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Post by Jugglerguy on Dec 6, 2022 15:19:13 GMT -5
A couple weeks ago, I posted a question about wiring a motor to replace one that I burned up on my Lortone ST-10. I finally got around to getting that one wired and now it's not working right. I had second thoughts about using it because it's not thermally protected anyway. So now I have to buy a motor. The owner's manual for the saw says to use a1725 rpm, 1/4 hp motor with a Nema 48 frame. I was talking to holajonathan about motors and he pointed out that the newer HP clone of the saw uses a 1/2 hp motor. I have found two motors that might work for me. 1. Teco 3500 rpm motor with two capacitorsThis one has two capacitors. I'm not sure why that might be better. It's also too fast, so I'd have to slow it down by using different pulleys. It's $100 including shipping, plus the cost of at least one pulley. 2. Dayton 1725 rpm motor with one capacitorThis one only has one capacitor, but is the right speed and is 1/3 hp. It's $150 with free shipping. Buying a cheaper item is always a plus, but the price difference isn't that much by the time I get new pulley, so I'd rather focus on just getting the best motor for the job. So which one would you buy? Thanks! |
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Post by perkins17 on Dec 6, 2022 19:04:57 GMT -5
Jugglerguy I would go with the Dayton. Cheaper most the time isn't better in the motor department, and I've heard good things about Dayton. My club runs the lortone ten inchers off Dayton 1/3 hp motors. More horsepower is probably better on saws bigger than 8 inches.  Hope that helps, -Nicholas
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brybry
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Post by brybry on Dec 6, 2022 20:04:30 GMT -5
The Dayton has a start capacitor only.
The other has a start & run capacitor.
You can easily run a 10" blade on a 1/4 or 1/3 HP motor. HP tends to overdo their motor sizes for whatever reason.
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QuailRiver
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Post by QuailRiver on Dec 6, 2022 20:15:44 GMT -5
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Post by Jugglerguy on Dec 6, 2022 21:28:01 GMT -5
The Dayton has a start capacitor only. The other has a start & run capacitor. You can easily run a 10" blade on a 1/4 or 1/3 HP motor. HP tends to overdo their motor sizes for whatever reason. What advantage is there to a run capacitor? Would it be good to have on this saw? |
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Post by Jugglerguy on Dec 6, 2022 21:30:24 GMT -5
The old motor didn't have the correct frame, although I did keep it. It had been cut to make the slots big enough to fit on this saw. I have bought used motors before, but they're not very easy to find where I live. I'm in a small town with nothing bigger within a two hour drive. I'm all for buying a good used motor, but I think it might be simpler to just buy one new. |
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quartz
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Post by quartz on Dec 7, 2022 0:10:34 GMT -5
If you are willing to buy the cheaper 1/4 horse motor, why the need for a 1/3 Dayton. I have an 8" and 10" saws and neither has a capacitor and I've never had a start problem. Look at the service factor too, 1/4 has a 1.15 and the Dayton has a 1.35, as does the 3K771 1/4 horse Dayton {$20 cheaper than the 1/3}, higher service factor translates to more robust windings.
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Post by oregon on Dec 7, 2022 0:16:51 GMT -5
I agree there has to be some decent deals on ebay if not at your local thrift store on some piece of hardware. Also a vote for staying away from 3000 rpm for various reasons.
THis particuluar motor is labeled ccw, it may be reversible, but believe that's the wrong direction for the LS-10/St-10.?
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QuailRiver
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Post by QuailRiver on Dec 7, 2022 9:46:56 GMT -5
I agree there has to be some decent deals on ebay if not at your local thrift store on some piece of hardware. Also a vote for staying away from 3000 rpm for various reasons.
THis particuluar motor is labeled ccw, it may be reversible, but believe that's the wrong direction for the LS-10/St-10.? Yes this motor is reversible. The label shows "CCW REV". So it's set up from the factory to be CCW but can be reversed by switching the wires. |
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Post by Jugglerguy on Dec 7, 2022 10:34:30 GMT -5
If you are willing to buy the cheaper 1/4 horse motor, why the need for a 1/3 Dayton. I have an 8" and 10" saws and neither has a capacitor and I've never had a start problem. Look at the service factor too, 1/4 has a 1.15 and the Dayton has a 1.35, as does the 3K771 1/4 horse Dayton {$20 cheaper than the 1/3}, higher service factor translates to more robust windings. Good point, I'll check that one out. The old motor was 1/4 hp. |
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brybry
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Post by brybry on Dec 7, 2022 11:08:51 GMT -5
The Dayton has a start capacitor only. The other has a start & run capacitor. You can easily run a 10" blade on a 1/4 or 1/3 HP motor. HP tends to overdo their motor sizes for whatever reason. What advantage is there to a run capacitor? Would it be good to have on this saw? Still learning the ins & outs of motors. The start capacitor gives it a boost at start up if I understand it correctly. |
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quartz
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Post by quartz on Dec 7, 2022 12:46:53 GMT -5
The start capacitor is there to provide a bit of stored power as a boost to turn motors that already have a load attached to them, some fans and pumps for instance. A saw shouldn't ever have to start under load, and once it's running the cap isn't really necessary. A run cap is there to smooth out the minor changes to the incoming power supplied to your machine, sort of like a shock absorber for when your neighbor turns all his Christmas extravaganza contest lights on all at once. The run cap soaks up a bit of power when the line is up in power and releases it when the power drops a bit to smooth out the average supply. It can also help keep a heavily loaded motor running.
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vance71975
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Post by vance71975 on Dec 7, 2022 12:56:25 GMT -5
A couple weeks ago, I posted a question about wiring a motor to replace one that I burned up on my Lortone ST-10. I finally got around to getting that one wired and now it's not working right. I had second thoughts about using it because it's not thermally protected anyway. So now I have to buy a motor. The owner's manual for the saw says to use a1725 rpm, 1/4 hp motor with a Nema 48 frame. I was talking to holajonathan about motors and he pointed out that the newer HP clone of the saw uses a 1/2 hp motor. I have found two motors that might work for me. 1. Teco 3500 rpm motor with two capacitorsThis one has two capacitors. I'm not sure why that might be better. It's also too fast, so I'd have to slow it down by using different pulleys. It's $100 including shipping, plus the cost of at least one pulley. 2. Dayton 1725 rpm motor with one capacitorThis one only has one capacitor, but is the right speed and is 1/3 hp. It's $150 with free shipping. Buying a cheaper item is always a plus, but the price difference isn't that much by the time I get new pulley, so I'd rather focus on just getting the best motor for the job. So which one would you buy? Thanks! Out of these two, The only thing I can tell you is that Dayton motors are top notch quality and are well worth the extra 50 bucks. My dad has a few in the garage that are well over 30 years old and still run like a champ. Plus you dont have to mess with a new pully on top of it. |
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Post by Jugglerguy on Dec 7, 2022 14:07:46 GMT -5
The start capacitor is there to provide a bit of stored power as a boost to turn motors that already have a load attached to them, some fans and pumps for instance. A saw shouldn't ever have to start under load, and once it's running the cap isn't really necessary. A run cap is there to smooth out the minor changes to the incoming power supplied to your machine, sort of like a shock absorber for when your neighbor turns all his Christmas extravaganza contest lights on all at once. The run cap soaks up a bit of power when the line is up in power and releases it when the power drops a bit to smooth out the average supply. It can also help keep a heavily loaded motor running. That's an excellent explanation. Thank you. By the way, I'm the neighbor you described. |
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Post by chris1956 on Dec 7, 2022 20:14:09 GMT -5
When I was working as an engineer, I learned that we always tried to specify lower speed electric motors because they typically lasted longer than higher speed motors. Looked this up on the internet and found a couple references that said the same. I think they normally cost more because they have more wiring (I could be wrong on that). Anyway, it may be why the slower speed motor in your case costs more. So slower speed may last longer if you use your saw a lot.
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rockbrain
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Post by rockbrain on Dec 7, 2022 23:10:56 GMT -5
Capacitor start motor has more starting torque but it also runs more efficiently and draws less amps while running than a comparable shaded pole motor. Running costs might not be a huge concern but less amps means less heat and longer life.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Dec 8, 2022 11:50:18 GMT -5
Thanks everyone. I ordered the Dayton motor. They had 15% off, so that helped. I did look at the Dayton 1/4 hp motor, but it was out of stock, so I went with the 1/3 hp that I linked above.
This was a good thread. I learned a few things about motors. Thanks everyone!
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Hope that helps,
