13' 4" gator caught in L. George last week

That lake needs thinning. Too many gators. This one stimated at 30 years old and yes, hurts to see the kings taken.
I wish they would make them kill 11 feet and less, let those dinosaurs alone.
Apparently they can live much longer and get quite a bit bigger but hunters manage to nip them early.
A lot of those big guys get killed in canals, by residents. But go unrecorded because of the strict laws protecting them.

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14' is the practical maximum for American alligators. A few will go a little over. If 20' gators existed skulls would remain and morphometrics would be applied to tell us so. I'm won't deny it, but do doubt it.

jamesp

Not necessarily wild skulls, but those from hunting expeditions, (trophys) and also museum specimens.

Allisnaps?

Easily 70-90 years. Could be many more. The huge ones are all male. Can't explain why... Usually in turtles the females are larger. Bigger female lays more eggs, passes her genes on.

Tom. Are you aware of combat in male alligator snapping turtles?

Whoops, I was assuming that I recalled correctly that female alligator snappers were the largest, but Mintons in Giant Reptiles say the males are probably larger, and Carr in his turtle book says that males are probably larger. What is true is that both sexes have long tails and they differ only in where the cloacal opening is located and hence are hard to sex. Thus reported sexual dimorphism may be suspect. I don't pretend to understand snapping turtle behavior but they are coooooool animals.

Huge allisnaps are all male. And they are the ones going on walkabout. The largest ones seem to be found going on walkabout way north up the Mississippi.....

I believe all Illinois records for the species are the large old males and the state has zero breeding population.

The species has a large tail, no doubt. The males have a vent outside the rim of the carapace, females inside. It is diagnostic and thus the species is easily sexed. I learned this from a huge allisnap farm owner in Louisiana.

Carr and Minton are so outdated as to be important only for historical value. Farming of almost all common species has added tremendous knowledge. Hands on beats field observation in many avenues.

Check out Bartram's drama. Gators don't act like this in modern times. amusing read. Perhaps they really were aggressive in 1790.




But ere I had half-way reached the place, I was attacked on all sides, several endeavouring to overset the canoe.

My situation now became precarious to the last degree: two very large ones attacked me closely, at the same instant, rushing up with their heads and part of their bodies above the water, roaring terribly and belching floods of water over me. They struck their jaws together so close to my ears, as almost to stun me, and I expected every moment to be dragged out of the boat and instantly devoured.

But I applied my weapons so effectually about me, though at random, that I was so successful as to beat them off a little; when, finding that they designed to renew the battle, I made for the shore, as the only means left me for my preservation, for, by keeping close to it, I should have my enemies on one side of me only, whereas I was before surrounded by them, and there was a probability, if pushed to the last extremity, of saving myself, by jumping out of the canoe on shore, as it is easy to outwalk them on land, although comparatively [they were] as swift as lightning in the water.

I found this last expedient alone could fully answer my expectations, for as soon as I gained the shore they drew off and kept aloof. This was a happy relief, as my confidence was, in some degree, recovered by it. On recollecting myself, I discovered that I had almost reached the entrance of the lagoon, and determined to venture in, if possible to take a few fish and then return to my harbour, while day-light continued; for I could now, with caution and resolution, make my way with safety along shore, and indeed there was no other way to regain my camp, without leaving my boat and making my retreat through the marshes and reeds, which, if I could even effect, would have been in a manner throwing myself away, for then there would have been no hopes of ever recovering my bark, and returning in safety to any settlements of men. I accordingly proceeded and made good my entrance into the lagoon, though not without opposition from the alligators, who formed a line across the entrance, but did not pursue me into it, nor was I molested by any there, though there were some very large ones in a cove at the upper end.

I soon caught more trout than I had present occasion for, and the air was too hot and sultry to admit of their being kept for many hours, even though salted or barbecued. I now prepared for my return to camp, which I succeeded in with but little trouble, by keeping close to the shore, yet I was opposed upon re-entering the river out of the lagoon, and pursued near to my landing (though not closely attacked) particularly by an old daring one, about twelve feet in length, who kept close after me.

And when I stepped on shore and turned about, in order to draw up my canoe, he rushed up near my feet and lay there for some time, looking me in the face, his head and shoulders out of water; I resolved he should pay for his temerity, and having a heavy load in my fusee, I ran to my camp, and returning with my piece, found him with his foot on the gunwale of the boat, in search of fish, on my coming up he withdrew sullenly and slowly into the water, but soon returned and placed himself in his former position, looking at me and seeming neither fearful or any way disturbed.

I soon dispatched him by lodging the contents of my gun in his head, and then proceeded to cleanse and prepare my fish for supper, and accordingly took them out of the boat, laid them down on the sand close to the water, and began to scale them–

— when, raising my head, I saw before me, through the clear water, the head and shoulders of a very large alligator, moving slowly towards me; I instantly stepped back, when, with a sweep of his tail, he brushed off several of my fish.

It was certainly most providential that I looked up at that instant, as the monster would probably, in less than a minute, have seized and dragged me into the river. This incredible boldness of the animal disturbed me greatly, supposing there could now be no reasonable safety for me during the night, but by keeping continually on the watch; I therefore, as soon as I had prepared the fish, proceeded to secure myself and effects in the best manner I could: in the first place, I hauled my bark upon the shore, almost clear out of the water, to prevent their oversetting or sinking her, after this every moveable was taken out and carried to my camp, which was but a few yards off; then ranging some dry wood in such order as was the most convenient, cleared the ground round about it, that there might be no impediment in my way, in case of an attack in the night, either from the water or the land; for I discovered by this time, that this small isthmus, from its remote situation and fruitfulness, was resorted to by bears and wolves. W-Bartram-CLR

Having prepared myself in the best manner I could, I charged my gun and proceeded to reconnoitre my camp and the adjacent grounds; when I discovered that the peninsula and grove, at the distance of about two hundred yards from my encampment, on the land side, were invested by a Cypress swamp, covered with water, which below was jointed to the shore of the little lake, and above to the marshes surrounding the lagoon, so that I was confined to an islet exceedingly circumscribed, and I found there was no other retreat for me, in case of an attack, but by either ascending one of the large Oaks, or pushing off with my boat.

—From Bartram’s Travels, published 1791

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Clealry the PT Barnum of alligators...

I did say a few will get bigger.

Just like shaquille O'Neill