NDK
Cave Dweller 
Member since January 2009
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Post by NDK on Mar 8, 2011 18:51:11 GMT -5
I'm wondering, Do I need a special solder flux to work with copper and eventually silver, or can I use the paste solder flux I have for copper plumbing?
All the info I've looked at so far just has it listed as solder flux, with no indication of what materials it works on.
Thanks,
Nate
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Post by rockmanken on Mar 8, 2011 19:05:35 GMT -5
for copper use 60/40 solder. For silver you HAVE to use silver solder.
Ken
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NDK
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Member since January 2009
Posts: 9,440
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Post by NDK on Mar 8, 2011 20:25:53 GMT -5
Whoops, I meant flux. I got some copper solder from monsterslayer, but didn't get flux.
So I'll re-ask the question. Do I need any special FLUX when soldering.
Thanks Ken.
Nate
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Post by bobby1 on Mar 8, 2011 20:29:05 GMT -5
Be very careful with keeping any lead based solder away from your silver and gold work. It dissolves both metals. If you leave a tiny bit on your soldering block, lay a piece of silver (or gold) on it and heat it a time or two it will eat a hole all the way through. The safest method is to use silver solder on the copper and that way there isn't a contamination problem. The solder joints will be much stronger. too.
Bob
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NDK
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Member since January 2009
Posts: 9,440
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Post by NDK on Mar 8, 2011 20:31:23 GMT -5
Thanks Bob, I meant to ask about flux... I should pay attn to what I write... LOL
I ammended my original post.
Nate
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spicer m
spending too much on rocks
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Post by spicer m on Mar 9, 2011 0:22:40 GMT -5
Nate I have only been messing with silver smithing about a year but this is what I think at this time baised on what I have tryed. This is the best wire copper solder and cheapest I have found. It leaves a copper color. It is self fluxing. I think it melts at 1100deg or higher. They also make a paste solder. It costs about .07 cents per ft compared .60 cents per ft most others charge. also not every ones copper solder is copper color. eclient.ijsinc.com/eshop/default.aspx You can use plumbers solder and flux on copper but not silver. For silver they make Hard, Med, Easy and Extra easy solder. they all melt at a different thempeture. The flux You use with silver is called Handi-flux. You can use silver solder and Handi-flux on copper but it will show silver. You can use liver of sulfer or other patinas on the back ground to turn the silver solder and copper black. They also make a copper patina for stained glass. There solder also melts around 500deg Mike |
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NDK
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2009
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Post by NDK on Mar 9, 2011 17:14:39 GMT -5
Thanks Mike. I got Fos-Flo solder from monsterslayer, it was less than 3 dollars for about 25 feet of it. Now I wish I would have thought of flux when I ordered...
Does anyone know if Hobby Lobby would sell it?
Thanks,
Nate
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mc2
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since April 2009
Posts: 1,147
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Post by mc2 on Mar 9, 2011 17:56:46 GMT -5
Nate, as far as flux goes, I am using a home made mixture of boric acid and denatured alcohol. I read about this on another message board. I have been using it on silver, seems to work pretty good. Don't know about copper though. I got the boric acid at the drugstore. Roach powder contains it also, but may have additional stuff in it that might be bad for us, especially when heated. If you use the boric and alcohol solution, be sure to get the pure boric acid from a drugstore. If interested, I can find the link for you about home made flux. I do not have enough experience yet to know if it is better or not compared to store bought flux. I have seen many kinds of it, some that is supposed to help with the firescale also. Whether or not any of what I just said applies to working with copper, I have no idea! I look forward to reading what others have to say on this, as I am just getting started in soldering silver, which is a little off topic of your post, but, I hope we all get some good info that will help increase or knowledge a bit.
Mike
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NDK
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Member since January 2009
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Post by NDK on Mar 9, 2011 20:02:00 GMT -5
Thanks for the info Mike. I'll stop on the way to work tonight and pick some up.
Mind if I ask what the mixture ratio is? I would like to see the link too.
Thanks!
Nate
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mc2
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since April 2009
Posts: 1,147
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Post by mc2 on Mar 9, 2011 22:41:19 GMT -5
Ok Nate, took me a bit to find it again. Also, google the term boric acid flux, thst should get some tips also. Here is an excerpt: You mix half and half on the boric acid and denatured alcahol, dip your work in, light it on fire to burn off the alcahol, and that basically coats your work in flux, thus eliminating the need for paste flux or My T Flux, etc.? That comes from here: gemstone.smfforfree4.com/index.php/topic,660.msg26261.html#msg26261 Hope that link works for you. The topic is dealing with silverwork/soldering. Don't know if it any help on copper. But, reading the entire thread there gives some great info. If you haven't seen that message board, it is another great place! Mike |
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NDK
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Post by NDK on Mar 10, 2011 18:23:17 GMT -5
I didn't find any boric acid locally last night. The pharmacy I stopped at didn't carry it. Have to try a few others this weekend.
Thanks so much for the info Mike! I'm going to look that all over shortly.
Nate
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hulagrub
spending too much on rocks
Member since October 2009
Posts: 256
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Post by hulagrub on Mar 13, 2011 11:10:05 GMT -5
Nate, if you are just looking for the flux for soldering copper, try Lowes or Home Depot, in the plumbing dept!
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Post by NatureNut on Mar 13, 2011 13:06:37 GMT -5
I'm taking silversmithing classes at the G&M Club here in Quartzsite now and they use a paste of Borax and water. Works great! Put it on with a small paintbrush and when it dries out, just add a little water. After we flux, we dry it off with the torch before placing our silver solder. I'll bet you already have some Borax hanging around.  Jo |
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NDK
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Member since January 2009
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Post by NDK on Mar 13, 2011 20:41:27 GMT -5
Dave, I have flux for copper, but wanted to try the stuff needed for silver. I figure if it's a different method, may as well get used to it.
Jo, please tell me you don't mean the Borax soap we use in tumbling!?! I searched all over town and finally got some roach killer (boric acid) at Lowe's. That's the ONLY place in town I could find it. No pharmacies carried it (they would order it for me) like Mike said to try. I figure the roach killer is 99% boric acid, so close enough lol. Heck, I even looked up the welding supply places to get paste flux, and they didn't stock it either...
Thanks for the links with the videos too, Mike. I enjoyed watching them.
Nate
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Post by NatureNut on Mar 13, 2011 20:59:10 GMT -5
Uhhhhh.... yep  Sorry I was a little late in reading your thread Nate. :blush: |
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Post by NatureNut on Mar 13, 2011 21:00:48 GMT -5
I learned alot from reading this though... (don't hit me)
Also, you can use PH down pool/hot tub stuff in place of pickle.
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NDK
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2009
Posts: 9,440
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Post by NDK on Mar 13, 2011 21:16:09 GMT -5
HA!!! I got the PH down for pickle already... Whew, you scared me there for a second!
And you know, I wondered earlier this week if the borax soap would work. But then I thought "Nah, that would be way too easy!" LOL...
Nate
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Post by NatureNut on Mar 14, 2011 20:45:41 GMT -5
Haha, you weren't the only one who ran all over looking for flux before they found this out. |
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Post by Roller on Mar 14, 2011 22:59:49 GMT -5
ive been reading this as well and had already spent $ on the expensive stuff ... just curious though anyone have any idea on how well it works and what mixture i should use ?? parts to water for the paste ?
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NDK
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Member since January 2009
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Post by NDK on Mar 15, 2011 15:03:03 GMT -5
Greg, the denatured alcohol and boric acid is supposed to be mixed 50/50, but I bet it doesn't matter too much as you just burn off the alcohol to coat the metal with the acid. I would imagine the same holds true for the borax/water solution.
I haven't done this yet, but I would think a pastey consistancy would be best so it doesn't just run off.
Thanks for the info Jo, It'll save me $ and time when/if I need more.
Nate
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Jo
