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Post by rockjunquie on Jun 10, 2014 11:09:06 GMT -5
This may be a difference in opinions based on folks that live in dense population centers versus those who have not been raised and treated like subordinates to the point that they accept this abuse of their rights. My experience, having never lived in a rural environment, is that you learn real quick to fear the police and avoid them at all cost or you give in and bleat like a sheep. Not all of us in the cities bow to the tyranny. Speaking of sheep-- remember- "If you ain't cop, you're little people."
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grayfingers
Cave Dweller
Member since November 2007
Posts: 4,575
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Post by grayfingers on Jun 10, 2014 11:55:26 GMT -5
Of course you are right that not all urbanites are conformists. The majority are conditioned to group-think, The opposite has been the norm for rural people, though that is changing too. Rugged Individualism as opposed to being a cog in the greater organism.
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Post by washingtonrocks on Jun 10, 2014 12:11:28 GMT -5
Apparently, there was a missing woman in the area the police were searching for. This, according to a comment by the actual uploader of the video...I'm assuming she found this out after the fact. Either way, I completely agree with others here who think we're on a bit of a slippery slope by so often giving up our 4th Ammendment Rights in exchange for "safety" or cracking down on crime.
Ben Franklin made a great quote about this: "Those who surrender freedom for security will not have, nor do they deserve, either one."
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Post by vegasjames on Jun 10, 2014 17:05:31 GMT -5
This may be a difference in opinions based on folks that live in dense population centers versus those who have not been raised and treated like subordinates to the point that they accept this abuse of their rights. My experience, having never lived in a rural environment, is that you learn real quick to fear the police and avoid them at all cost or you give in and bleat like a sheep. Not all of us in the cities bow to the tyranny. Speaking of sheep-- remember- "If you ain't cop, you're little people." Yes, you are right and the police admit it all the time when they say they "protect their own". When they say their own they are not talking about the other citizens they are being paid by to serve and protect. For instance, how many people are aware that families of police officers are given special cards so if they are pulled over for breaking the law such as speeding or running red lights they just flash their card and they don't get ticketed. I guess the Constitution and the 14th Amendment that says "equal protection under the law" means nothing to law enforcement. Same with judges who have illegally given themselves a supposed judicial immunity. Again, the 14th Amendment makes giving oneself immunity an illegal act unless everyone can grant themselves immunity, which would provide equal protection. Constitutional law overrides any Federal or State law. In fact, the Supreme Court had it right back in the 1800s when they ruled that any judge who violates the rights of either party has committed treason against the Constitution, fraud against the State and both parties and any orders and/or judgements are null and void since the person is acting outside of a judicial authority and therefore have no power to enforce any order or judgement. Police should be held in the same manner. They are being paid to enforce the laws and protect the public equally. When they commit illegal acts they are acting outside of their job description and thus outside any implied legal protection and should be arrested and tried just like any other citizen. For example, I mentioned earlier about police in Northern Nevada and were forcing innocent people to relinquish their money under threat of being arrested, having their vehicles towed and all their money and money orders, etc confiscated if they did not sign a waiver abandoning the money. So here we have a clear case of coercion, extortion, theft, grand larceny, harassment , and literally highway robbery being committed by the police in Northern Nevada. Yet not one officer has ever been arrested. They were supposedly punished, but the Sheriff refuses to say how the officers were punished claiming it is an internal affair. They are our employees and as our employees we have every right to know what our employees are up to, how they are utilizing the money we give to find them and whatever punishments if any are given for officers violating the law. The people who were robbed were forced to sue the police department to get their stolen money when the illegally obtained money should have been returned to the rightful owners without having to sue. I wonder how many people just gave up because they knew attorney fees would exceed what they were robbed of or that being out of state it would be to difficult to go back and forth fighting a Court case? Here is another great example of a cop and a hearing master getting away with criminal acts. The cop was fired even though anyone else would have gone to prison and he is now suing to get his job back, Note how the victim was presumed guilty, which is how the cop initially got away with it until other reports of his molesting women surfaced: www.8newsnow.com/story/21557505/cover-up-alleged-in-clark-clark-family-court
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Post by vegasjames on Jun 10, 2014 17:10:11 GMT -5
Apparently, there was a missing woman in the area the police were searching for. If that is his reason for questioning her then there should have been no problem with his saying we are looking for a missing woman. It is not like his mission was top secret. In fact, missing people reports are put on the news media and amber alerts all the time. I would also be interested in seeing if this woman even got close to matching the description of the "missing woman". And all he had to do is state we are looking for a missing woman, are you __________?
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Post by parfive on Jun 10, 2014 19:25:30 GMT -5
“We were actually strategizing to put all the women up at the front. If they’re gonna start shooting it’s going to be women that are gonna be televised all across the world getting shot by these rogue federal officers.”
Yup. Looks like that there rugged ain’t as rugged as it used to be. : )
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Post by rockjunquie on Jun 11, 2014 14:19:27 GMT -5
Let's look at the whole quote- (pasted from HuffPo)
I'm not excusing nor condemning what this lone wolf had to say, but I don't think what he said validates your point that they ain't as rugged as they used to be. In fact, he seems to be suggesting that he is willing to give his life for his cause. Like any zealot, he espoused what amounts to terrorist tactics against an overwhelming enemy. You know, like hiding weapons in mosques and schools. Or, in the case of the Patriots, hiding behind trees in camouflage in wait for the redcoats- strictly unconventional.
I'm just guessing here, but I suspect that many of the women would have been glad to volunteer.
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Post by parfive on Jun 11, 2014 16:40:59 GMT -5
Well, one of ‘em did . . . at CiCi’s Pizza.
[Different quote, btw. Looks like HuffPo used Richard Mack. The one I used was attributed to a James Donald Lardy/Lordy from Montana.]
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grayfingers
Cave Dweller
Member since November 2007
Posts: 4,575
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Post by grayfingers on Jun 11, 2014 17:13:29 GMT -5
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Post by vegasjames on Jun 11, 2014 17:54:47 GMT -5
I find it interesting that the FBI is now considering all Sovereign Citizens as domestic terrorists because of the actions of these couple of radicals. What they are overlooking is that there will always be people who are too radical. There have even been police officers who have gone on killing sprees. Does this mean we should label all police officers as domestic terrorists? Well, if we use the same rational as the FBI is using then definitely, the police are domestic terrorists!!!!
In fact, one of the biggest sources of domestic terrorists that we have always had is the U.S. government. For example, how many times have they been caught doing testing on its own citizens? The synthetic bacteria experiments of the 50s where they sprayed U.S. cities with dangerous bacteria to see how they could deliver germ warfare agents. The Tuskegee Alabama syphilis experiments where they deliberately infected U.S. citizens with syphilis then deliberately withheld available cures so they would take the syphilis home and spread it to other people to test the effects. The LSD experiments that went on for decades on military and civilians without their knowledge. The drug induced hypnosis experiments on Vietnam veterans to see if they could be programmed to commit suicide upon returning home. The Hanford reactor radiation releases that went on for about 50 years to test the effects of radiation on the general population. The testing of radiation on military and civilians during the atomic testing at Yucca Flat. They almost got away with similar radiation experiments on the Natives of Alaska until the plot got exposed. These are just SOME of the cases that were discovered. How many more of these terrorist acts were commenced by the U.S. government that have not been uncovered yet?
All the Sovereign Citizen movement has been doing is standing up for the rights that they should have that the government keeps denying them. For example, we are supposed to have the right to peaceful protest under Constitutional law. Yet, when Bush was in office the Denver police were videotaping protesters exercising their rights to peaceful protest against the war. When the protesters were being identified they were being put on terrorist watch lists simply because they were exercising their Constitutional rights. They are not terrorists. The terrorists are the politicians, judges, police and others who keep trampling the Constitution and our Constitutional rights.
Do I agree with what these two did? No, not at all. There are other ways to stand up for our rights without killing. In fact, we saw this at the Bundy Ranch. People stood up for their rights facing off against the government terrorists who kept attacking defenseless individuals who again were only standing up for their rights. They won for now without anyone ever firing a shot or getting killed. And the only people injured were those attacked unprovoked by BLM officials including the pregnant woman who was attacked by BLM officials without provocation. The fact that the FBI and police departments are only targeting the protestors and not going after the BLM officials who clearly and deliberately broke the law just proves that the government supports domestic terrorism.
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