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Post by grumpybill on Dec 6, 2017 23:02:14 GMT -5
I'm now the proud owner of one of the award winning ChicagoDave Lot-Os. Won't be firing it up for a while. Won't have enough stones out of the course barrels for a week or so. And I need to get some appropriate tape for mounting it on the 58lb block I liberated from a pallet of leftovers that I found in my former employer's warehouse. So... Sit back, relax and stay tuned to watch my learning curve, experiments, screw-ups and total failures.
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jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,341
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Post by jamesp on Dec 7, 2017 2:08:34 GMT -5
Great choice Bill.
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Post by orrum on Dec 7, 2017 9:57:07 GMT -5
Mounted mine with paneling glue. Remember to paint the cinder block top. Biggest tip I can give you is to use lots of ceramics.
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Post by grumpybill on Dec 7, 2017 10:46:38 GMT -5
I used a "ground face/polished" concrete block which is very smooth on one 8" x 24" side, but gave it a coat of paint just to be safe. Thought about using silicone adhesive, but found a roll of thin foam double-sided tape this morning.
Are ceramic pellets necessary if I use lots of pea-size (and smaller) already polished stones in the mix? Seems to work in my rotary barrels.
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jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,341
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Post by jamesp on Dec 7, 2017 11:00:15 GMT -5
I used a "ground face/polished" concrete block which is very smooth on one 8" x 24" side, but gave it a coat of paint just to be safe. Thought about using silicone adhesive, but found a roll of thin foam double-sided tape this morning. Are ceramic pellets necessary if I use lots of pea-size (and smaller) already polished stones in the mix? Seems to work in my rotary barrels. To be blunt, what works in the rotary is apples or oranges or orangoutangs if you prefer. You will be looking for super micro polish in the vibe. Bon voyage my friend. Oh. The media. I used little polished agate/quartz media on last 2 runs of obsidian. To each his own. I believe most use ceramic in the Lot-O and win all the contests...
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Post by captbob on Dec 7, 2017 11:04:41 GMT -5
orangoutangs? ![::)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/eyesroll.png)
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Post by Jugglerguy on Dec 7, 2017 11:30:49 GMT -5
I used a "ground face/polished" concrete block which is very smooth on one 8" x 24" side, but gave it a coat of paint just to be safe. Thought about using silicone adhesive, but found a roll of thin foam double-sided tape this morning. Are ceramic pellets necessary if I use lots of pea-size (and smaller) already polished stones in the mix? Seems to work in my rotary barrels. I use ceramic pellets, but there was a woman on here (forget her name) a couple years ago who had excellent results with tumbled aquarium gravel, so that will probably work for you. Just make sure that your little rocks don't have any grit trapping voids in them. Ok, I went and found the discussion with ingawh about using gravel in the Lot-O.
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ChicagoDave
has rocks in the head
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Member since June 2016
Posts: 720
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Post by ChicagoDave on Dec 7, 2017 11:36:52 GMT -5
You must now represent RTH in the tumbling contest next year. We expect nothing less than first place. The 2018 contest announcement should be happening soon!
On a side note, I guess they didn't like my picture with the trophy. We still get to see Rob when visiting their page!
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Post by rmf on Dec 7, 2017 11:43:51 GMT -5
I always tell those that inquire never ever use fillers ... unless you have to. use the small stuff it is free. Only use fillers in the polish if you have problems getting a polish. I would never use ceramic pellets unless I was doing metal. You may want to experiment with plastic or wood or even indoor/outdoor carpet depending on what you are tumbling. For Agates and Jaspers you never need fillers just use the pea size material. What I recommend to newbies is to do two batches in coarse then mix them when you go to medium/220 grit. Use the leftovers on your next batch. (This is more for rotary than Vib tumblers) Vib tumblers not as sensative to loss of vol as rotary. The bulk of the loss in volumn happens during coarse, medium and fine grits are only to remove scratches from the previous grits.
I once had problems polishing TN puddingstone. I found putting a mixture of plastic pellets and pieces of indoor/outdoor carpet worked well. the problem was the chert polished fine but it scratched the Iron cement holding the chert. The carpet acted as a buff to the Iron and the plastic cushoned it enough to prevent the chert from scratching the Iron. Sometimes you just have to experiment.
My preferance is to tumble in coarse in a rotary until they are as rounded as I want. Then move to Vib. Vibs do not work real well in coarse. However if you need to keep a shape as close to original then vibs are the best. Also vibs do a much faster job on metal.
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Post by grumpybill on Dec 7, 2017 12:09:19 GMT -5
You must now represent RTH in the tumbling contest next year. We expect nothing less than first place. ![(lol)](//storage.proboards.com/1258779/images/rvHHPWFHP0EITYKIXVPg.gif) I'll need more than a few months of experience/practice/experimentation before I try running with the big dogs. Maybe in 2019...assuming I stay interested in this hobby that long.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Dec 7, 2017 12:19:53 GMT -5
I always tell those that inquire never ever use fillers ... unless you have to. use the small stuff it is free. Only use fillers in the polish if you have problems getting a polish. I would never use ceramic pellets unless I was doing metal. You may want to experiment with plastic or wood or even indoor/outdoor carpet depending on what you are tumbling. For Agates and Jaspers you never need fillers just use the pea size material. What I recommend to newbies is to do two batches in coarse then mix them when you go to medium/220 grit. Use the leftovers on your next batch. (This is more for rotary than Vib tumblers) Vib tumblers not as sensative to loss of vol as rotary. The bulk of the loss in volumn happens during coarse, medium and fine grits are only to remove scratches from the previous grits. I once had problems polishing TN puddingstone. I found putting a mixture of plastic pellets and pieces of indoor/outdoor carpet worked well. the problem was the chert polished fine but it scratched the Iron cement holding the chert. The carpet acted as a buff to the Iron and the plastic cushoned it enough to prevent the chert from scratching the Iron. Sometimes you just have to experiment. My preferance is to tumble in coarse in a rotary until they are as rounded as I want. Then move to Vib. Vibs do not work real well in coarse. However if you need to keep a shape as close to original then vibs are the best. Also vibs do a much faster job on metal. I can't say that I've ever tried anything but ceramics in my Lot-O, so you might be right. However, I think all of the winners of the World Rock Tumbling Competition in the past several years have used Lot-Os with ceramics. Ceramic media just works. Using other rocks is going to be much more variable and may or may not work as well. I would always suggest that beginners and experienced tumblers alike use ceramics. I don't have a problem with trying something else, but I know for a fact that ceramics work. I completely agree with rough tumbling in a rotary and finishing in a vibe.
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jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,341
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Post by jamesp on Dec 7, 2017 12:41:45 GMT -5
I agree with Rob. Go with tried and proven as a starter. It makes good sense.
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Post by grumpybill on Dec 7, 2017 12:52:55 GMT -5
Damn! Now I wish I'd included ceramics with my last Rock Shed order.
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Post by fantastic5 on Dec 7, 2017 13:14:38 GMT -5
Damn! Now I wish I'd included ceramics with my last Rock Shed order. I've used ceramics in my Lot-O, chunks of glass, iron garnets, and small hand sorted landscape river rocks. Out of everything, I use the polished landscape river rocks the most. I got a big bag at HD or Lowes, #50 for under $5. About a third of the bag is trash soft stones, about a third is broken or grit trappers, but that last 3rd is well rounded stones, just perfect for what I wanted. And much cheaper than the ceramics were. Grab a bag and learn the lot-o by polishing up your first batch to use as filler. Goes really quick because they are already rounded.
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Post by grumpybill on Dec 7, 2017 14:00:46 GMT -5
Thanks for the thread link, Jugglerguy . I'd read he first page or two earlier, but stopped before I got to that part. It also answered questions I had about thickeners.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Dec 7, 2017 15:31:35 GMT -5
Thanks for the thread link, Jugglerguy . I'd read he first page or two earlier, but stopped before I got to that part. It also answered questions I had about thickeners. The only thickener I use in my Lot-O is borax. I use 1 tablespoon of borax in each stage after 220. I've had excellent luck with this. If you need a step by step guide, let me know. I think Garage Rocker and Drummond Island Rocks use almost the exact same method as I do. We get very consistent results with hard rocks. Soft rocks are a different story.
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Post by grumpybill on Dec 7, 2017 16:06:13 GMT -5
Thanks, Rob.
I've read several recipes here. The general consensus seems to be: 2 Tbls 120/220 1/2 tsp 500 + 1 Tbls borax 1/2 tsp polish + 1 Tbls borax
There seems to be some disagreement over how long to run each stage. 1 day or 2?
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illusionist
starting to spend too much on rocks
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Member since August 2017
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Post by illusionist on Dec 7, 2017 18:12:59 GMT -5
I can't say that I've ever tried anything but ceramics in my Lot-O, so you might be right. However, I think all of the winners of the World Rock Tumbling Competition in the past several years have used Lot-Os with ceramics. Ceramic media just works. Using other rocks is going to be much more variable and may or may not work as well. I would always suggest that beginners and experienced tumblers alike use ceramics. I don't have a problem with trying something else, but I know for a fact that ceramics work. I completely agree with rough tumbling in a rotary and finishing in a vibe. I have done a batch without ceramics as an experiment. I just used a decent amount of small agates. I thought they were shiny but then did a second batch with ceramics and thought they were impossibly shiny. I will only use ceramics at this point for me.
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illusionist
starting to spend too much on rocks
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Member since August 2017
Posts: 137
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Post by illusionist on Dec 7, 2017 18:17:45 GMT -5
Thanks, Rob. I've read several recipes here. The general consensus seems to be: 2 Tbls 120/220 1/2 tsp 500 + 1 Tbls borax 1/2 tsp polish + 1 Tbls borax There seems to be some disagreement over how long to run each stage. 1 day or 2? I have tried a one day run for each stage in the Lot-O and compared it with a two day run for each stage. The two day was noticeably more shiny for me.
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Post by grumpybill on Dec 7, 2017 18:40:55 GMT -5
I'll probably do 2 day runs for my first batch, illusionist. Interesting that the Lot-O instruction booklet says " 24 hours, and no more" for the polish step.
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