chassroc
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Member since January 2005
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Post by chassroc on May 21, 2007 13:33:08 GMT -5
This may offend some people:
I am having my house re-sided and I made sure it was being done by USA residents, not illegals.
I had a new roof put on last year, by Americans not illegals.
Two years ago I had a shed built and erected by a local contractor.
Good local contractors who do the work themselves or hire other locals are not hard to find and do not charge more money than other contractors who hire illegals and screw us all.
Many of my neighbors have had similar work done over the past few years and it is very obvious when a crew of illegals is working on a house. They are easy to detect and easy to spot and easy to deport.
Rich businessmen may wave the flag and cry about illegals but they love using them as slave labor(to the detriment of decent hard working Americans)
In any big city in the Northeast, or small city, or suburb with Offices, you find that the Custodial staffs are invariably illegal aliens. After hours almost everyone entering buildings to clean have a poor command of English. Some rich building owner has figured out that he could get rid of decent Americans who might get paid a little more and have some semblance of benefits with illegals and they can pocket the difference. I cannot speak for the whole country but I would be very surprised if it were any different in other areas of the country.
I do not blame illegals for coming into this country. If I lived in another country and knew there was a way to make a better life for myself or my family I would try it too. I hate the people who exploit these people, who treat them in an inhumane way. Slavery was outlawed a century ago and there is little reason to bring it back. Let's have an enlightened society where everyone has an equal footing. If you want to hire a cleaner, a roofer, a handyman, a nanny; pay decent wages for services rendered. Let's get rid of the hypocrisy surrounding the way illegals are used as slave labor and second class citizens. Lets treat all people as people not as cattle.
Thanks for listening
csroc
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stoneman92
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Post by stoneman92 on May 21, 2007 15:34:33 GMT -5
I think you hit the nail square on the head!! Why would you blame someone for trying to make a better life for their family and them self??? America sure doesn't help itself out at times. Kind of a "do as I say and not as I do!!". The rich don't seem to mind the harder economic times we are living in, just look at all the compounds they hide in!!
How about the fact that America makes up about 5% of the worlds population........
Yet, America, uses 66% of the worlds illegal drugs!!!! I think we should blame the farmer down in south America or Mexico that grows the stuff for $3 a year!!!
We never seem to look at the whole picture. I have a friend that is a policeman that works in a drug unit. Another friend was asking what the big deal was with smoking or selling a little weed? The policeman explained that a year ago they had sent a bag of weed taken off the street to the crime lab for analysis. After a week or so they had it returned, positive MJ. There also was a report with it explaining that the lab workers had found a tooth in the bag mixed in with the weed. The tooth was processed and a DNA match was made to a border patrol agent that had been killed several months before. The policeman suggested to his friend that maybe the question of what was the big deal about enforcing the MJ laws should be asked of the widow or two small children of the border agent killed by drug smugglers trying to cross our southern border???
Makes you wonder......
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Post by Toad on May 21, 2007 17:39:22 GMT -5
If by America you mean the USA, you're way off on your numbers. We make up about 1/3 the population of China - not the world.
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stoneman92
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Post by stoneman92 on May 21, 2007 18:07:24 GMT -5
Put it in percentages, is that better Toad.....
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Post by Toad on May 21, 2007 18:13:49 GMT -5
Yes. Big difference between 1/3 (33%) and 5%. Thanks for the clarification, I was too lazy to look it up myself.
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Post by deb193 on May 22, 2007 0:32:18 GMT -5
Is there any link online to this story about the tooth and the DNA? I wanted to followup.
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earthdog
Cave Dweller
Don't eat yellow snow
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Post by earthdog on May 22, 2007 11:50:59 GMT -5
I'd like to follow up on that story. it kinda sounds pretty far- fetched.
I know alot of the weed in the midwest isn't from south of the border, in fact most of it comes from Kentucky, Tennessee.
I have read that Kentucky's biggest cash crop is pot.
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Post by larrywyland3 on May 22, 2007 12:03:19 GMT -5
The cause of the problem is the willingness of a lot of people to hire illegals to save a little money. There is a Department of Justice form called and I-9 that businesses must complete and maintain. The purpose of the form is to document that employees legal work status; citizen or legal alian. If you are looking to make an impact on this issue that is a good thing to know and ask to see.
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181lizard
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Post by 181lizard on May 22, 2007 12:58:50 GMT -5
Spirit Stone...in the effort to join in on a good conversation, can I give you a couple of cents? (like 2 cents  I'm one of those employers that must fill out the I-9 you mentioned. I do it every time I hire a new employee. The only problem is...do YOU know if a document presented to you would be valid or fake? I've employed people for over 20 years and I can swear in court...to the best of my ability, all documents I've reviewed appear to be legal. In Oregon, they give you a list of items you can use to check age for serving liquor. Besides the obvious, you may also use passports & military ID. I myself, have never had either one of these issued to me. How the heck am I supposed to know if this is a REAL piece if identification issued by a proper authority? I can't, so I don't accept them as stand alone. I know why this stupid extra piece of paperwork was put in place. I understand. But in truth...it's a piece of garbage not worth the paper it's printed on. The document states very clearly the various forms of ID you may consider. Guess what? A drivers license or State issued identification is one of them. And guess what else? These are obtained LEGALLY with the SAME documents that are given to me by new hires. That's right folks! I AM EXPECTED TO HIRE ONLY PEOPLE THAT ARE IN OUR COUNTRY LEGALLY, yet...the State of Oregon is allowed to issue valid ID and not have repercussions? I also have an age verification machine. It allows a business to scan drivers licenses and ID's. In 5 years of using it, it's never popped up a bad ID. Expired...yes. My intention in ranting about this was not to point a finger at you Spirit, but rather to blow a hole the size of Texas in the subject. One more case, then I'll shut up! An old employee (no longer works for me) had a girlfriend. They had a baby. They broke up. She took him to court for child support and won. His payments were made to child support by my company. They had quite a few dissagreements & ended up in court many times. He is now, with the help of an attny., getting his legal things in order to become a law abiding citizen...but the whole time she was dragging him back & forth into court, he was NOT here legally. Just how does this happen? MONEY. In my humble & uneducated opinion...the courts turn a blind eye. If they were to deport all the people here illegally that are being processed thru the courts, the burden of support would then fall on them & then would fall on us because of more taxation. It's never ending. This is just one small story that I know. How many gazillion other stories are out there? |
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Post by parfive on May 22, 2007 16:22:17 GMT -5
I won't live long enough to see it, but I'm guessin' the illegal mess will finally be taken care of once the Hispanics become the majority in this country and rule the roost.
Cause they ain't gonna want 'em here either.
Rich
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stoneman92
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Post by stoneman92 on May 22, 2007 17:31:06 GMT -5
Might not be as far off as you think, Rich. Aren't there 4-5 states in the southwest that already have a Hispanic majority?
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blarneystone
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Post by blarneystone on May 22, 2007 17:58:46 GMT -5
Stoneman92... Is that majority Mexican Hispanics? ...or American Hispanics?
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stoneman92
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Post by stoneman92 on May 22, 2007 19:04:40 GMT -5
I don't know what you would properly call them, Blarney. Weren't they there first, for the most part? Seems they are just taking back what was once theirs in that part of the country.
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Post by larrywyland3 on May 22, 2007 20:03:21 GMT -5
181Lizard you are right on. I have to fill them out and facially valid is what I was taught. But how do you really know. You know what they are suppose to look like and well they look like em or they are from the list and you have never seen them before and you try and get info on what they are supposed to like. The Government is always looking to pass the buck. After all if they can't find someone else to pay they get stuck paying for it. And they have so many friends they need to make rich first (sorry, for not having a very high opionion of our elected "public servants"). My point is that I see two groups of exploited people. Niethor one getting ahead and one group exploiting both and getting ahead. I try my best to employ people who are legal. My point is to take the fight to those doing the exploiting. If you are going to hire a contractor you could ask to see the I-9s for anyone working the job. I have never done this, but then most people I work with live in town. It's just an idea. Even if they are faked or they refuse to show them I think it will make a point.
I saw a polical cartoon of 2 Native Americans on the shore looking a sailing boat. One commented are they legal. The other responded I guess we have to wait till they make the laws. It is an interesting point, but I think the issue is explotation; IMHO.
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RockyBlue
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Post by RockyBlue on May 22, 2007 20:14:32 GMT -5
I totally agree the Gov, has been exploiting people since 1492,and the native americans have been fighting terroists since 1492 ...................Rocky
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stoneman92
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Post by stoneman92 on May 22, 2007 20:15:22 GMT -5
Do you ever wonder why there is such a difference in the way that the Indians and Mexicans are treated in the US? Both were pushed off their land that they had lived for who knows how long. The Indians get to hunt and fish with no regulations in the great lakes region, build and operate casinos across the country, free college education, the list goes on. What do the Mexicans get?
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earthdog
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Post by earthdog on May 22, 2007 20:36:02 GMT -5
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chassroc
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Rocks are abundant when you have rocktumblinghobby pals
Member since January 2005
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Post by chassroc on May 23, 2007 10:19:17 GMT -5
Lots of interesting ways to look at this issue...Stoneman makes a great point about who was here first and why do Native Americans get more than the "Native American Mexicans"?
I went to HIgh School in Union City, NJ which is over 80% Hispanic. At that time there was little or no discussion about illegal immigration; did not matter at that time.. I think people are more aware (and get stirred up by Talk radio and other media) about illegals. As the countries popluation grows there is less land and opportunity(or is it more?). Where I grew up (Jersey City, NJ), We had a large minority (probably a majority of minorities) population. Since it was mostly lower middle class and blue collar, people there really resented things like quotas and busing because their jobs were the ones at risk, they had enough problems making it with an even playing field, their schools were directly affected by bilingual eduaction, and their lives were directly affected by the constant influx of people.
csroc
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