jamesp
Cave Dweller 
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,602
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Post by jamesp on Jul 7, 2014 9:22:22 GMT -5
Your attention to quality will always be in your favor Tela. It is odd how some people will buy a name before quality though. My wife has the coral wrap you made. I think she would kill for it. she puts it in the special box  |
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Post by 1dave on Jul 7, 2014 10:55:36 GMT -5
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Post by rockjunquie on Jul 7, 2014 12:28:20 GMT -5
Thanks jamesp, but I think that has as much to do with it being one of her honey's rocks. |
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Autumn
starting to shine!
Member since July 2014
Posts: 47 
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Post by Autumn on Jul 8, 2014 21:52:38 GMT -5
After reading this threat a couple times, I upped my prices on the 2014 items. I'm selling totally online right now, so it's not too difficult. I use Eni Oken's Excel calculator, and it's ssssoooo much better than my old system. Just don't make the mistake I did for over a year and put the "wholesale" price for your selling price, rather than the "retail" one.  |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2014 21:16:45 GMT -5
Autumn, welcome to the site. This is a great bunch of folks here. I hope you stick with us. You do not know me yet. Please do not take offense to the post I make below. I have an unusual sense of humor and your post about upping prices tickled my jokester reflex. ohhh... and I love your name! Autumn is a pretty name for a woman. One of my top ten favorite names for women. After reading this threat a couple times, I upped my prices on the 2014 items. I'm selling totally online right now, so it's not too difficult. I use Eni Oken's Excel calculator, and it's ssssoooo much better than my old system. Just don't make the mistake I did for over a year and put the "wholesale" price for your selling price, rather than the "retail" one. So you upped your prices.... ehhh? Is that like saying................... "I upped my income, so up yours"! |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2014 21:22:32 GMT -5
Hi Folks; I was asked privately to review this thread to see if I have anything to add. I was party to the thread this was childed from. My post there was appropraitely excised and placed here. I have not much to add. This is a nice thread. I like it. I will add one small thing for a bit of perspective. The image I place below is from Don. He made the cab and the wrap and sold it for $300. It's obsidian. While it is truly gorgeous and stands on it's own, this image illustrates how the price of the finished piece is/can/should be be truly independent of the cost of the original source stone. That is to say, if the cab and the wraps are executed well, then a standard formula for "cost plus markup" need not apply. Just because you'd never pay $300 for an obsidian wrap, doesn't mean your clients won't. You are NOT your own customer. Don't ask "what would I pay for this?" but instead "what would [my best customer] pay for this?" Kudos to Don.  |
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Autumn
starting to shine!
Member since July 2014
Posts: 47
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Post by Autumn on Jul 16, 2014 0:49:32 GMT -5
Is that like saying................... "I upped my income, so up yours"! Haha, no offense taken. I didn't raise my prices because others did. I raised my prices because, after reading this thread, re-evaluating my calculations and comments customers have made, I realized my items were still under-priced. It wasn't as simple as saying "I'll raise mine too!", even though it seems that way.  I thought about it first! ^.^ Some prices I left alone, but most of them I raised. Selling items at wholesale price instead of retail (bless Eni Oken) is rather foolish. |
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Post by takecouragedesigns on Oct 30, 2014 11:16:56 GMT -5
Wow! I can't tell you how helpful this thread is! I logged in here with sort of a general query in mind about how 14k gold filled wire can tarnish, but found this thread instead. I AGONIZE over how to price my jewelry, and currently use a formula of 2.5X cost of materials, give or take. I've been told my prices are too low, but then end up "sitting" on some of them forever, so it's all confusing. Like many others here, I'm sure, I'd been figuring my time only on the time it takes to actually design and make a piece- not the photo, ebay bidding, etc! I stand corrected. Thank you so much, Tela for bringing up this much needed topic of discussion. It's so frustrating when other artisans don't value their work enough, so that it drags everyone else's down. Just the other day, I saw a Argentium wrapped peruvian pink opal pendant, WITH a SS chain included, up for sale at $22.00! NO ONE can compete with that! Nuf said. Thanks everyone!  link |
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Don
Cave Dweller
He wants you too, Malachi.
Member since December 2009
Posts: 2,616
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Post by Don on Oct 30, 2014 11:32:52 GMT -5
Hi Folks; I was asked privately to review this thread to see if I have anything to add. I was party to the thread this was childed from. My post there was appropraitely excised and placed here. I have not much to add. This is a nice thread. I like it. I will add one small thing for a bit of perspective. The image I place below is from Don. He made the cab and the wrap and sold it for $300. It's obsidian. While it is truly gorgeous and stands on it's own, this image illustrates how the price of the finished piece is/can/should be be truly independent of the cost of the original source stone. That is to say, if the cab and the wraps are executed well, then a standard formula for "cost plus markup" need not apply. Just because you'd never pay $300 for an obsidian wrap, doesn't mean your clients won't. You are NOT your own customer. Don't ask "what would I pay for this?" but instead "what would [my best customer] pay for this?" Kudos to Don. ] Thanks Scott, I missed this thread somehow. I will add, know your margins front and back on all items, and play to the market. Each market is is unique and has it's own challenges; if you can be responsive to that, you'll do better overall. |
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bonzie64
off to a rocking start
Member since August 2015
Posts: 4
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Post by bonzie64 on Aug 24, 2015 15:48:26 GMT -5
Wonderful ideas! I read through lots - didn't make it all the way down. Would greatly appreciate some input, though. I don't purchase my stones for wirewrapping. My husband and I travel all over the state looking for all the beautiful rocks we can find. Round trip, it is usually a minimum of 5 hours round trip travel time. We usually spend another 4-5 hours at the site gathering (chopping/digging). Once we get the rocks home, I clean them off; then, when I have at least 4 hours, I cut and trim the rocks to get them ready for the tumbling process. As you all know, the tumbling process takes at least 4 weeks - often 6-8 weeks depending on the rocks. After all that is done, THEN, I can plan and design a necklace or pendant. Needless to say -- my question is; how do I price for all of that? Just general guidelines would be greatly appreciated, as I am rather new at this. Thanks!
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Aug 24, 2015 18:39:56 GMT -5
Wonderful ideas! I read through lots - didn't make it all the way down. Would greatly appreciate some input, though. I don't purchase my stones for wirewrapping. My husband and I travel all over the state looking for all the beautiful rocks we can find. Round trip, it is usually a minimum of 5 hours round trip travel time. We usually spend another 4-5 hours at the site gathering (chopping/digging). Once we get the rocks home, I clean them off; then, when I have at least 4 hours, I cut and trim the rocks to get them ready for the tumbling process. As you all know, the tumbling process takes at least 4 weeks - often 6-8 weeks depending on the rocks. After all that is done, THEN, I can plan and design a necklace or pendant. Needless to say -- my question is; how do I price for all of that? Just general guidelines would be greatly appreciated, as I am rather new at this. Thanks! My opinion is that collecting of your rocks is the hobby part. If I fly to Montana and stay over night in a hotel and then spend 5 hours collecting 3 pounds of agates they are still only worth the same amount as if I ordered them online. I guess my point is that no matter how much time you spent collecting and tumbling your rocks they are still only worth the going rate of said rocks online. I sell tumbles of mixed rock from all around the world at about $12 a pound so there's a good starting point. Chuck |
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Post by orrum on Aug 25, 2015 5:50:33 GMT -5
Retail involves several laws. Like supply and demand. Yall know this one.
Another one is opportunity cost. This one is is easy too.
Another is marketplace income level. Example dont go to the flea market expecting to sell 250 high end wraps.
Another is the retailers need for cash flow. If you have no need for cash flow you can sell high end wraps at the flea market and wait days for a buyer.
Another is fashion fade. Remember when k-1 kerosene heaters came out, they sold like hotcakes but now you can't hardly find them.
And always remember "location location location"!!!
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Post by captbob on Aug 25, 2015 11:13:27 GMT -5
Wonderful ideas! I read through lots - didn't make it all the way down. Would greatly appreciate some input, though. I don't purchase my stones for wirewrapping. My husband and I travel all over the state looking for all the beautiful rocks we can find. Round trip, it is usually a minimum of 5 hours round trip travel time. We usually spend another 4-5 hours at the site gathering (chopping/digging). Once we get the rocks home, I clean them off; then, when I have at least 4 hours, I cut and trim the rocks to get them ready for the tumbling process. As you all know, the tumbling process takes at least 4 weeks - often 6-8 weeks depending on the rocks. After all that is done, THEN, I can plan and design a necklace or pendant. Needless to say -- my question is; how do I price for all of that? Just general guidelines would be greatly appreciated, as I am rather new at this. Thanks! My opinion is that collecting of your rocks is the hobby part. If I fly to Montana and stay over night in a hotel and then spend 5 hours collecting 3 pounds of agates they are still only worth the same amount as if I ordered them online. I guess my point is that no matter how much time you spent collecting and tumbling your rocks they are still only worth the going rate of said rocks online. I sell tumbles of mixed rock from all around the world at about $12 a pound so there's a good starting point. Chuck Chuck is much more tactful than I am (read: nicer), so I'll flat out say it. Your time is irrelevant to the buyer. If someone can produce a stunning wire wrapped cab in 30 minutes, should I pay someone else more - for the exact same quality work - if it takes them twice as long? We recently went through something like this here when a member was wanting to sell boxes of mediocre quality rocks for 50 bucks, figuring they were worth that because he had to go out and collect them. SO? Like I care? They are still just a box of so so rocks. I figure he GOT to go out rock hounding where he thought it was a chore or something to be paid for. Not. Kinda surprised he didn't want to charge for the millions of years it took the rock to be created... Bottom line is you price for the quality of your work - the finished product. Not the time it took start to finish. Chuck hit the nail on the head. If you can buy the rock on line, apply your talents to it (wire wrap - whatever) and sell it for X Why would I pay more than X simply because you chose to expand or complicate the process by doing all the preliminary work yourself? If I can find a tumbled rock online for $5, the fact that YOU found and tumbled it does not make it worth $10 to me. Enjoying the drive and the hunt along with the time spent together may have to be part of your payment, or you may end up sitting on quite a pile of over priced inventory. Price as you wish, the market will tell you soon enough if you are being reasonable. |
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Post by rockjunquie on Aug 25, 2015 13:31:57 GMT -5
Really great input guys!!! Brings up a whole new facet to this (no pun intended).
When you put in all the work yourself to hunt down and finish the rocks you use, you can use that time and effort to give you an idea of its worth TO YOU. Then you have to see what the market will bear. If it takes you $50 in resources to collect a stone which is worth 10, then you really can only charge 10- unless that particular example has incredible eye appeal. BUT, the same holds true in reverse. If you easily found a 50.00 rock for 10 in resources, then, by all means, charge what the market will bear and take your profit like a true capitalist- or, try to undercut the guy who had to spend 50-- whatever. Point is, it will always be what the market will bear. One has to keep in mind a few outliers like curb appeal and perceived value, too. Those things are less tangible and trickier to figure, but it is usually where the best profit is. (I went to add something else and had a brain fart, so I may be back to add more.)
edit- I remembered- As far as doing all your own work, you may just have to break even or take a slight loss and call it the price for the entertainment of it since it is a hobby you enjoy. Or, you may have to step up what you offer so you can ask more for it.
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Post by orrum on Aug 25, 2015 14:59:54 GMT -5
Bravo Tela!!! So much good info in one short paragraph!!! Short, true, and to the center of the matter!
I wanna be a wealthy capitalist but..... Gonna have to master the art of no flats and no scratches!!!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2015 17:29:10 GMT -5
You guys in general, nobody specific, are already applying some of these principles.
It takes x minutes to cab and wrap a material. Wire costs are similar no matter what material you choose, so you choose to wrap larimar and charoite and high end agates. This because they will make you more dollars per minute than $2/# Davis creek obsidian.
Plus the higher priced stones have better curb appeal, eye candy really! And sell faster.
Other times, you see a nice slab of a lower price material and cab that one for variety and because it is just FUN! Why not? It's your time and investment. Make it fun.
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Post by rockjunquie on Aug 26, 2015 10:47:02 GMT -5
You guys in general, nobody specific, are already applying some of these principles. It takes x minutes to cab and wrap a material. Wire costs are similar no matter what material you choose, so you choose to wrap larimar and charoite and high end agates. This because they will make you more dollars per minute than $2/# Davis creek obsidian. Plus the higher priced stones have better curb appeal, eye candy really! And sell faster. Other times, you see a nice slab of a lower price material and cab that one for variety and because it is just FUN! Why not? It's your time and investment. Make it fun. Yup, guilty. I know some people might think I am a rock snob, but as for jewelry- I try to use what I think will sell. Generally, it has to have name recognition and eye appeal. But, I love all rocks and will cab some that I like but that might not sell. And, for the record, I think a nice Davidson Creek rainbow would sell pretty well. |
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bonzie64
off to a rocking start
Member since August 2015
Posts: 4
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Post by bonzie64 on Aug 28, 2015 17:24:11 GMT -5
Thanks so much for all your valuable input on pricing!! I actually did start out with simply a hiking hobby, which turned into rockhunting. Now, it's evolved into jewelry making. So - if I understand all your suggestions, I should go online and find out what similar stones cost and use that figure. I know what I pay for wire and findings, so that's not a problem. Then, charge for my time wrapping and eye appeal. Am I getting it right? Thanks again so much!
Forgot to mention.... I don't wrap cabs, I individually wrap 5 to 7 stones, then attach them all and add matching chain or leather cord to make up the length. So, it does take me a while to make each necklace, unless I wrap a pendant and put it on a leather strap or cord. So, again, I guess the plan is to charge for my time wrapping, right?
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Post by rockjunquie on Aug 29, 2015 21:35:30 GMT -5
Thanks so much for all your valuable input on pricing!! I actually did start out with simply a hiking hobby, which turned into rockhunting. Now, it's evolved into jewelry making. So - if I understand all your suggestions, I should go online and find out what similar stones cost and use that figure. I know what I pay for wire and findings, so that's not a problem. Then, charge for my time wrapping and eye appeal. Am I getting it right? Thanks again so much! Forgot to mention.... I don't wrap cabs, I individually wrap 5 to 7 stones, then attach them all and add matching chain or leather cord to make up the length. So, it does take me a while to make each necklace, unless I wrap a pendant and put it on a leather strap or cord. So, again, I guess the plan is to charge for my time wrapping, right? Can you post a picture of what you are making? It would make more sense that way. |
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bonzie64
off to a rocking start
Member since August 2015
Posts: 4
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Post by bonzie64 on Aug 30, 2015 13:52:22 GMT -5
Thanks so much for all your valuable input on pricing!! I actually did start out with simply a hiking hobby, which turned into rockhunting. Now, it's evolved into jewelry making. So - if I understand all your suggestions, I should go online and find out what similar stones cost and use that figure. I know what I pay for wire and findings, so that's not a problem. Then, charge for my time wrapping and eye appeal. Am I getting it right? Thanks again so much! Forgot to mention.... I don't wrap cabs, I individually wrap 5 to 7 stones, then attach them all and add matching chain or leather cord to make up the length. So, it does take me a while to make each necklace, unless I wrap a pendant and put it on a leather strap or cord. So, again, I guess the plan is to charge for my time wrapping, right? Can you post a picture of what you are making? It would make more sense that way. |
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I thought about it first! ^.^ Some prices I left alone, but most of them I raised. Selling items at wholesale price instead of retail (bless Eni Oken) is rather foolish. 
