miander
spending too much on rocks
Searching for the shop of my dreams...
Member since November 2013
Posts: 407
|
Post by miander on May 25, 2014 10:44:00 GMT -5
I know I am showing my lack of geologic knowledge why I ask this, but here it goes. I was wondering if there is asbestos in all serpentine. I did some research because I have self collected a lot of rock that seem to be serpentine, and I also have some unidentified rocks with asbestos veins. Should I get rid of all of them?
|
|
|
Post by jakesrocks on May 25, 2014 11:19:32 GMT -5
If you're going to cab them, it's best to wear a good dust mask and use plenty water. Some serpentine will work up without shedding a lot of fibers, but better safe than sorry. You only have one set of lungs.
|
|
|
Post by mohs on May 25, 2014 12:40:27 GMT -5
if you choose to get rid of them send my way...mostly I got a chunk of rock from Beef that is chrystotile (sp) it as these really cool silicified asbestos lines in it added This a large chunk of Chrysotile I believe it’s related to serpentines…mostly I’m sure those are asbestos fiber that are silicified I’ll never cut the rock probably So won’t know if its just a surface phenomena.
|
|
|
Post by snowmom on May 25, 2014 16:34:56 GMT -5
Spouse was for many years a certified asbestos inspector. It is my understanding that if the asbestos is encapsulated or in its original form, it is not dangerous, but handling and certainly grinding and tumbling and polishing can release small fibers into the air and they can contaminate an entire area. Proper protective respirators, strong ventilating fans, saws or polishers which use water to control dust are strongly recommended. Once the stuff is in the air as dust it can be spread everywhere, your living quarters, other clothing- if you get dust on your clothes, etc. Careful with where you dispose of your slurry if you decide to tumble or grind it , that waste can dry and spread asbestos fibers too. safety first! I have a few stones that I believe have asbestos as well as a couple which seem to be mostly all asbestos. Interesting to look at, and if undisturbed probably safe.
|
|
miander
spending too much on rocks
Searching for the shop of my dreams...
Member since November 2013
Posts: 407
|
Post by miander on May 25, 2014 16:50:40 GMT -5
if you choose to get rid of them send my way...mostly I got a chunk of rock from Beef that is chrystotile (sp) it as these really cool silicified asbestos lines in it added This a large chunk of Chrysotile I believe it’s related to serpentines…mostly I’m sure those are asbestos fiber that are silicified I’ll never cut the rock probably So won’t know if its just a surface phenomena. [br I have some like that, I think it goes all the way through...
|
|
|
Post by Pat on May 25, 2014 17:03:22 GMT -5
I collect serpentine. Being a rock, not a specific mineral, It comes in lots of forms and ingredients. Some has asbestos, and some does not.
By the way, it is California's State Rock.
|
|
|
Post by mohs on May 25, 2014 17:06:58 GMT -5
well that the evident fiber so you wouldn't want breathe any...mostly here's a slab I carved a heart from it came out good w/those fibers having schiller effect
|
|
Sabre52
Cave Dweller
Me and my gal, Rosie
Member since August 2005
Posts: 20,471
|
Post by Sabre52 on May 25, 2014 18:38:40 GMT -5
Neat specimen Mr. Mohs! Used to be a mine in California yielding California Tiger eye and heard the AZ stuff called Arizona Tiger eye. Both silicified asbestos I guess. The California material was really pretty with lots of flash.. Never seen the AZ stuff as a finished stone.....Mel
|
|
miander
spending too much on rocks
Searching for the shop of my dreams...
Member since November 2013
Posts: 407
|
Post by miander on May 25, 2014 23:15:39 GMT -5
I collect serpentine. Being a rock, not a specific mineral, It comes in lots of forms and ingredients. Some has asbestos, and some does not. By the way, it is California's State Rock. Yep, I know Pat. The powers that be almost voted to cancel it, but they didn't. I did a little research and found out that there are three different kinds of serpentine, one of them being asbestos.
|
|
|
Post by 150FromFundy on May 26, 2014 16:37:05 GMT -5
Serpentine is a family of minerals. Varieties include chrysotile, picrolite, retinalite, antigorite, marmolite, ophiolite and williamsite.
To the best of my knowledge, the only one you have to worry about is the chrysotile. This is serpentine in its fibrous and silky form that is commonly referred to as asbestos. The material is so soft that you can scratch fibers from a vein with your fingernail. It can easily become airborne and if inhaled can lead to a very specific cancer that can be traced back to asbestos exposure.
Better safe than sorry. Wear a mask and avoid the silky stuff.
Darryl.
|
|
|
Post by mohs on May 26, 2014 17:13:30 GMT -5
So what your telling me Darryl is I should quit sniffing my crysotile? mostly
|
|
|
Post by 150FromFundy on May 26, 2014 19:46:39 GMT -5
Not so sure, Mr. Mohs! As a kid, I scratched my asbestos with great fascination watching the fluff come off on my fingernails. I've made it to 50, so far. (Knock on Arizona Rainbow Wood.) I guess (hope) concentration and duration of exposure have more to do with it.
Darryl.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 26, 2014 21:43:24 GMT -5
Not so sure, Mr. Mohs! As a kid, I scratched my asbestos with great fascination watching the fluff come off on my fingernails. I've made it to 50, so far. (Knock on Arizona Rainbow Wood.) I guess (hope) concentration and duration of exposure have more to do with it. Darryl. I would not be too worried. It's occupational exposure that caused the problems. Repeated exposure to the dust and even then only a very specific range of particle size is an issue. Too small and it can't harm you, too big and your lungs can clear it out with a bit of mucous and a cough. The "right sized" particles hang around and cause the damage. I am told that even a "single" particle will cause cancer. Horse malarkey. No way a species evolves with such sensitivity to environmental damage. Evolution weeds that out.
|
|
|
Post by mohs on May 26, 2014 21:59:52 GMT -5
. (Knock on Arizona Rainbow Wood.) Darryl. that's gotten me down the road also I will admit though I got this strange tic after grinding cinnabar, few hives after malachite, and my breathing a bit shallow but that may all just be old age I always sniff a rock before before I lick just to make sure nothing urinated on it very wise mostly and lots not talk about old age & urinary problems
|
|
barclay
has rocks in the head
Lowly Padawan of rocks
Member since November 2011
Posts: 510
|
Post by barclay on May 28, 2014 20:16:48 GMT -5
The first time I gave a presentation to my rock club it was on toxic rocks. It opened more than a few eyes. I used to be on the inspection team that specialized in asbestos inspecting. Let me clear up a few things for everyone. Serpantine, chrysotile, crocidolite (blue tigereye), amosite, actinolite and tremolite are the main types of asbestos, most were used on a commercial basis. That does not mean the other kinds of asbestos are safe, it just means that that particular variety was not commercially used so the health effects have not been studied. I don't know of any toxicological studies done about rock hounds or people who do lapidary. There are not that many of us. Believe it or not asbestos was the first documented workplace exposure hazard identified. A Roman noticed that slaves working in an asbestos mine died a lot quicker than slaves in other mines.
If you are cutting/sanding/polishing asbestos there is no safe way to do that. All the water, fans and dust masks will not do you any good. The fibers are so small you can't see them. once the muck in your grinder dries out fibers can become airborne again. Mother Nature is rarely consistent. If you have a solid looking chunk of serpentine you have no idea what you will find once you start grinding on it. The guys who are removing sprayed on acoustic ceiling with an asbestos content of 3% - 7% are wearing full tyvek suits and respirators. There is a reason for that and it isn't just regulations. The problem is that you are breathing chemically resistant fibers and they are finding out that it is not just asbestos that causes cancer and other bad health effects. A couple of fibers in the wrong place can give you cancer and kill you. It is not just asbestos that is dangerous. For you non-believers google erionite. This is the latest mineral fiber that has been has been shown to cause cancer. The safety term to describe these things are vitreous fibers. I don't think you will find any references that say "safe vitreous fibers", it is just different flavors of bad.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 20:35:49 GMT -5
The guys who are removing sprayed on acoustic ceiling with an asbestos content of 3% - 7% are wearing full tyvek suits and respirators. There is a reason for that and it isn't just regulations. Yes, it is. When I worked for the home remodelling company we sold popcorn ceiling removal. None of the workers wore these suits. Not one. Ever. They laughed at the guys who did. A couple of the guys have been at it (either applying or removing it) for 45 years (61 & 62 years old). They can work most white men into the grave.
|
|
miander
spending too much on rocks
Searching for the shop of my dreams...
Member since November 2013
Posts: 407
|
Post by miander on May 28, 2014 22:11:38 GMT -5
Thanks for the feedback everyone. I think I'll just get rid of all the serpetine I have just in case, I have 10 year old twin girls and the baby girl is 8 - they are all shameless rock lickers like their mom. It's a shame, I have some really interesting pieces, but I'd hate for anything to happen to them because of my rock addiction. Thanks again everyone!
|
|
|
Post by vegasjames on May 28, 2014 22:17:16 GMT -5
Not so sure, Mr. Mohs! As a kid, I scratched my asbestos with great fascination watching the fluff come off on my fingernails. I've made it to 50, so far. (Knock on Arizona Rainbow Wood.) I guess (hope) concentration and duration of exposure have more to do with it. Darryl. I would not be too worried. It's occupational exposure that caused the problems. Repeated exposure to the dust and even then only a very specific range of particle size is an issue. Too small and it can't harm you, too big and your lungs can clear it out with a bit of mucous and a cough. The "right sized" particles hang around and cause the damage. I am told that even a "single" particle will cause cancer. Horse malarkey. No way a species evolves with such sensitivity to environmental damage. Evolution weeds that out. Studies have actually shown that asbestos does not cause cancer (mesothelioma) on its own. Asbestos is a co-factor in mesothelioma caused by simian vacuole virus type 40 (SV40). SV40 contaminated the polio vaccines given to 90 million Americans in the 50s and 60s and has been linked to a variety of cancers.
|
|
miander
spending too much on rocks
Searching for the shop of my dreams...
Member since November 2013
Posts: 407
|
Post by miander on May 28, 2014 22:29:27 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by mohs on May 28, 2014 22:41:50 GMT -5
I'm dead man grinding rocks mostly send thee serpentine to me I'll take some cinnabar too I like to mix my poisons
|
|