Tom
fully equipped rock polisher
My dad Tom suddenly passed away yesterday, Just wanted his "rock" family to know.
Member since January 2013
Posts: 1,557
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Post by Tom on Nov 10, 2013 17:11:45 GMT -5
Hi everyone,
Cleaned and scrubbed out old oil, man did it need it, gross. Not perfectly clean but a good job.
Mixed 4 onces of John's Gems water mix with 2 US gallons of tap water, as per instructions
Put on a new 12 inch 303 blade (my other one had a bit of a dish). LS12 saw uses 2 gallons.
Dressed blade
Made 3 cuts through a mud stone just to make sure things were working ok. Slabs were absolutely smooth as this saw always did with oil Even with dished blade.
Got a 3.5 by 4 inch oval nodule of nice solid very heavy Brazilian agate
Started the cut and let it run half way through the rock, stopped saw and checked blade, perfectly cool.
Finished the cut, absolutely smooth cut.
Removed rock, wonderful to touch just water:). Rinsed in sink, rock could be doped easy no mess
After first cut I am in love with product!
Will do more cuts and report again later
Cost comparison:
Mineral oil $17 Can per US gallon Water based mix. $4.38 Can per US gallon (cheaper for my American friends in either case) But all in all about one quarter the cost.
Even if this reduces blade life a lot I am still in love, I use my saw in my house so anything cleaner than oil is a bonus, plus cheaper coolant will offset blade cost and that's IF there is any excess blade wear.
So far not a deal breaker for me, even if I have to dress the blade more. This may be a better product for smaller blade saws as Shotgunner is going back to oil with his big saw.
This is only one cut in hard material folks, let me report after I make a bunch of cuts.
I know it's going in my trim saw!!!!!! I get soaked with oil from it and I hate it.
More to report soon.
Tom
First time I have tried to edit a post so hope it works:)
Well I could'nt wait for the new part to come in so I had a look at it. Likely did not need to order one as I think this one is in good shape.
anyway, clamped the release arm in locked position. Cut a few soft rocks and water worked great then I went to hard hard agate. It made 2 cuts then started to screw up, the blade could not cut as fast as the feed could push.
I will be changing out to oil tomorrow, the only thing that could happen now is oil won't work, if thats the case then I have saw issues. I don't think I have saw issue's
Larry if you are reading this I am assuming now that you are using a hand fed trim saw and not a power feed slab saw? for a trim saw this stuff is the best. Power feed, na
Sorry John I can't recommend this product. Have you tried it in one of your saws, if not maybe you should as I don't think you want to sell this to a customer using power feed. That's up to you though.
So to all you pro's that were skeptical while I was hopeful, you are correct. I am sure when I fill er up with mineral oil (I don't have enough on hand to do it today) the saw is going to work like a dream again, esp with the new blade.
Two tests, shotgunners 20 inch saw??? and my 12 inch saw, both are a bust in our opinions. I am so disapointed! I so hoped this would work because its just a dream to play with compared to oil. Live and learn, its only money and we know they print more of that every day LOL.
Tom
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Post by orrum on Nov 10, 2013 17:53:34 GMT -5
Great news, I need some for my 6 inch saw and I just got a 10 inch.
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panamark
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since September 2012
Posts: 1,343
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Post by panamark on Nov 10, 2013 18:18:14 GMT -5
Thanks Tom for the news. And please post your thoughts after you have a few hours on the blade. A lot of people are very interested in how this works out.
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LarryS
freely admits to licking rocks
SoCal desert rats
Member since August 2010
Posts: 781
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Post by LarryS on Nov 11, 2013 8:15:33 GMT -5
Nice report Tom. Had a hunch it would work on larger blades. I use my 10" Covington both for slabbing and trimming. Couldn't imagine trimming with oil. Eeeek! I'll run my saw maybe 10-15 total days before cleaning it out. Then I'll trim while the coolant is clear. Sure is a pleasure just dumping out the snot behind the house and rinsing it out with the garden hose. Even better is just rinsing our hands/slabs with clean water after handling.
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Tom
fully equipped rock polisher
My dad Tom suddenly passed away yesterday, Just wanted his "rock" family to know.
Member since January 2013
Posts: 1,557
|
Post by Tom on Nov 11, 2013 22:36:36 GMT -5
Well only made about 6 cuts and the feed buggered up on my saw. Have to fix that before I can report more
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ash
spending too much on rocks
Prairieville, Louisiana
Member since July 2012
Posts: 361
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Post by ash on Nov 14, 2013 11:46:43 GMT -5
Nice report Tom. Had a hunch it would work on larger blades. I use my 10" Covington both for slabbing and trimming. Couldn't imagine trimming with oil. Eeeek! I'll run my saw maybe 10-15 total days before cleaning it out. Then I'll trim while the coolant is clear. Sure is a pleasure just dumping out the snot behind the house and rinsing it out with the garden hose. Even better is just rinsing our hands/slabs with clean water after handling. Larry, I have a Covington 10" as well. Do you add anything to the water or is it just water that you are using as a coolant? How does the spray work? If I don't keep mine covered, it can spray up the wall. Do you have any trouble with rust?
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Post by johnjsgems on Nov 14, 2013 12:25:24 GMT -5
Larry is using the EZ Cut right now. He also likes a product from Kingsley North. Best way to avoid spraying is to not overfill the blade compartment. Open the Koolerant control valve to just cover the blade rim.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2013 15:39:10 GMT -5
is your feed buggered up or do you need to dress your blade?
This is exactly how my experience progressed. I thought I had a feed problem, then realized I needed to dress theblade.
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Post by Rockoonz on Nov 14, 2013 22:47:00 GMT -5
Buggered up after 6 cuts using a new 303 blade?!? Well, I guess if you want to dress the blade every 6 cuts keep using water. I have been cutting for months on my 12 inch saw in oil, it's never been dressed. I will dress it when I clean it soon just in case.
Lee
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LarryS
freely admits to licking rocks
SoCal desert rats
Member since August 2010
Posts: 781
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Post by LarryS on Nov 15, 2013 13:59:49 GMT -5
Sorry didn't reply sooner but we were camping out in the desert, gathering more rocks. I use Kingsley North's Gem Lube mixed with water. Just started using Ez Cut from JS Gems that works just as good. No rust, lubes great and easy clean up. No way would you want to use this saw with oil while trimming with the hood off because I use this saw exactly what it's designed for, slabbing and trimming. Mel uses oil in his 10" Covington and has to cover it with a towel to keep the oil mist down. Like John said, you can control the coolant level with that knob. What I do is just leave the knob open and add as needed. I didn't like the original Covington hood with the large side openings. It cracked and wasn't going to spend $100 for a new one. This saw was designed to cut glass and rock. I made my own hood using plywood covered in boat resin (WalMart) and made a viewing window made of Lexan from Home Depot. Saw runs quiet and the mist stays inside where it belongs.
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Tom
fully equipped rock polisher
My dad Tom suddenly passed away yesterday, Just wanted his "rock" family to know.
Member since January 2013
Posts: 1,557
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Post by Tom on Nov 15, 2013 21:44:15 GMT -5
No no, the blade is dressed in great shape and will make lots more cuts I think. The feed buggered up when I was using oil about a week ago. I had a rock jam, that tripped the motor overload. I likely did not check saw for an hour so the feed kept running and wore down the half nut that rides on the threaded rod. Let me get the saw fixed, parts on the way, well ordered anyway. Let me put a few hours on the blade to see if I like or dislike the water. I will report back as soon as I can
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Tom
fully equipped rock polisher
My dad Tom suddenly passed away yesterday, Just wanted his "rock" family to know.
Member since January 2013
Posts: 1,557
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Post by Tom on Nov 17, 2013 13:23:14 GMT -5
Bump
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LarryS
freely admits to licking rocks
SoCal desert rats
Member since August 2010
Posts: 781
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Post by LarryS on Nov 17, 2013 14:03:03 GMT -5
Scott's test didn't count, he gave up. His blade was old and in bad shape. My 10" Covington is power feed. And all I cut is local extremely hard jasp/ag, nothing else. I'm a happy camper and will never use messy oil.
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Tom
fully equipped rock polisher
My dad Tom suddenly passed away yesterday, Just wanted his "rock" family to know.
Member since January 2013
Posts: 1,557
|
Post by Tom on Nov 17, 2013 14:23:13 GMT -5
Well I am sure willing to let someone else try, I found it worked great on softer stones. It did cut hard rocks but only small pieces. Once I put in a piece (about half the LS12's capacity) it bogged down and screwed up for me. I kind of disagree that Scott's test does not count. He was cutting with happy results with oil (even with old blade) but not happy when using water. Lets face it none of the tests are conducted in a lab LOL. I would have been so so so very happy if this worked for my, I really wanted it too. I found enough oil at home to get the saw running. I am dressing the blade now, if it cuts the agate that the water could not, then I know it was the water not working. Anyway, someday I hope some genius comes up with something Thanks for the recommendation Larry. Tom
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Post by johnjsgems on Nov 17, 2013 14:55:21 GMT -5
So, did you try it with oil and the saw without replacing the clutch parts?
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Tom
fully equipped rock polisher
My dad Tom suddenly passed away yesterday, Just wanted his "rock" family to know.
Member since January 2013
Posts: 1,557
|
Post by Tom on Nov 17, 2013 15:41:47 GMT -5
Yep I did John, or rather attempted to cut the same agate. The clutch slips using oil as well. The leading edge of the blade is moving out of alignment about1/8 inch in less than one inch cut depth. At that point the clutch slips, same damb thing with the water. So now whats wrong with saw? Looks like its adjusted properly, any tips to set it up proper. I had to change a bearing when my old blade dished. According to my steel straight edge this new blade is fine (I sure hope so)
So what now? I have to re-neg and say the jury is still out with water vs. oil. So what do I do to the saw? clamping the clutch will not work as I tried that with the water mix and it just jammed the blade, or would have if I was not there. If I clamp the clutch with oil it will do the same thing.
Tomorrow I will get two new bearings, I will check the arbor shaft but I watched the blade running dry and there is no wobble on the blade. I am at a loss as to what to do, help please:)
Tom
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2013 16:19:03 GMT -5
I am in the testing phase on my Lortone 12 right now. I have an old cheap blade that cut to the outside with oil and you won't believe it but it did the same with the water. lol I had alined the blade a couple of times and it still did the same. I have (dressed) the blade, (wonkid) the blade (bent) the blade, (hammered) the blade and cussed the blade to no avail. The damn thing cuts so smooth that I almost don't have to polish but it still cuts to the left. I had cheap blades in the past that worked great and made a lot of cuts but I guess that trying to go on the cheap has come to an end. I am going to get a new blade from John and see how it goes.
My carriage is so worn out that it moves like crazy and I am wondering if it has worn to the point that it is swinging around and causing the cutting to the left. I am going to drill a hole and tap it so I can tighten down a bolt every time I reset so I can see if the slop is the problem. If it is I guess I am going to have to bite the bullet and rebuild the damn thing. Hopefully I can drill out the holes and put in bigger shafts. If anyone has done a carriage fix on a Lortone please let me know how it went. Jim
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LarryS
freely admits to licking rocks
SoCal desert rats
Member since August 2010
Posts: 781
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Post by LarryS on Nov 17, 2013 18:02:38 GMT -5
I had to replace the arbor on my Covington after about 2 years usage. Sealed bearings had so much slop, you could wiggle the blade & shaft. Now the second one is starting to wear a little. Covington may be using cheap Chinese bearings or something. If this is the case, I'll take it to a machine shop and have them press in some good ones. Having a sloppy arbor will cause the blade to jam, especially when you're cutting large hard rocks.
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Tom
fully equipped rock polisher
My dad Tom suddenly passed away yesterday, Just wanted his "rock" family to know.
Member since January 2013
Posts: 1,557
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Post by Tom on Nov 17, 2013 18:40:35 GMT -5
Mine is doing the same thing with water or oil, I am going to change out the bearings just because I know my dished blade wore one out and I used that blade after I changed the bearing. Right now the blade seems tight, seems straight and seems sharp. Its made maybe fifteen cuts since new. Its not a cheapie, its a 303. So something is up, help appreciated. How is your water test working Jim? Larry your bearings need pressing on? they are not set screw collar type. I feel for you buddy I have changed out the rock that has been causing trouble, maybe its a huge diamond:) After Saskatchewan kicks Calgary's butt in the CFL final, real football you know, I will try to cut another hard stone. Thanks everyone Tom
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2013 18:40:54 GMT -5
I have replaced the bearings twice in three years on mine. I probably run the belt too tight but it is quieter that way. I just go to the auto parts store here to get my bearings and they are pretty cheap but it is all they have. Jim
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