11:47:25 GMT -5
Tumbling takes months to years to get good at... It's a slow process and some can't handle that. Cabbing takes time to get the hands on ability, but can be fun after you get the hang of it. Each have their own place in Lapidary, and both are fun...
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Post by susand24224 on Nov 20, 2022 20:16:22 GMT -5
I do both and have placed in the annual competitions for tumbling, including (one) first place. Once I started cabbing, tumbling was a way to turn the "waste scraps" into something beautiful--something to give children, something to put in the soap dishes so they drain, something to share with others. Both take patience, both take knowledge, and it's kind of like asking artists whether oils or pastels is better. Neither is better, each has different qualities. It is true that there is more control with cabbing--until a piece breaks off, or a soft spot mysteriously appears. It is also true that cabbing is faster, but if one has three rotaries and a vibe going, the process is shortened and the outcome is greater. Control is great (which we like to believe we have with cabbing) but so are surprises! I vote no difference, except, of course, for the equipment required. They both involve the enjoyment of what beautiful creations rocks are.
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Post by victor1941 on Nov 21, 2022 19:15:58 GMT -5
How do you classify some like me that shapes on the flat lap and finishes in the vibe?
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vance71975
freely admits to licking rocks
Member since September 2022
Posts: 760
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Post by vance71975 on Nov 21, 2022 19:58:58 GMT -5
My answer would be 30+ days VS Couple hours.
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Post by rockjunquie on Nov 21, 2022 21:52:30 GMT -5
I think it boils down to patience. I'm with Pat.
I've never seen myself as a tumbler. I have a vibe for flats, but even at that- I'm uber impatient.
Unfortunately, cabbing for me is a bit of a hassle and requires foresight. If I had Gene set up in a dedicated space, I would cab more because I love it. I get excited when I can spend the day cabbing. I don't need any patience to get a nice looking cab.
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Post by jasoninsd on Nov 22, 2022 0:56:09 GMT -5
I think it boils down to patience. I'm with Pat .
I've never seen myself as a tumbler. I have a vibe for flats, but even at that- I'm uber impatient.
Unfortunately, cabbing for me is a bit of a hassle and requires foresight. If I had Gene set up in a dedicated space, I would cab more because I love it. I get excited when I can spend the day cabbing. I don't need any patience to get a nice looking cab.
That's right!! Just "grip it and rip it"! That's my motto when it comes to cabbing! LOL *Unfortunately, by that I mean I'm having to grip one of my fingers tightly to stop the bleeding because it just got ripped open on one of the wheels! LOL
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idearthmover
off to a rocking start
Member since February 2022
Posts: 20
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Post by idearthmover on Nov 23, 2022 9:17:42 GMT -5
Being new to actual polishing/tumbling rocks about a year now. It was the cost of a hobby tumbler to see if I actually liked it and wanted to continue with it. Being that a lot of what everyone talks about I didn't have a clue what a flat lap or a vib actually was. I knew what a rock saw was. But for me it's the cost. Anything above a couple hundred dollars is a big investment. Also I enjoy the tumbling. I did buy polishing pads and slowly started into that on bigger rocks/agates. It's just a hobby for me and I have no desire to try and make jewelry and sell it. I love beading or seeing it but don't have the patience to do it even though I tool leather which takes a while to complete.
It all comes down to what you have time money for and how far you want to take it.
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dshanpnw
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since December 2020
Posts: 1,063
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Post by dshanpnw on Nov 23, 2022 18:58:04 GMT -5
I do both and have placed in the annual competitions for tumbling, including (one) first place. Once I started cabbing, tumbling was a way to turn the "waste scraps" into something beautiful--something to give children, something to put in the soap dishes so they drain, something to share with others. Both take patience, both take knowledge, and it's kind of like asking artists whether oils or pastels is better. Neither is better, each has different qualities. It is true that there is more control with cabbing--until a piece breaks off, or a soft spot mysteriously appears. It is also true that cabbing is faster, but if one has three rotaries and a vibe going, the process is shortened and the outcome is greater. Control is great (which we like to believe we have with cabbing) but so are surprises! I vote no difference, except, of course, for the equipment required. They both involve the enjoyment of what beautiful creations rocks are. Nice, tumbling certainly can be used on rocks that can't be cabbed and I love the surprises. I didn't quite know what to do with the "waste scraps", tumble them or discard, now I know for sure I'm going to tumble them and fill some small plastic containers for our next club rock show.
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vance71975
freely admits to licking rocks
Member since September 2022
Posts: 760
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Post by vance71975 on Nov 23, 2022 19:36:17 GMT -5
I think it boils down to patience. I'm with Pat .
I've never seen myself as a tumbler. I have a vibe for flats, but even at that- I'm uber impatient.
Unfortunately, cabbing for me is a bit of a hassle and requires foresight. If I had Gene set up in a dedicated space, I would cab more because I love it. I get excited when I can spend the day cabbing. I don't need any patience to get a nice looking cab.
That's right!! Just "grip it and rip it"! That's my motto when it comes to cabbing! LOL *Unfortunately, by that I mean I'm having to grip one of my fingers tightly to stop the bleeding because it just got ripped open on one of the wheels! LOL Nah man just drip your blood on the stone and keep going, no blood no glory! lol
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Post by jasoninsd on Nov 23, 2022 19:58:45 GMT -5
That's right!! Just "grip it and rip it"! That's my motto when it comes to cabbing! LOL *Unfortunately, by that I mean I'm having to grip one of my fingers tightly to stop the bleeding because it just got ripped open on one of the wheels! LOL Nah man just drip your blood on the stone and keep going, no blood no glory! lol Yeah...Bloodstone is my most commonly worked material! LOL
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vance71975
freely admits to licking rocks
Member since September 2022
Posts: 760
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Post by vance71975 on Nov 23, 2022 20:00:35 GMT -5
Nah man just drip your blood on the stone and keep going, no blood no glory! lol Yeah...Bloodstone is my most commonly worked material! LOL Lmao But Bloodstone is awesome tho for real.
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Post by Rockoonz on Nov 24, 2022 11:17:58 GMT -5
There's additional categories. Gatherer- I think that's way up the list for me, judging from the buckets, crates, boxes, bags, cabinets, all full of rock. I accumulate them faster than I can do something with them, it seems. At my first rock show as a club member I was helping a woman load her car and asked what she did with them, "I put them in my yard and look at them". For me this applies to machines and tools as well.
Specimen polisher- Kinda like lapidary only you won't wear it ever. I have done a bit with a HS sander and polisher, but health concerns caused me to stop dry sanding. I have a belt sander for smaller stuff, and 2 wet angle grinders that I intend to use when I have an outdoor area set up (2024?)
Slab maker- This would be what I spend the most time doing, usually while doing other shop activities. I used to run back and forth to my cabbing area up north, but water and oil just don't mix.
Tool person- The other shop activities. I am always restoring or making tools.
Faceter- I don't do this, even though I have 3 faceting machines.
Knapper- Took a class where the instructor gave us about 20 hours of teaching while telling us it takes hundreds of hours to get good at it. My bucket of boppers, flakers and partially done work collects dust in the shop, I have more time into making my tools than actual knapping, I'm pretty sure. Also, the term blood-stone definitely applies with this one.
Carver- Also have a class under my belt and hope to someday advance to mediocre at it. Also another excuse to accumulate tools. I have somewhere between 8 and 15 flex shaft grinders and parts to build a couple or so carving stations.
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Post by Son Of Beach on Dec 8, 2022 18:03:50 GMT -5
There's additional categories. Gatherer- I think that's way up the list for me, judging from the buckets, crates, boxes, bags, cabinets, all full of rock. I accumulate them faster than I can do something with them, it seems. At my first rock show as a club member I was helping a woman load her car and asked what she did with them, "I put them in my yard and look at them". For me this applies to machines and tools as well. Specimen polisher- Kinda like lapidary only you won't wear it ever. I have done a bit with a HS sander and polisher, but health concerns caused me to stop dry sanding. I have a belt sander for smaller stuff, and 2 wet angle grinders that I intend to use when I have an outdoor area set up (2024?) Slab maker- This would be what I spend the most time doing, usually while doing other shop activities. I used to run back and forth to my cabbing area up north, but water and oil just don't mix. Tool person- The other shop activities. I am always restoring or making tools. Faceter- I don't do this, even though I have 3 faceting machines. Knapper- Took a class where the instructor gave us about 20 hours of teaching while telling us it takes hundreds of hours to get good at it. My bucket of boppers, flakers and partially done work collects dust in the shop, I have more time into making my tools than actual knapping, I'm pretty sure. Also, the term blood-stone definitely applies with this one. Carver- Also have a class under my belt and hope to someday advance to mediocre at it. Also another excuse to accumulate tools. I have somewhere between 8 and 15 flex shaft grinders and parts to build a couple or so carving stations. Some good alternatives Lee. Gatherer is starting to show on my end.
Interesting since I've picked up my flat lap. I can already tell it's a once a week hobby. I can wait weeks for my tumbles, but I don't think I like spending hours on a handful of rocks, not often anyway.
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hypodactylus
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2021
Posts: 466
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Post by hypodactylus on Jul 9, 2023 0:01:55 GMT -5
Doesn't seem like there is any real consensus answer (other than our hobbies overlap a lot), but I thought I would try to add my point of view.
I personally am a tumbler, not a cabber. I really enjoy seeing the cabs other people make, but mostly for the rock itself; not the shape or design by its maker (with some exceptions). I am primarily interested in the rocks and the cool designs that nature has created within them. Polishing enhances my ability to enjoy them.
I tend to be quite patient with the tumbling process, not really worrying if a rock takes months (or years...) for me to finish. It is a relatively passive process. However, I also like polished (front/back) slabs and specimens. I bought a flat lap to polish slabs and specimens.... but... I almost never use it! I just don't often have the patience/motivation to set everything up, then sit there for hours going from one disc to the next in an active process.
I struggle with perfectionism and really try to be okay with 'imperfect' tumbles; rocks with natural cracks, pits, etc. However, I continually find this to be difficult. While I tend to prefer more 'natural' shapes, I have started tumbling smaller slabs, saw leftovers, and cut rocks. These sometimes give me a better view of what is inside a rock, which I like.
I think cabbers and tumblers both have patience and perfectionistic tendencies. Cabbers and tumblers both find beauty and interest within the rock. They just have slightly different ways of expressing it, or find 'entertainment' in separate processes for achieving a similar end.
Anyway, none of that probably makes any sense... I don't think I helped find your answer. 🙂
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gunsil
spending too much on rocks
Member since January 2023
Posts: 332
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Post by gunsil on Jul 9, 2023 10:54:57 GMT -5
Well, this is an older thread but I'll add my two cents. My answer is skill. Takes a lot more skill to cab well than to tumble well. There is a place for tumbled stones for sure but more skill is required to make nice cabs.
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Post by Rockoonz on Jul 9, 2023 11:07:29 GMT -5
I actually approached the hobbies looking to get into knife-making and flint knapping. Figured if I joined my local rock club maybe I could use their grinders. Well before they let you do that you have to take the class on cabbing. Meanwhile, I'm collecting my first chert ever and only finding small, un-knappable material. The class taught me that I can still polish those fragments in a tumbler. I already needed a tumbler to get into pyrotechnics so it seemed like a good opportunity to get one. Now I'm not really interested in knives or pyrotechnics but I really want to get into intarsia and faceting. So for me it's a financial thing and a progression of knowledge. I can't afford a faceting machine or all of the tools for intarsia so I'm just preparing for the day by cabbing to learn polishing and tumbling to learn the materials. I think the intarsia and faceting goals are a desire for rarity or entropy. A fragment of quartz could look infinitely different ways, tending towards a rounded pebble. Next to the natural crystal shape, faceted gemstones seems like the most rare representation of a stone, having all that perfection, geometry, and intention. Same with intarsia - all that intention behind the details. I feel like cabbing and tumbling is more accepting the stone for what it is, less what it could be. Jade carving is another good example. Why would anyone tumble or cab jade when carvings are possible. Funny how interests shift as you go. I think a lot of it is the tool centric vs skill centric thing. I see faceting as very tool centric, a high quality super dialed in faceter really only requires that you complete each step, while in order to make a stone of the quality that typically comes off an Ultratech faceter with my $400.00 (10 years ago) Graves Mk1 requires a skill level far beyond me. FYI the Graves is perfect to make precise pieces for intarsia and inlay, and can also work to learn the fundamentals of faceting with glass or inexpensive synthetic materials. Just make sure you get it with a 96 index instead of a 64 like mine so you can do base 3 stuff, both is even better. I had an interesting jade carving class in Prineville a few weeks ago, the basic premise being that if you spend more than about 15 minutes per piece on the carving part of creating a jade pendant you will not recoup your labor when you sell it. Considering my instructor and his expertise in all things jade I tend to believe him. So basically the art carvings should be collected or gifted IMO.
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Post by Pat on Jul 9, 2023 11:20:57 GMT -5
What’s the difference? Grit. True grit!
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pizzano
Cave Dweller
Member since February 2018
Posts: 1,390
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Post by pizzano on Jul 9, 2023 11:42:02 GMT -5
A couple a years ago there was a post started here at RTH discussing cabochon's & cabbing....definition and types.
It eventually boiled down to an accepted principle...:
"Cabbing is a process......A Cabochon is the shape or style of a stone that has been "processed" by cutting, ground, shaped and polished....by hand, with the help of machines (tools) made with and incorporated other stone materials..........Polishing is a form of grinding."
Tumbling is a process.......A Tumbled stone has been "processed" by cutting, ground, shaped and polished.......by machines (tools) incorporated with other stone materials.
So, are you "a tumbler or a cabber".....?......Really, the only difference is the appeal, application, patients, time and money an individual who loves ROCKS, cares to spend and enjoy..!....The stone cares not.......it's going to be "processed" and manipulated by hands, machines and other stone buddies, regardless......whether you're a cabber or a tumbler, you're a stone "processing" ARTIST.....that decides for ones self, to either control the outcome of the production or let the production control the outcome.
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Post by parfive on Jul 9, 2023 12:07:36 GMT -5
You driving the car or riding shotgun? It’s a trip either way.
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Post by 1dave on Jul 17, 2023 20:30:41 GMT -5
Tumbling?
Take a beautiful rock, hit it with a hammer, shatter the beauty, toss it into a tumbler, like tumbling down a stream, no control over the outcome. whatever happens - happens. Give the results to someone, and they lose it. all for what?
Cabbing?
Take a beautiful rock. Which way to slab it will bring out the best results? Finally the slabs are cut without badly grooving them.
Look at all the wonderful patterns. Can't cab this, too beautiful the way it is! Polish the slab.
Oh, here is a pattern that would look good in a - Bolo, bracelet, pendant, ring, earring - That is worth the effort to make a perfect cab!
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