NRG
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since February 2018
Posts: 1,688
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Post by NRG on Oct 28, 2018 16:38:21 GMT -5
The tiny piece if VS that I have scratches glass. That is all my diagnostics so far. vegasjames can you link me to the patent? I have a Japanese translator and will share the results. I am pretty sure I saved it off on my home computer but I am not home to find it. Helping my father out right now. I will have to look when I get home. đź‘Ťđź‘Ť |
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Post by vegasjames on Nov 6, 2018 2:25:11 GMT -5
Finally got back home last night. Been gone 3 weeks. Anyway, here is an article discussing Imori's patent: www.gemtreecreativedesigns.com/jewelryinfo/victoria-stone-part-1-page-5.html1955 Synthetic Stone Patent Dr. Iimori’s success in creating synthetic gemstones soon leads him to file a patent to protect his invention. Patent application number “Sho 30-000088” is titled "The Synthetic Manufacturing Process for Decorative Stone" is filed with the Japanese Patent Office (JPO) in 1952 and published in 1955. It covers the manufacturing process for Meta-jade, Cat’s Eye, and Victoria Stone, although the names of the stones were not present at the time. The names Meta-jade, Cat’s Eye, and Victoria Stone wouldn’t become a registered trademark (Japanese trademark registration No. 50957) for his invention until later in 1956. The patent describes (1) a basic component, (2) a mineralizing component, and (3) a crystallizing component as the key items in the synthesis process. Minerals and the ratios in which they were used are provided along with their heating temperatures and the product cooling cycle durations. The patent includes information pertaining to the crystal habit regulator that was a key component of the Victoria Stone synthesis. A description of the coloring process is included as guidance for modifying the base Meta-jade formula to make the Victoria Stone variation of IL-Stone. The patent also mentions the radioactive material Thorium Oxide as one of the materials that is used to induce the aggregate structure of radial crystals in the Victoria Stone manufacturing process. A number of laws currently regulate the possession of radioactive material in Japan making it extremely difficult to obtain by businesses, and impossible for the private citizen to possess. In the US the sale is controlled and limited to licensed entities, however the purchase of small amounts by private individuals is permitted on a yearly basis. The English translation of the patent has been provided by the Iimori family, it will be published in its entirety here on our website in part 2 of our Victoria Stone series.. The trade show flyer to the right (provided to us by the Iimori family) provides proof that the Meta-jade, Cat’s Eye, and Victoria Stone gemstones were introduced to the public as early as 1957 when they won the “Excellent Invention Award” from the Tokyo Metropolitan Invention Exhibition. Advertised as quality imitation gems that were economical in price, the stones quickly gained popularity. |
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QuailRiver
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since May 2008
Posts: 1,640
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Post by QuailRiver on Nov 6, 2018 16:13:25 GMT -5
Back when I was a pottery I experimented with Crystalline glazes with limited success. It's been many years but if I am remembering correctly one factor necessary to obtain good crystallization was an absence of alumina. And I used to use crushed natural rutile to seed the crystal growth. Also once peak temperature was reached to where the glaze became fluid the lid of the kiln would have to be propped open and the bung hole plugs removed for a fast cool down period or otherwise the fluid glaze would begin to run. It was during this quick cool down period that crystallization would occur. Once the temperature dropped to a certain point (which I can't remember off the top of my head) the kiln lid was closed and the bung holes closed and a slow cool from that point on was necessary to prevent crazing. There didn't used to be much literature available on how to grow crystalline glazes. I had found one with vague formulas in a book about an early western crystalline glaze pioneer AdelaĂŻde Alsop Robineau. If you ever find a piece of her crystalline glazed pottery it used to sell for $1,000 per inch of height. And that was thirty years ago. Also I used to know Phil Morgan (Phil Morgan Pottery of Seagrove, NC). Phil is one of the most accomplished crystalline glaze ceramic producers there has been. Here are a few examples of his: www.puttgarden.com/crystal/workshop/electric_reduction/attendees/others/DSC09272.jpgIn those days Phil protected his crystalline glaze secrets but from a current search it appears that he now participates in teaching workshops. In more recent years there have been several books on how to produce various types of cystalline glazes published that I imagine would be of benefit for anyone researching Imori's Victoria Stone production. One that I have and has very good detailed information is Macro-Crystalline Glazes: The Challenge of Crystals by Peter Ilsley. Larry C. |
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Post by vegasjames on Nov 6, 2018 16:37:16 GMT -5
Yes, for good crystallization there must be little to no alumina for a simple reason. The melt has to be fluid enough for migration to allow crystal growth. Too much alumina makes the melt too viscous for migration.
The crystallization range is 700-900C.
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NRG
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since February 2018
Posts: 1,688
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Post by NRG on Nov 7, 2018 10:08:22 GMT -5
Rutile is titanium dioxide.
Alumina is alimuminum oxide.
Does rutile have a similar effect?
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Post by vegasjames on Nov 7, 2018 14:32:15 GMT -5
Rutile is titanium dioxide. Alumina is alimuminum oxide. Does rutile have a similar effect? No titanium dioxide does not do this. But if combined with alumina in a melt the rutile can act as a nucleator for crytallization of alumina in the melt if only small amounts of the alumina are present to prevent the melt from being too viscous. |
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rottenbodhi
off to a rocking start
looking for rock trip buddies
Member since April 2024
Posts: 3
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Post by rottenbodhi on Apr 25, 2024 12:27:52 GMT -5
Finally got back home last night. Been gone 3 weeks. Anyway, here is an article discussing Imori's patent: www.gemtreecreativedesigns.com/jewelryinfo/victoria-stone-part-1-page-5.html1955 Synthetic Stone Patent Dr. Iimori’s success in creating synthetic gemstones soon leads him to file a patent to protect his invention. Patent application number “Sho 30-000088” is titled "The Synthetic Manufacturing Process for Decorative Stone" is filed with the Japanese Patent Office (JPO) in 1952 and published in 1955. It covers the manufacturing process for Meta-jade, Cat’s Eye, and Victoria Stone, although the names of the stones were not present at the time. The names Meta-jade, Cat’s Eye, and Victoria Stone wouldn’t become a registered trademark (Japanese trademark registration No. 50957) for his invention until later in 1956. The patent describes (1) a basic component, (2) a mineralizing component, and (3) a crystallizing component as the key items in the synthesis process. Minerals and the ratios in which they were used are provided along with their heating temperatures and the product cooling cycle durations. The patent includes information pertaining to the crystal habit regulator that was a key component of the Victoria Stone synthesis. A description of the coloring process is included as guidance for modifying the base Meta-jade formula to make the Victoria Stone variation of IL-Stone. The patent also mentions the radioactive material Thorium Oxide as one of the materials that is used to induce the aggregate structure of radial crystals in the Victoria Stone manufacturing process. A number of laws currently regulate the possession of radioactive material in Japan making it extremely difficult to obtain by businesses, and impossible for the private citizen to possess. In the US the sale is controlled and limited to licensed entities, however the purchase of small amounts by private individuals is permitted on a yearly basis. The English translation of the patent has been provided by the Iimori family, it will be published in its entirety here on our website in part 2 of our Victoria Stone series.. The trade show flyer to the right (provided to us by the Iimori family) provides proof that the Meta-jade, Cat’s Eye, and Victoria Stone gemstones were introduced to the public as early as 1957 when they won the “Excellent Invention Award” from the Tokyo Metropolitan Invention Exhibition. Advertised as quality imitation gems that were economical in price, the stones quickly gained popularity. Hello, I tried finding the patent and had no success. This is my first time using this website. I'd be interested in hearing your updates since these posts if you'd be willing to give me the time. Do you think a vacuum furnace would be needed to try and recreate Iimori stone? I heard apatite had been used for the latest simulants, what are your thoughts on that? Do you still believe the fibers in Iimori stone are asbestos, specifically tremolite? What do you potentially believe the crystallization's on the top and bottom are made of? Any idea on the crust of the boules? I agree it was for mold release or from a reaction - but would it need to be transferred between crucibles... oh, for seeding after melting? But then the crust would come from the 2nd crucible which would lead me to believe it was more for mold release. Him using thorium oxide makes a lot of sense, he would have easier access to it considering his selected field, but was it NEEDED to induce the aggregate structure of the radial crystals? If so, was this because of the viscosity of the molten mixture because of using aluminum oxide or do you believe another metal oxide was used to strengthen to prevent thicker viscosity? The use of thorium oxide is probably unknown to me because I don't know what the crystals are made of. Or because I have a lack of knowledge about thorium oxide. Would you say the stone is still of glass material, just not leaded? I when first learning about the subject thought the different colors of Iimori stone were from different nanoparticle sizes of silica, but that wouldn't be the case if a molten mixture was used with high pressure. The mixture must have contained different metals or inorganic salts for coloring? I have a lot of questions and thoughts. I have little time, funds, and knowledge on the subject to conduct my own experiments. I'm sorry if my lack of use of better terminology and my poor understanding of the subject makes what I've written seem like I'm a little kid banging around random tools on a workbench, but that's pretty much what it is. I've read through these posts on here and thought you had some great ideas and knowledge on the subject. I understand if you're too busy, have passed on interest in the subject, or do not wish to give answers to some of the questions I've asked. The last post I've seen was from 2018. Any time is appreciated. Was the thorium oxide used as a flux as well to keep the tremolite from melting or would the tremolite also be affected by the flux? Or was the thorium oxide just the crystal habit regulator? More and more questions as I think about it. |
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Post by rockjunquie on Apr 25, 2024 12:43:24 GMT -5
Finally got back home last night. Been gone 3 weeks. Anyway, here is an article discussing Imori's patent: www.gemtreecreativedesigns.com/jewelryinfo/victoria-stone-part-1-page-5.html1955 Synthetic Stone Patent Dr. Iimori’s success in creating synthetic gemstones soon leads him to file a patent to protect his invention. Patent application number “Sho 30-000088” is titled "The Synthetic Manufacturing Process for Decorative Stone" is filed with the Japanese Patent Office (JPO) in 1952 and published in 1955. It covers the manufacturing process for Meta-jade, Cat’s Eye, and Victoria Stone, although the names of the stones were not present at the time. The names Meta-jade, Cat’s Eye, and Victoria Stone wouldn’t become a registered trademark (Japanese trademark registration No. 50957) for his invention until later in 1956. The patent describes (1) a basic component, (2) a mineralizing component, and (3) a crystallizing component as the key items in the synthesis process. Minerals and the ratios in which they were used are provided along with their heating temperatures and the product cooling cycle durations. The patent includes information pertaining to the crystal habit regulator that was a key component of the Victoria Stone synthesis. A description of the coloring process is included as guidance for modifying the base Meta-jade formula to make the Victoria Stone variation of IL-Stone. The patent also mentions the radioactive material Thorium Oxide as one of the materials that is used to induce the aggregate structure of radial crystals in the Victoria Stone manufacturing process. A number of laws currently regulate the possession of radioactive material in Japan making it extremely difficult to obtain by businesses, and impossible for the private citizen to possess. In the US the sale is controlled and limited to licensed entities, however the purchase of small amounts by private individuals is permitted on a yearly basis. The English translation of the patent has been provided by the Iimori family, it will be published in its entirety here on our website in part 2 of our Victoria Stone series.. The trade show flyer to the right (provided to us by the Iimori family) provides proof that the Meta-jade, Cat’s Eye, and Victoria Stone gemstones were introduced to the public as early as 1957 when they won the “Excellent Invention Award” from the Tokyo Metropolitan Invention Exhibition. Advertised as quality imitation gems that were economical in price, the stones quickly gained popularity. Hello, I tried finding the patent and had no success. This is my first time using this website. I'd be interested in hearing your updates since these posts if you'd be willing to give me the time. Do you think a vacuum furnace would be needed to try and recreate Iimori stone? I heard apatite had been used for the latest simulants, what are your thoughts on that? Do you still believe the fibers in Iimori stone are asbestos, specifically tremolite? What do you potentially believe the crystallization's on the top and bottom are made of? Any idea on the crust of the boules? I agree it was for mold release or from a reaction - but would it need to be transferred between crucibles... oh, for seeding after melting? But then the crust would come from the 2nd crucible which would lead me to believe it was more for mold release. Him using thorium oxide makes a lot of sense, he would have easier access to it considering his selected field, but was it NEEDED to induce the aggregate structure of the radial crystals? If so, was this because of the viscosity of the molten mixture because of using aluminum oxide or do you believe another metal oxide was used to strengthen to prevent thicker viscosity? The use of thorium oxide is probably unknown to me because I don't know what the crystals are made of. Or because I have a lack of knowledge about thorium oxide. Would you say the stone is still of glass material, just not leaded? I when first learning about the subject thought the different colors of Iimori stone were from different nanoparticle sizes of silica, but that wouldn't be the case if a molten mixture was used with high pressure. The mixture must have contained different metals or inorganic salts for coloring? I have a lot of questions and thoughts. I have little time, funds, and knowledge on the subject to conduct my own experiments. I'm sorry if my lack of use of better terminology and my poor understanding of the subject makes what I've written seem like I'm a little kid banging around random tools on a workbench, but that's pretty much what it is. I've read through these posts on here and thought you had some great ideas and knowledge on the subject. I understand if you're too busy, have passed on interest in the subject, or do not wish to give answers to some of the questions I've asked. The last post I've seen was from 2018. Any time is appreciated. Welcome to RTH. I hope you get the responses you are looking for. |
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RWA3006
Cave Dweller 
Member since March 2009
Posts: 4,625 
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Post by RWA3006 on Apr 26, 2024 18:37:03 GMT -5
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flintstone
off to a rocking start
Member since March 2018
Posts: 3
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Post by flintstone on May 2, 2024 16:46:00 GMT -5
A patent! Amazing. Thanks. I don't know about Japanese patents, but in the US a patent that can be shown to be incomplete is invalid. It has to teach the best method, the one you actually used, or it can be broken.
Stories of the son's failure shouldn't stop you from trying the patented method many times.
I've thought about giving it a try but I didn't know where to start, but I've thought about it a lot.
I bought a couple small slabs in the 90s and when ever I found one, one of which had some remains of the crust.
My speculation was that the crust was a layer built up into the crucible before the molten material was poured in. I thought it might have been prepared with scattered seed crystals to start the growth. In my speculation, he had found a different mineral -with a higher melting point- that could act as a seed once the temperature dropped to the appropriate range.
I had never heard that it was cooled over such a long period. I've seen similar crystals grow in seconds from supersaturated aqueous solutions. Is that in the patent?
As for what minerals went into the melt, X-ray fluorescence analysis should help. I've seen people on Reddit volunteer to test interesting stuff gratis.
Regarding the use of thorium, it sounds unlikely. Wouldn't we have heard about the radioactivity? Surely stuff like this, coming out of Japan in the 50s & 60s, would have been scrutinized. I suppose it might have escaped notice if it were only in one rare color.
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