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Post by Pat on Feb 1, 2014 16:33:28 GMT -5
We have a lot of end pieces. We want to glue them to 2/4"s so we can slab the ends. What kind of glue should be used to do this?
I want glue that will hold and that will let go when finished. Also need to know how to separate the 2x4 and the last slab.
Thanks.
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QuailRiver
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since May 2008
Posts: 1,640
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Post by QuailRiver on Feb 1, 2014 18:16:15 GMT -5
I've used both 15 minute epoxy (allowed to cure overnight) and Elmer's Yellow Wood Glue (allowed to cure a couple of days). I first make sure all of the oil residue is cleaned off of the glue face of the rock and have never had either glue fail. But I do trust the epoxy more. But with either of those glues I have found getting that last slab off of the wood block isn't worth the trouble so I make sure the left over slab is very thin. I try to make sure that the wood glue block face is as parallel as possible to the blade when I mount the blocked rock in the vice. Then adjust the cross feed to where a cut would leave 1/16" thick or so slab material on the block. Then back the cross feed away from the blade by turning the crank the number of rotations necessary to create the number of slabs that can be produced from the rock. Larry C.
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Post by Peruano on Feb 1, 2014 21:05:24 GMT -5
Pat, Quailriver has given you some good advice. Almost any wood glue will work and can be encouraged to release when desired. I use standard wood glue (let it cure overnight at least and as stated remove oil from the surface to be glued). Gorilla glue is also great. It foams a bit so it fill irregularities if you don't have an exactly smooth face to be glued. Soak it in water overnight Or two nights, and it will usually pop off with minimal scrapping action needed to remove residue. I have found that the freeze thaw process accelerates the release of my wood glue stubs (an advantage of winter in NM). Epoxy sounds like overkill to me, but . . . ? Tom
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Post by kap on Feb 1, 2014 21:21:05 GMT -5
I always use Gorilla glue with no problems.
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Post by victor1941 on Feb 1, 2014 22:20:16 GMT -5
I use sodium silicate with very good results to work end cuts. I glue clean rock end cuts to both 2x4 and/or 4x4 with a good floating bond to prevent any voids. This bond is allowed to cure overnight. Once cut I then soak the remaining end cut in water that has some dish washing soap added to help release the rock slab in two to three days. Sodium silicate is easy to use and gives a very strong bond. The wood piece can easily be cleaned and reused.
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quartz
Cave Dweller
breakin' rocks in the hot sun
Member since February 2010
Posts: 3,359
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Post by quartz on Feb 1, 2014 23:18:57 GMT -5
I use sodium silicate [waterglass] too, and put the last piece and board in boiling water, Releases in about 2 minutes and cleans easily. Haven't had a bond failure yet. I do the water up on a hotplate outside so as to stay on good side of wife.
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SJPatrick
starting to spend too much on rocks
2 1/2 years into rock hounding and I'm still a newbie!
Member since September 2013
Posts: 124
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Post by SJPatrick on Feb 2, 2014 2:30:33 GMT -5
I too have been using 40% sodium silicate. It works great and is fairly inexpensive. I use the same method as victor1941. I picked up a gallon on ebay for $36 and free shipping. It came in four 1 quart bottles. The senior center, where I cut some rocks, bought 2 of them from me to replenish their supply. I haven't tried boiling water to separate the ends from the 2x4s. Cold water with a little dish soap has been releasing the end piece in less than 12 hours for me. Some people don't like to reuse the 2x4 piece. But I haven't had any problems reusing them after they dry out.
One funny thing you might read about sodium silicate when looking for it is that it is used to disable automobile engines. Cash for clunkers programs want to make sure the clunkers they take in don't make it back out on the road. So they replace the engine oil with a couple quarts of sodium silicate and run the engine. It damages the engine, permanently preventing it from running.
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RockIt2Me
has rocks in the head
Sometimes I have to tell myself, "It's not worth the jail time."
Member since December 2009
Posts: 668
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Post by RockIt2Me on Feb 2, 2014 8:13:16 GMT -5
I use gorilla glue on 2X4 because it expands so you don't have to have a flat surface to glue to. I use my radial arm saw to slice it off, then soak in water to clean it up. I will have to try the sodium silicate for flat end cuts.
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Post by sheltie on Feb 2, 2014 9:10:59 GMT -5
I just dop them. When I'm through, I remove as much of the oil on the 2x2 as possible, put it in the freezer and the next day I tap the remainder of the end piece and it comes right off.
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Tommy
Administrator
Member since January 2013
Posts: 12,989
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Post by Tommy on Feb 2, 2014 10:46:58 GMT -5
Wood glue for me - I glue a bunch of them up at the same time and let them set for days until I'm ready to cut. Once in a while this method breaks my heart by letting go in the saw but for the most part it works well. I just toss them in a bucket of water for a few days after and they usually come right off.
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LarryS
freely admits to licking rocks
SoCal desert rats
Member since August 2010
Posts: 781
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Post by LarryS on Feb 2, 2014 11:38:28 GMT -5
Been cutting end pieces most of this week. I too use good old Elmers yellow wood glue. Always have a dozen blocks sitting out on the patio or soaking in the water bucket.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Feb 2, 2014 12:19:48 GMT -5
I haven't done a lot of slabbing yet. What I have done, I've done mostly by hand. Is there an advantage to gluing over using a slab grabber? It seems like gluing is sort of a pain if a slab grabber works just as well.
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Post by sheltie on Feb 2, 2014 12:26:07 GMT -5
I haven't done a lot of slabbing yet. What I have done, I've done mostly by hand. Is there an advantage to gluing over using a slab grabber? It seems like gluing is sort of a pain if a slab grabber works just as well. Given a choice between the two methods, I'd rather use a slab grabber. However, there are MANY times that a grabber will not work and that is where the adhesive (dop in my case) comes in.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Feb 2, 2014 12:49:16 GMT -5
Thanks, I've never used a slab grabber. It makes sense that it wouldn't grab everything.
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Tommy
Administrator
Member since January 2013
Posts: 12,989
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Post by Tommy on Feb 2, 2014 13:17:37 GMT -5
However, there are MANY times that a grabber will not work and that is where the adhesive (dop in my case) comes in. Sheltie are you saying you use green dop wax to stick them to the board? I've never tried that but I've got a bunch of wax left since I switched to crazy glue and might have to try it. Doesn't that get prettty expensive over time?
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Post by 1dave on Feb 2, 2014 13:56:13 GMT -5
I toss a pile of them in a form and pour Mortar Mix over them. That way I can do a pile at once and not have to mess with them one at a time. Paint the form with diesel fuel for easy release. The mortar mix snaps away from the rock slabs, especially if they still have a little oil on them.
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Post by Pat on Feb 2, 2014 15:05:31 GMT -5
Lots of good advice here, and lots to consider. I'm saving all the suggestions. We'll be working on it next weekend hopefully. Thanks, everybody!
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Post by sheltie on Feb 3, 2014 9:15:09 GMT -5
However, there are MANY times that a grabber will not work and that is where the adhesive (dop in my case) comes in. Sheltie are you saying you use green dop wax to stick them to the board? I've never tried that but I've got a bunch of wax left since I switched to crazy glue and might have to try it. Doesn't that get prettty expensive over time? That's the stuff. I try to use a slab grabber, and I do most of the time, but when I can't I dop it. I suppose it could get expensive if you used a bunch of it but so far it hasn't turned out that way for me. The used dop is thawed and heated to be used again.
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ash
spending too much on rocks
Prairieville, Louisiana
Member since July 2012
Posts: 361
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Post by ash on Feb 4, 2014 15:02:32 GMT -5
I use waterglass as well. I let it sit overnight and then when through just toss it in some warm water with dishwashing soap, lets go of the wood in an hour or so, or sooner maybe cause I don't check on it. I reuse the wood blocks. Only problem I ever have is some of them have nail holes in them and the SS goes through, one day I'm gonna forget it an stick it to the table lol
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bsky4463
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since September 2013
Posts: 1,696
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Post by bsky4463 on Feb 4, 2014 21:55:26 GMT -5
Ayup...I use sodium silicate (water glass) as well. Water release. Score the end of the wood block - helps with bond and release.
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