Chris Sikk
having dreams about rocks
Member since September 2021
Posts: 73
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Post by Chris Sikk on Sept 16, 2021 16:59:22 GMT -5
Hiya! Noob here.
As I said in my introduction, I have been collecting rocks and have decided to turn many into worry stones.
In the beginning, I was using my Dremel and some diamond bits, burrs, and disks to get the shape I wanted. I found the diamond disks were the most useful to get that finger or thumb concave spot in the rocks.
I got a ton of varying grits in wet sandpapers and went to town on polishing the rocks. The worry stones came out "alright." However, I wasn't super impressed with myself. Another batch, I tried carving the finger/thumb part of the worry stones and then putting them in a tumbler someone gifted me. I even spent some time with the various sandpapers on the concave portions before tumbling. After tumbling, I can see the issue. There are still very fine scratches on the concave portion. Thus, many of the stones have a decent polish, but that concave area is lacking.
Working with the diamond disks is likely contributing to these scratches. I am using the edge of the disk to cut that finger space. I've used a few diamond burs to smooth out the worst of the scratches, but it wasn't enough obviously.
My big idea was getting a large diamond ball burr. I ordered it and then I came here and started reading about the diamond pastes. I am wondering if this is a better idea. It seems the pastes come in different grit sizes which is nice.
In my impatience in waiting for my large ball burr, I found a stone ball burr that was sizeable to smooth out the concave sections. Would that scratch it worse or no? Hmm. It was cheap, I bought it and tried. The results were...well even. The concave section of the stones looked in a similar shape. Maybe I didn't need to buy the large diamond burr?
At last my friend the diamond burr came in the mail today. I ran it over some of my worry stones and I seem to be less impressed than the cheap stone burr. They seem to have micro scratches everywhere. That said, the stone burr could have been just roughing the whole area up.
Anyone have thoughts on making worry stones?
Diamond paste the way to go perhaps?
I am thinking the various grits of diamond paste may help get a better shine. The diamond bits I use almost seem too abrasive and the following stages of sandpaper, 100-20,000, do not get into the small scratches the bits create.
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rewdownunder
spending too much on rocks
Member since March 2012
Posts: 357
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Post by rewdownunder on Sept 16, 2021 18:21:41 GMT -5
+Could you post a few pictures. I find this very interesting. Thanks
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Sept 16, 2021 20:28:54 GMT -5
Diamond paste will work, but I would suggest that you make yourself some bits out of wood to use either the diamond paste or loose diamond mixed with something like vaseline to smooth out your worry stones.
I don't know what grit your diamond disc is, but realize that you need to progress all the way up the grits to get rid of the previous grit scratches in order to obtain a polish.
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Chris Sikk
having dreams about rocks
Member since September 2021
Posts: 73
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Post by Chris Sikk on Sept 17, 2021 14:35:39 GMT -5
Diamond paste will work, but I would suggest that you make yourself some bits out of wood to use either the diamond paste or loose diamond mixed with something like vaseline to smooth out your worry stones.
I don't know what grit your diamond disc is, but realize that you need to progress all the way up the grits to get rid of the previous grit scratches in order to obtain a polish.
I have cut up a dowel and glued sandpaper to the pieces to us with the rotary tool, but I was just not happy because I couldn't get everywhere in the concave space. Having sandpaper on a foam disk that allows it to flex has worked better. So I can certainly repurpose some of those for diamond paste.
The diamond disk is more of a cutting disk, than something for polishing. So I cut the shape and then progress with various sand papers. It would appear that I do not do enough at the early stages if there are micro scratches showing up later. I believed the cause was the fact that I am only using the edge of the disk. As such, each pass as I shape it is small cuts versus a "smooth" single pass. Thus, the purchase of the large ball burr. Again with the burr, it is a single grit, and then off to the sandpaper.
I like the paste idea you posted in other threads because I can find it in various grits. I feel like the transition from diamond tools to wet/dry sandpaper is not working, perhaps?
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NDK
Cave Dweller 
Member since January 2009
Posts: 9,440
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Post by NDK on Sept 22, 2021 14:19:45 GMT -5
Chris SikkI'm late to the party, as hummingbirdstones eluded to, it sounds like you're not spending enough time on each grit to remove the scratches from the previous grit. One thing to remember is SiC works stone much slower than diamond, so more time on each stage is most likely needed. Many people when cutting cabs or polishing flats will cover the area with pencil or marker (if not porous material). This will show scratches that are from the previous grit and tells you if you're ready to move in to the next step. Also, you didn't mention how you tumbled the worry stones. If you did not have a lot of very small media in there along with your worry stones there would be nothing to carry the grit into that divot besides the slurry which would be quite inefficient. Good luck moving forward, I applaud your perseverance!
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Chris Sikk
having dreams about rocks
Member since September 2021
Posts: 73
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Post by Chris Sikk on Sept 24, 2021 15:25:52 GMT -5
Chris Sikk I'm late to the party, as hummingbirdstones eluded to, it sounds like you're not spending enough time on each grit to remove the scratches from the previous grit. One thing to remember is SiC works stone much slower than diamond, so more time on each stage is most likely needed. Many people when cutting cabs or polishing flats will cover the area with pencil or marker (if not porous material). This will show scratches that are from the previous grit and tells you if you're ready to move in to the next step. Also, you didn't mention how you tumbled the worry stones. If you did not have a lot of very small media in there along with your worry stones there would be nothing to carry the grit into that divot besides the slurry which would be quite inefficient. Good luck moving forward, I applaud your perseverance! Love this! Thanks.
The pencil/marker idea is worth a try. Also, the comment on the SiC is so very useful. I thought I was spending a decent amount of time at each stage, but I was basing that on my passage of time, rather than having a decent look at the stones. (Recently bought some sexy magnifying goggles.) I think you are both right, more time is needed.
Early, I bought some sanding/polishing buffs that were #80-#400 that did the best job, but just were not getting me to a shine. When I moved the SiC paper I got far more finer grits, but the paper on a flat disc is likely less able to get in those finger/thumb shapes than those buffs I previously tried.
Since joining the site, I've gotten brave and done a few tests. The tumbler is doing a very, very, very, good job at getting to that thumb area of the worry stone in the first stage  Haha. Much of my work has disappeared! Flirting with the idea of doing a tumble. Shaping the worry stone and then going to stage 2 so that perhaps less of my carving disappears. Guess I should have bought a vibe tumbler when I upgraded. lol.
Off to do a deep dive on the diamond paste/compound here on the forum.
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Sept 24, 2021 22:12:03 GMT -5
You can make wood ball burs out of dowel. Cut to the length you want and use a coarse bastard file to form a ball at the end while it's spinning. You will need to make one for each size grit and keep them separate so they don't get contaminated with any other grit. Also, make sure to clean the stone really well in between the grits so you don't contaminate the next higher size grit.
The reason I'm kind of pushing the wood is because the diamond will imbed itself in the wood and once it's "charged" you will not need to use as much diamond to keep it charged. Also, the wood ones will last you a very long time. They literally take only a few minutes to make.
I just found this video, and although I would regular dowel and not balsa wood, it will kind of give you an idea of what I'm talking about.
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Chris Sikk
having dreams about rocks
Member since September 2021
Posts: 73
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Post by Chris Sikk on Sept 27, 2021 18:48:01 GMT -5
You can make wood ball burs out of dowel. Cut to the length you want and use a coarse bastard file to form a ball at the end while it's spinning. You will need to make one for each size grit and keep them separate so they don't get contaminated with any other grit. Also, make sure to clean the stone really well in between the grits so you don't contaminate the next higher size grit.
The reason I'm kind of pushing the wood is because the diamond will imbed itself in the wood and once it's "charged" you will not need to use as much diamond to keep it charged. Also, the wood ones will last you a very long time. They literally take only a few minutes to make.
I just found this video, and although I would regular dowel and not balsa wood, it will kind of give you an idea of what I'm talking about. Interesting. I had not thought about the diamonds being embedded. Those small, microscopic scratches have not treated me well, so I assumed a wool application would be better to get all the tough spots. Of course, that assumption is based on my frustration and ego thinking that I have been working the areas well enough.
I believe I have some dowel left from my sanding adventure. I will have to try this out. I got time, the paste is on its way.
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Post by jasoninsd on Sept 27, 2021 23:18:15 GMT -5
Chris Sikk I'm late to the party, as hummingbirdstones eluded to, it sounds like you're not spending enough time on each grit to remove the scratches from the previous grit. One thing to remember is SiC works stone much slower than diamond, so more time on each stage is most likely needed. Many people when cutting cabs or polishing flats will cover the area with pencil or marker (if not porous material). This will show scratches that are from the previous grit and tells you if you're ready to move in to the next step. Also, you didn't mention how you tumbled the worry stones. If you did not have a lot of very small media in there along with your worry stones there would be nothing to carry the grit into that divot besides the slurry which would be quite inefficient. Good luck moving forward, I applaud your perseverance! Love this! Thanks.
The pencil/marker idea is worth a try. Also, the comment on the SiC is so very useful. I thought I was spending a decent amount of time at each stage, but I was basing that on my passage of time, rather than having a decent look at the stones. (Recently bought some sexy magnifying goggles.) I think you are both right, more time is needed.
Early, I bought some sanding/polishing buffs that were #80-#400 that did the best job, but just were not getting me to a shine. When I moved the SiC paper I got far more finer grits, but the paper on a flat disc is likely less able to get in those finger/thumb shapes than those buffs I previously tried.
Since joining the site, I've gotten brave and done a few tests. The tumbler is doing a very, very, very, good job at getting to that thumb area of the worry stone in the first stage Haha. Much of my work has disappeared! Flirting with the idea of doing a tumble. Shaping the worry stone and then going to stage 2 so that perhaps less of my carving disappears. Guess I should have bought a vibe tumbler when I upgraded. lol.
Off to do a deep dive on the diamond paste/compound here on the forum.
I was grinding some cabs this evening and walked upstairs. My wife laughed at me...which isn't unusual...but I did question her as to why this time. I was wearing my Bluetooth headphones, reading glasses, and my "sexy" magnifying goggles over the glasses...all that along with a bad hair day. She said I looked like a "mad scientist"! |
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Chris Sikk
having dreams about rocks
Member since September 2021
Posts: 73
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Post by Chris Sikk on Oct 9, 2021 19:39:40 GMT -5
The diamond paste experiment is a learning process. As others have suggested in this forum, I got some silicone spray to make the paste stick to my tools and last longer. There has been progress, but I think I have jumped too far too quickly.
Buying the diamond cutting disks and tools on the cheap online results in me not typically knowing what grit size they are. Often they're just labeled "diamond coated" with no grit size. After poking around a bit, I see 120 grit is very common for those diamond coated dremel bits.
Essentially, I've cut the finger/thumb part of the worry stone with 120 grit. Then, I try my new paste which is starting around 500-600 grit. So, I am cleaning up the scratches left by 120 grit tools, but not getting the rock smooth.
3 of the 4 that I have been testing on look decent, which is exciting. However, I do think I need to take those back and use up my wet sandpaper between 120 and 600 to see if that helps.
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Post by knave on Oct 9, 2021 20:38:00 GMT -5
Do you have a tumbler ie a vibe ?
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Oct 9, 2021 23:10:10 GMT -5
The diamond paste experiment is a learning process. As others have suggested in this forum, I got some silicone spray to make the paste stick to my tools and last longer. There has been progress, but I think I have jumped too far too quickly.
Buying the diamond cutting disks and tools on the cheap online results in me not typically knowing what grit size they are. Often they're just labeled "diamond coated" with no grit size. After poking around a bit, I see 120 grit is very common for those diamond coated dremel bits.
Essentially, I've cut the finger/thumb part of the worry stone with 120 grit. Then, I try my new paste which is starting around 500-600 grit. So, I am cleaning up the scratches left by 120 grit tools, but not getting the rock smooth.
3 of the 4 that I have been testing on look decent, which is exciting. However, I do think I need to take those back and use up my wet sandpaper between 120 and 600 to see if that helps.
Chris you need a 220 or 240 grit diamond to use between the 120 and 500/600. It's too big of a jump from 120 to 500/600. |
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Post by stephan on Oct 9, 2021 23:30:15 GMT -5
Love this! Thanks.
The pencil/marker idea is worth a try. Also, the comment on the SiC is so very useful. I thought I was spending a decent amount of time at each stage, but I was basing that on my passage of time, rather than having a decent look at the stones. (Recently bought some sexy magnifying goggles.) I think you are both right, more time is needed.
Early, I bought some sanding/polishing buffs that were #80-#400 that did the best job, but just were not getting me to a shine. When I moved the SiC paper I got far more finer grits, but the paper on a flat disc is likely less able to get in those finger/thumb shapes than those buffs I previously tried.
Since joining the site, I've gotten brave and done a few tests. The tumbler is doing a very, very, very, good job at getting to that thumb area of the worry stone in the first stage  Haha. Much of my work has disappeared! Flirting with the idea of doing a tumble. Shaping the worry stone and then going to stage 2 so that perhaps less of my carving disappears. Guess I should have bought a vibe tumbler when I upgraded. lol.
Off to do a deep dive on the diamond paste/compound here on the forum.
I was grinding some cabs this evening and walked upstairs. My wife laughed at me...which isn't unusual...but I did question her as to why this time. I was wearing my Bluetooth headphones, reading glasses, and my "sexy" magnifying goggles over the glasses...all that along with a bad hair day. She said I looked like a "mad scientist"! What? No apron? NDK Chris Sikk I find that for porous stones metallic sharpie works well. It stays on the surface. Stay away from red and purple sharpie. They penetrate the stone deeply. |
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Post by Rockoonz on Oct 10, 2021 8:53:06 GMT -5
The wood dowel polishing burrs sound intriguing. Got me thinking about the scraps from the oak boards I use to replace the soft jaws on my saws and my hole saws with the centering drill removed (too big for threaded mandrels) instead of buying dowels, cheap rockhound that I am. I also have some 2" birch craft balls with center drilled flats somewhere that I bought for a cabochon topped gear shift knob project, occurs to me that they came in a variety of smaller sizes wherever I found them, probably ETSY.
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Chris Sikk
having dreams about rocks
Member since September 2021
Posts: 73
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Post by Chris Sikk on Oct 20, 2021 17:27:24 GMT -5
Chris you need a 220 or 240 grit diamond to use between the 120 and 500/600. It's too big of a jump from 120 to 500/600.
Yeah, I am trying find a process that will work going forward, but I may be putting the cart before the horse. I was hoping my tumblers could do some work for me, but they're very efficient at what they do. Thus, they have really polished my thumb/finger spots right out of the rock. I just have to keep experimenting, I guess.
I have done a single pass in the tumbler, cut a thumb/finger groove and then tried stage 2 and of course lost my work. After the fact, that makes a lot of sense. Hindsight is 20/20.
I have done 2 passes and cut the groove before stage 3 and lost my work as well. So perhaps I should try this again, but check the tumbler more often to find a possible sweet spot where the rock gets polished, but doesn't loose the groove?
Or you know, sell a kidney and get a proper lapidary machine.  |
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Oct 20, 2021 21:37:39 GMT -5
Chris you need a 220 or 240 grit diamond to use between the 120 and 500/600. It's too big of a jump from 120 to 500/600.
Yeah, I am trying find a process that will work going forward, but I may be putting the cart before the horse. I was hoping my tumblers could do some work for me, but they're very efficient at what they do. Thus, they have really polished my thumb/finger spots right out of the rock. I just have to keep experimenting, I guess.
I have done a single pass in the tumbler, cut a thumb/finger groove and then tried stage 2 and of course lost my work. After the fact, that makes a lot of sense. Hindsight is 20/20.
I have done 2 passes and cut the groove before stage 3 and lost my work as well. So perhaps I should try this again, but check the tumbler more often to find a possible sweet spot where the rock gets polished, but doesn't loose the groove?
Or you know, sell a kidney and get a proper lapidary machine.  Is your tumbler a rotary or vibe? |
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Post by stephan on Oct 20, 2021 23:09:53 GMT -5
Maybe I missed it, but what kind of stone are you working with?
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Chris Sikk
having dreams about rocks
Member since September 2021
Posts: 73
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Post by Chris Sikk on Oct 21, 2021 15:40:24 GMT -5
Do you have a tumbler ie a vibe ? Is your tumbler a rotary or vibe? I have 2 3lb rotary tumblers. With all the talk about vibe tumblers, I was curious if the finger/thumb groove would survive better in a vibe? Maybe I missed it, but what kind of stone are you working with?
You got me stephan ! For everything I have learned about rock hounding and tumbling in the past 2+ years, I still haven't done my due diligence to really familiarize myself with the rocks. I have been trying to feed the artist inside of me that has been pushed aside for many years by perfectionism. So, I see a rock and it says, "this is how I want you to carve me." I do not document hardness or try to figure out what it is because that seems very daunting to me. I should at least work with the hardness scale. I need to do better.  |
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Post by knave on Oct 21, 2021 16:02:10 GMT -5
The vibe tumblers smooth and polish the shape “as is” instead of rounding it. It is how I finish my own worry stones.
If a screwdriver can scratch into it, it’s soft material. Likely Mohs 5 or less.
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Post by stephan on Oct 21, 2021 19:20:31 GMT -5
Maybe I missed it, but what kind of stone are you working with?
You got me stephan ! For everything I have learned about rock hounding and tumbling in the past 2+ years, I still haven't done my due diligence to really familiarize myself with the rocks. I have been trying to feed the artist inside of me that has been pushed aside for many years by perfectionism. So, I see a rock and it says, "this is how I want you to carve me." I do not document hardness or try to figure out what it is because that seems very daunting to me. I should at least work with the hardness scale. I need to do better.  Hey! No shoulding on yourself!  Figuring out what you are working with may help with a diagnosis of your issues, though. |
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Haha. Much of my work has disappeared! Flirting with the idea of doing a tumble. Shaping the worry stone and then going to stage 2 so that perhaps less of my carving disappears. Guess I should have bought a vibe tumbler when I upgraded. lol. 
Haha. Much of my work has disappeared! Flirting with the idea of doing a tumble. Shaping the worry stone and then going to stage 2 so that perhaps less of my carving disappears. Guess I should have bought a vibe tumbler when I upgraded. lol. 
