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Post by johnjsgems on Jul 30, 2010 13:13:02 GMT -5
1" wouldn't work with saw blades. 3/4" and 1" are pretty much standard with 8" wheels. 5/8" is pretty standard for 6" wheels.
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cooknet
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since February 2009
Posts: 169
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Post by cooknet on Jul 30, 2010 23:05:45 GMT -5
ok, well the verdict is in then, we will stick with a 5/8" shaft, just like I originally thought of before I tried to confuse things further suggesting 1". So cpdad, if your reading this, looks like the verdict is to make a straight through 5/8" shaft from one end to the other, with also a 5/8" threaded end on each end, which accept 5/8" nuts, that is if your still interested in helping out with this project of course. Just make the shaft as I previously described here before I mentioned anything about 1" shafts! I sent you an email to your hotmail address cpdad! Thanks Jon, Chris
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Post by cpdad on Jul 31, 2010 6:26:30 GMT -5
chris...totally my fault on the shaft... i just skimmed thru instead of slowing down and reading....no problem on making another shaft....i will need to make the threads 1/2" on the ends because i dont have a 5/8" left handed tap to make the nut....those taps are about 30 bucks if i had to buy it....but yes it would have been easier on me to do it that way .....i had to order some 5/8" stainless...i ordered it for the shop...so no cost....shafting will be delivered to me monday afternoon or tuesday morning and i will get another made right on up.......kev.
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quartz
Cave Dweller
breakin' rocks in the hot sun
Member since February 2010
Posts: 3,352
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Post by quartz on Jul 31, 2010 10:04:08 GMT -5
Fastenall lists low carbon, left-hand, 5/8-18 nuts as p/n 36963. They list finished hex 18-8 stainless left-hand nuts, 5/8-18 thd., as p/n 0175064. The purchase of a nut certainly cheaper than turning the shaft or buying a tap. Hopefully a store near you.
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cooknet
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since February 2009
Posts: 169
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Post by cooknet on Jul 31, 2010 10:57:41 GMT -5
Hi Kev, Thanks for being understanding! Times like this are not for pointing fingers, that's just counter productive and hurts people's feelings! In the extensive "design team" experience I've had in the past working with engineers in R&D, it's always been the best practice to not waste time trying to figure out who to pin things on, but rather moving forward to get the work done at hand! So don't worry about it, it takes 2 to tango Kev! I've never been a man that can't say " I'm wrong", or " I'm sorry", or who has a problem accepting constructive criticism from others, (After-all, I am on my 3rd marriage now, one would think I'm pretty ego-less right about now...LOL), so if something is miscommunicated between me and someone else, I have no problem accepting responsibility for that! Since I have an issue with communication due to my brain injury, I tend to over do my descriptions and communications to ensure that I get my point across, which is WHY my posts take an hour to read! It's that " better safe than sorry" mentality that I've adopted to ensure my ability to converse with the rest of the human race still exists...LOL That explanation in itself took an hour to read, sorry about that, back to the shaft. So regarding the shaft length, you only made it 21 inches long because of the instability issues, I am wondering if you can please make it a full 2 feet, or 24 inches long. That way, it will actually take up the full length of my arbor housing, and if something were to ever go wrong that it needed a shaft rod end for extra stability, I could add one and still have enough room for all the wheels without losing any real estate, know what I mean? I don't think that will be an issue, not with the 5/8" shaft, especially since I'm not loading it down with 6 wheels or anything, just 4 at the most, and at the end, I will be able to mount a polishing pad disk, since you are going to drill and thread a hole in each end of the shaft for me as well, taking the standard screw size we talked about previously. Having 2 inches of 1/2" thread at each end is not a bad thing at all, in fact, it's kinda preferred as I can actually mount a small saw blade with a 1/2" arbor hole in it, that will simply be held in place by the step down from 5/8" to 1/2", and the locking nut. I like that idea of a small flexible saw blade on one end of the shaft, as I can trim little bits off the pieces of opal as I use the machine, trimming off potch to help shape and expose color AS I grind, rather than have to drag out my separate trim saw and go through all the BS of setting it up ect. So, just to now set the parameters of this "new" shaft in stone, so there are NO miscommunications, here are the specs of this new shaft below: - Shaft thickness from one end to the other, less the threaded ends = 5/8" - Threaded end thickness = 1/2" - Threaded end length of thread = 2" - Both ends of shaft drilled and tapped to 1/4" - 20 ( in the proper direction of threading considering the direction of the rotation) This is providing that I am quoting the PROPER STANDARD thread and size of screw that will fit the end threaded holes, please feel free to correct me if I'm quoting the wrong size!! And that's about it! Just a 5/8" shaft, with 2 inches of 1/2" thread on each end, with a hole tapped and threaded in each end of the shaft to accept the standard size screw on accessories! Thanks Kev, I'm REALLY glad that you can make the 2nd shaft for me, and that I am going to REALLY get this thing up and running after all this! Chris
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cooknet
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since February 2009
Posts: 169
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Post by cooknet on Jul 31, 2010 11:01:12 GMT -5
Fastenall lists low carbon, left-hand, 5/8-18 nuts as p/n 36963. They list finished hex 18-8 stainless left-hand nuts, 5/8-18 thd., as p/n 0175064. The purchase of a nut certainly cheaper than turning the shaft or buying a tap. Hopefully a store near you. Oh, BTW, sorry quartz, I didn't want to seem like I was ignoring you!! I just didn't want to confuse or delay things any further, and I certainly did NOT want cpdad to go out of pocket for anything at all for this shaft project! Also, as I said, I kinda like the 1/2" threaded ends for the purpose I mentioned, that step down from 5/8" to 1/2" acts like a mounting platform for 1/2" accessories, such as that small saw blade. Thanks for your concern and trying to help me out, I'm sure people reading this are feeling my frustration...LOL Take care! Chris
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spicer m
spending too much on rocks
Member since October 2008
Posts: 337
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Post by spicer m on Jul 31, 2010 21:11:46 GMT -5
Chris the 1/4-20 threads will only work on one end. The right side. If Your using the store bought spin on buffs. Mike
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Post by jakesrocks on Jul 31, 2010 21:21:27 GMT -5
They make spin on disks in left and right hand threads. Check the Kingsley North catalog, Pg. 53, item #3 And 4. Also the Lortone catalog, top of pg. 15. They come with a rubber face for attaching your own sanding or polishing disks, or for a few dollars more with a felt disk attached. If you use feathering adhesive, you can use diamond disks on them, and change them whenever you want. Don
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quartz
Cave Dweller
breakin' rocks in the hot sun
Member since February 2010
Posts: 3,352
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Post by quartz on Jul 31, 2010 21:35:24 GMT -5
Not a problem from here, you explained your preference well, makes good sense. quartz
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cooknet
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since February 2009
Posts: 169
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Post by cooknet on Jul 31, 2010 21:55:05 GMT -5
Chris the 1/4-20 threads will only work on one end. The right side. If Your using the store bought spin on buffs. Mike Thanks Mike, I guess what I was saying really was that the end that spun "correctly" to keep the standard available spin on accessories in place, which you say is the "right side" is an obvious feature to have, but also, if I had the other end tapped and threaded in the correct direction as well, so that a screw inserted in that hole would not spin "off", that end could also have an accessory mounted onto it, but with the correct thread screw that fit it, so that I could mount something on that end as well. I know the available accessories like the spin on polishing heads are only really available in one standard direction thread, but couldn't I just use the appropriate screw to hold on another accessory of my choice on the other end? Correct me if my dyslexia is kicking in again! Thanks! Chris
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Post by jakesrocks on Jul 31, 2010 22:07:44 GMT -5
Chris, check my last post above. Don
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spicer m
spending too much on rocks
Member since October 2008
Posts: 337
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Post by spicer m on Jul 31, 2010 22:13:54 GMT -5
Chris You could maybe??. I wouldn't unless it was a very small diameter. Left side should really be left hand thread. Right hand threads on left side may unscrew and send things flying. Mike
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Post by jakesrocks on Jul 31, 2010 22:43:08 GMT -5
With your shaft turned to 1/2" on the ends, you could also use facetors backing plates, and attach sanding or polishing pads to them. They would work on either end. Don
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spicer m
spending too much on rocks
Member since October 2008
Posts: 337
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Post by spicer m on Jul 31, 2010 22:54:38 GMT -5
Don Guess I need to put on my glasses next time I look at a catalog. Did not know they made left hand 1/4"-20 spin on's. Sorry I led you astray Chris Mike
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Post by jakesrocks on Aug 1, 2010 8:21:19 GMT -5
That's ok Mike. I'm half blind too. I just remembered seeing them before I had to start wearing glasses full time. If you can afford them, you might look into the magnetic diamond disks Diamond Pacific sells for the right end of their machines. I use them on my Genie. They're great for doing the flat backs on cabs. Don
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cooknet
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since February 2009
Posts: 169
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Post by cooknet on Aug 1, 2010 11:58:43 GMT -5
That's ok Mike. I'm half blind too. I just remembered seeing them before I had to start wearing glasses full time. If you can afford them, you might look into the magnetic diamond disks Diamond Pacific sells for the right end of their machines. I use them on my Genie. They're great for doing the flat backs on cabs. Don No problem Don, I have a full life time of being led astray behind me...lol. Also, a couple of those posts didn't even show up until LATER, so I ONLY read the ones before and after, I don't know why that happens, but I end up missing posts that way, and I HATE it when that happens, because it makes it look like I'm not reading people's posts, or ignoring them! I at least "knew" they made left hand spin on accessories, as I've been scouring those catalogs for months now, trying to learn what there is, what there isn't, what is acceptable practice, and what is not. I get confused about left and right hand threads, which side they should go on, which way is spinning where ect, so that's why I just said "spinning in their appropriate ways"...lol I knew everyone would know what I meant! The whole point I was trying to make was that I want to take full advantage of all the features I can with this shaft, and not be limited by the lack of some threaded hole somewhere, and be saying to myself " If I ONLY had the ability to mount this or that", know what I mean? I REALLY want this ONE machine to be able to multitask and do as MUCH as one machine can do, as I have some serious space issues, and flat surfaces are at a premium in my current rental house, so I want to be able to just use one machine to trim, grind, cut and polish, from one end of the process to the other. When space and $$ allow, I plan on building a big slab saw, and a heavy duty stand alone grinder/shaper, and then all the fine duty stuff can be done on this machine, but until then, I just want to be able to work "conveniently" without having to "change up" alot of gear as I'm moving through the process from start to finish. You wouldn't think it would be THAT much of a pain in the butt, but really, switching disks all the time, pulling out the trim saw, getting it all ready, washing it down afterward, putting it all away, and then the final polish part of having to mess around with rooting through your stuff to dig out the right pads, then mount them, it ALL takes a HUGE amount of time in the end, and you don't really notice it until you DO IT for yourself with your own hands. Thinking about it, it shouldn't take so much time, but it DOES, so I just want to make it all as easy as possible. This sounds like a stupid question, but what exactly IS "feathering adhesive"?? And what are it's specific applications? I usually use 3M spray adhesive to spray and stick things like polishing pads onto the disks, and things like that, is feathering adhesive different fro that? I don't have a lapidary supply shop that I can just walk into and shop around, and ask questions, all the products that I am aware of, I've found online, or been referred by people like yourself, and then have to buy "online". If I don't know the benefit or use of something made for a specific purpose, I usually find a local substitute that makes sense to use for that application. Also, the magnetic diamond disks from Diamond Pacific, what is the difference between mounting a 6" flat lap on the end of the shaft and using one of those? Just the ease of a magnetic mount? I just wondered what was different about them. Do you mean the magnetic Nova Discs they advertise for the Genie? Thanks all! Chris
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Post by jakesrocks on Aug 1, 2010 12:28:42 GMT -5
Feathering adhesive is also called disk adhesive. Just depends on which catalog you're looking at.In the Kingsley catalog You'll find it on page 62, item #5. The magnetic Nova disks are what I was talking about. The backing plate has a steel face, and the Nova disks are magnetic. It makes for quick and easy grit changes. Just peel one off and stick the next grit on. I have a metal framed shelf above my Genie, so I hang my Novas there when I'm using them. It helps to do several cabs at one time, so any equipment changes you need to make can be done once, instead of doing cabs one at a time, and constantly have to make changes. I usually have anywere from 5 to 15 cabs dopped at one time, ready to go. They all go through the coarse grind, and on up the line to final polish Don
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cooknet
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since February 2009
Posts: 169
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Post by cooknet on Aug 1, 2010 15:29:09 GMT -5
Thanks Don, but I can't deal with Kingsley, they blew me off because I'm a Canadian, were extremely rude, and refuse to sell to me, so I make sure I tell everyone else that is in Canada not to waste their time with Kingsley. I don't understand WHY they are like that, but they aren't the ONLY ones, even Lortone wouldn't sell direct to me, they just referred me to the local Lortone dealer, who makes a HUGE mark up on everything, so screw them too. About the ONLy people who treated me equally, and with respect and kindness were Rockun & Gemun W/E.T. located in Grand Junction, Colorado. Their webpage is located at: www.rockunandgemunwet.com/Has anyone here ever dealt with this company? They seem to sell everything that most everyone else does, and they have pretty good prices as well. That is where I just bought the arbor to put into the faceting machine I'm also building, and a bunch of diamond polishing paste to polish my Etiopia Welo opals. Chris
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cooknet
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since February 2009
Posts: 169
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Post by cooknet on Aug 1, 2010 19:25:46 GMT -5
Well, here is the cabbing machine so far, I just put a coat of blue fisherman's paint on it, which is the same epoxy marine paint that the fishing boats put on their hulls to keep the salt water from eating their boats, it's actually "boat & dory" paint...LOL I figure if the paint protects the boat from the harsh Atlantic then it probably will be a good waterproofing pain for the cabbing machine! I regret putting a coat of tremclad rust paint onto it first, I painted it in the sunshine, and that is why this blue coat of paint looks so crappy, because underneath, there is a layer of that tremclad that ran, and bubbled, and it nasty looking, but after I sand this paint down and give it another coat or two, sanding down each time, it will virtually look like it is made out of plastic, it goes nice and smooth and even, so it will eventually look ALOT better than this soon! There are ALOT more things to be added onto this machine, this basically is only the water guard when you think of it, it's just the basic housing that everything else mounts to. The square hole in the bottom is where the arbor will be mounted, so the belt can feed through the bottom, as the motor will be mounted below this. There will be a guard around the arbor so water doesn't flow down that hole, and drain holes and lines will be added also to the bottom of this, but none of that stuff will be done until I get the arbor mounted and running, and I know exactly how that will all play out!
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Post by johnjsgems on Aug 2, 2010 8:50:08 GMT -5
3M feathering disc adhesive is a non-permanent glue used to hold discs and polish discs. I used to see it in spray also but all my suppliers have a paste in a tube now. I also use the magnetic nova discs. They are pricey but really convenient and work well for flats and cab backs for sanding and prepolishing.
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