stoneblue
starting to shine!
Rockin' & Rollin' Across America
Member since September 2007
Posts: 43
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Post by stoneblue on Nov 1, 2007 0:16:38 GMT -5
OK, I've been lurking here for a couple of months, but I'm not really finding an answer to my dilemma. Ergo, this post. I'm as green as the wax I'm using when it comes to all things rock. I've just started my exploration into cabbing & I'm having trouble keeping the stone on the stick. Like I said, I'm using green wax, heating it on a hot plate set to low low. The wax is a pea soup consistency and seems to stick to the rock well. I preheat the rock & the stick (dowel rod), coat the end of the stick & stick it on the flat of the rock. After letting it cool a bit, I then reheat the rock to the point of the wax glistening & let it re-cool. The trouble is that after I begin to grind, the stick lets go of the rock. The wax sticks to the rock fine, but the stick is clean on the end when it releases. I've tried grinding right after putting the rock on the stick, as well as letting it cool 15 or 20 minutes...still same thing. The room I grind in is nice & warm. The water wetting the wheel is cool, but not cold. It's been in the jug for over a day, so it should be "room temperature". My fingernails can't take much more, so I need to get a solution here. Any Ideas?
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Post by stoner on Nov 1, 2007 1:22:44 GMT -5
I gave up on using wax, too time consuming and I always had the same problem as you. I use 3/8" acryllic plastic tubing(hollow) and super glue to stick the stone on the dop. I use an accelerator so the bond is instant and strong, and since there is just a narrow surface being glued(the wall of the tubing is only 1/16" thick) the cabs come off the dops fairly easy. Letting them sit in acetone for a while helps free the stone too. Use the green wax to repair dents on your green furniture!
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Post by LCARS on Nov 1, 2007 2:07:19 GMT -5
Try cutting some castle grooves in the rod.  |
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fossilbrain
spending too much on rocks
Cookie Monster agate
Member since October 2007
Posts: 360
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Post by fossilbrain on Nov 1, 2007 2:22:25 GMT -5
Holy cow, that's great, stoner. I have all those materials, just no traditional wax, and was dreading driving across town for it.
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Post by invisibleuser on Nov 1, 2007 9:43:47 GMT -5
I gave up on using wax, too time consuming and I always had the same problem as you. I use 3/8" acryllic plastic tubing(hollow) and super glue to stick the stone on the dop. I use an accelerator so the bond is instant and strong, and since there is just a narrow surface being glued(the wall of the tubing is only 1/16" thick) the cabs come off the dops fairly easy. Letting them sit in acetone for a while helps free the stone too. Use the green wax to repair dents on your green furniture! Which brand super glue and accelerator are you using? While I am not cabbing now- I will be sometime in the future . I've always wondered if that green wax really holds the stones on dopsticks- given the pressure used on the wheels. Steve |
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Post by johnjsgems on Nov 1, 2007 10:06:57 GMT -5
Try not reheating and coat the end of the stick so the wax tapers from the stone down. You don't need to heat the dop stick if you are using wood. Allow to cool before cabbing. Also don't overheat the wax as it will lose it's strength. Also, every time it is reused /reheated it loses strength.
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stonesnbones
spending too much on rocks
Member since September 2007
Posts: 255
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Post by stonesnbones on Nov 1, 2007 15:31:05 GMT -5
I too was wondering why are you reheating?You should not have to do that.Do you flaten the wax on your dopstick prior to attaching it to the stone?Do you press the wax onto the stone?
Brad
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2007 16:53:03 GMT -5
What stoner said. ;D
Shannon
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Post by krazydiamond on Nov 1, 2007 17:51:20 GMT -5
i'm a firm believer in wax, the green kind. i mainly use metal dop sticks with a tapered end, kind of like a horn (think trombone). although i do use broken off wooden pencils too. i also use a 1/4" steel plate as a base. i get the wax good and hot with an electric dop pot. takes a while to get to the right consistency, but i tend to do a bunch at a time, so it's worth the wait.
i get a twirling blobette on the stick and transfer it to the steel plate and make a flat. i prepare all the sticks first like that, then i heat the stone and put a little tiny piece of wax on top of the stone, when it melts the stone is ready and then dip the prepared stick back into the wax and let it melt a little. then jam the stick onto the stone and transfer again to the steel plate with my right hand while my left hand has been soaking in cold water and then form the extremely hot wax to stick and stone.
any excess wax in the way gets trimmed with a paring knife (carefully).
and still sometimes i get seperation mid-grind on occasion, but not usually. my usual problem is getting them OFF the dang stick with out breaking the cab! i stick them in the freezer for a good long time and then take them out one by one and stick the stone in my palm and try and let the condensation work the wax from the stone. i trim any excess off with another knife.
amazingly i still have all my fingers.
KD
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stoneblue
starting to shine!
Rockin' & Rollin' Across America
Member since September 2007
Posts: 43
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Post by stoneblue on Nov 5, 2007 20:56:50 GMT -5
*sigh* Don'cha just hate wanting to try something so bad yer teeth hurt and not being able to get it to work? oh...wait....maybe my teeth are hurting 'cause I'M CHEWING ON THESE DANG ROCKS!!! LCARS, I cut some grooves in the end of the dowels. I also looked at some pic of others' doping adventures & came to the conclusion that I may have been too stingy with the wax, in an effort to not have wax all over the place. I was thinking I should have put more wax on the side of the stick, near the end. SO, after cutting the grooves, and putting wax about 1/2" up the stick, I gave it another try. I heated the rocks, just like last time & they seemed to stick to the dowel better than last time. I used my fingers to form the wax up to the stones. But, even with light pressure, they just fell right off. *GRR* I stuck about 20 rocks to these sticks and a few seemed to be very tight, until I started grinding. It's not even a rough wheel! I'm using 100 grit. Also, I know I'm not over heating the wax (which is brand new), cause it doesn't bubble or foam.
I'm now convinced that Stoner was right when he said " Use the green wax to repair dents on your green furniture!" I've since gone to the hobby store & purchased some 5 sec. thick CA, accelerator & release. Now we'll see what's what!
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Post by docone31 on Nov 6, 2007 18:17:13 GMT -5
Dopping with wax is simple. Take a dowel, flatten the end, stick the dowel in dop wax. Let the wax soak into the wood. Take the dop and repeatedly dip it into the wax untill you have a ball, at least as wide as the finished piece. Heat the stones on a plate, I prefer stoneware, set on the stove on the lowest setting you can get. Press the ball down onto the stone.
I do not smooth the edges, I grind them. I prefer dop wax as it will tell you how hot the stone is getting. If it is too hot, it will shift on the wax. Dip it into a cup of water. The extra dop wax grinds off easily and this helps when feathering an edge.
I preheat my dop wax in an empty cat food can, the low types. I also use those cans for steam casting. I set the can with wax in it on the stove at the lowest setting. I take my dop with the ball on the end, and set it into the wax to soften. While it is softening, I take the stone off the plate, then set the dop onto it.
I have tried cyanoacrylate. I have had stones pop off the dop. Since I facet, a popped stone is a real issue. Not the beginnings of a good day. Dop wax works better for faceting.
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stoneblue
starting to shine!
Rockin' & Rollin' Across America
Member since September 2007
Posts: 43
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Post by stoneblue on Nov 7, 2007 1:21:48 GMT -5
docone31...It's too late. I've seen the dark side & it is CA. I rough ground 16 stones today and only 1 of them popped off. I'm sure that one was my fault. I was thinking that I didn't use enough glue on it & I was right. Now I don't have to run the hotplate, smell the wax, or worry about my ol' lady bumping the tin of wax onto the floor, (she can be that way sometimes).
Thanx for everyone's help and for taking the time to reply.
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