knapper42
starting to shine!
Member since March 2008
Posts: 36
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Post by knapper42 on Apr 29, 2008 19:41:57 GMT -5
I use the two bucket method using brown paper bags. The bags I collect at the grocery stores aren't as good as it seems they use to be and I'm not having a lot of luck filtering my oil. It seems to take a long time to filter through two bags and often the glue seams come loose and the oil isn't filtered.
Does anyone have a better method or another method of filtering their saw oil.
Any help is welcome.
Thanks
Knapper
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Post by deb193redux on Apr 29, 2008 20:41:10 GMT -5
Nothing really beats the bags. You can screen out some sludge with cheescloth or a screen and maybe make the bag-filter time shorter. ALso you can place the bag so there is not stress on the seam and then pour off the oil before you lift the bag.
I once used a bit of solvent to dilute the oil so it strained faster, and then let it sit for a few days to let the solvent evaporate - but I never trusted the oil to be non-toxic afterwards.
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lapidopterix
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since March 2008
Posts: 216
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Post by lapidopterix on Apr 29, 2008 22:22:51 GMT -5
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Post by catmandewe on Apr 29, 2008 23:11:44 GMT -5
I only use one bag, but I place it inside a 5 gallon bucket that I have drilled quite a few holes in, then I place that bucket inside a kitchen sized trash can to collect the oil. The 5 gallon bucket keeps the bag from coming apart. I have extra oil so when I change my oil I put fresh oil in the saw (from the last filtering), then after it filters through the bag, I pour that back into one of the oil containers.
Tony
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Post by beefjello on Apr 30, 2008 7:59:52 GMT -5
I'm looking at doing my very first oil change here real soon. It's become super saturated with sludge. About how long does this paper bag and bucket method take to filter it out, and about how much of the original 5 gallons of oil can I expect to reclaim?
Thanks!
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Post by catmandewe on Apr 30, 2008 8:27:14 GMT -5
How long it takes to filter depends alot on the temperature of the oil, when I filter in the winter it takes alot longer than in the summer. During the summer it seems to take a few days to filter most of it out, then I add some heavy rocks to the top of the sludge (put the rocks in a plastic bag) and I can usually get another gallon or so out of the sludge. I usually get about 4 gallons back out of the original 5.
Tony
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lparker
fully equipped rock polisher
Still doing too much for being retired!
Member since March 2008
Posts: 1,202
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Post by lparker on Apr 30, 2008 8:40:08 GMT -5
Hi Jack,
Just had an absolutely brilliant idea. Go to your nearest dairy farm supply store and buy 12"+ milk filters. Drill a whole bunch of 1/2" holes in your bucket, (optional) get a can of spray glue from a craft store - the temporary kind, cut the filter to size, spray the bottom inside of the bucket, insert filter. I believe the filters are poly so should take the abuse. Probably should warm the oil.
Lee
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knapper42
starting to shine!
Member since March 2008
Posts: 36
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Post by knapper42 on Apr 30, 2008 12:00:06 GMT -5
Thanks for the replies folks.
The bags I get from the stores these days aren't the same quality I use to get. After filtering the oil would be as clear as new. Now it is generally clean but not clear.
My 24" saw hold 20 gals and my 18" holds about 5 so it's a nasty chore on cleaning day(s).
I keep several gallons spare on hand but would like to find something other than the bag method.
I like the idea of the milk filter. Will have to experiment with that idea. Have thought about using paper feed sack but I think they may be wax coated to keep out moisture.
Guess one could alway build a multi-stage filter system and keep the oil clean constantly.
Again, thanks for the comments.
Hi Lee how's the knap in circuit going?
knapper
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Post by connrock on Apr 30, 2008 18:03:41 GMT -5
I've been doing a lot of experimenting with different ways to filter slab saw oil and the one constant is that the oil does not sink but rather it comes to the top.
This is quite evident in the saw sump itself.
What I have found using the shopping bags and all other similar type materials is that the oil MUST reach the upper/outer surface of the "filter" and then strain itself down through the least point of resistance ,which is the "filter".
I find that the out surface of the oil/muck is drier and as you work your way toward the center of it,it becomes VERY wet.
After letting the oil/muck sit for 2 weeks in a heated environment (70-74F) I put a home made vibrator as used in floating concrete huge amounts of oil came to the surface!
Finding all this oil left in the muck I decided that an inner"core filter" would help to get the oil out of the center faster and more efficiently.
The next time I changed my oil I made the core filter out of 1/2" galvanized steel mesh and lined the inside and outside of it.I placed it into the center of a paper bag atop of a calendar (sp) in a plastic bucket.
This helped but after using the vibrator again there was still a lot of oil left.
Over more then a years time I tried all sorts of different ideas to not only speed up the filtering process but to also get as much oil as possible out of the oil/muck.
After a LOT of frustration,failure,disappointment,rage and cleaning up huge messesI found that the most efficient way was to simply put the oil/muck into the cut off sleeve from and old flannel shirt and wring the heck out of it!
Of course this was like Edison's first light bulb and needed a LOT of refining.
Using this method is great for VERY small amounts of oil/muck and trying to replicate it for use with much larger amounts was a HUGE problem for me to solve.
The main problem while filtering large amounts was that even using this method the inner "core" of the oil/muck still retained a lot of oil!
I "think" I have this problem solved(on paper) but it will take a lot of work to prove or dis-prove it.
I have a prototype drawn out and have asked my son ( a sheetmetalman) to make it for me when he finds time! (ha ha ha)
Anyone who has read this far is probably think I am some sort of nut case but I retired 1 year ago this past April 20th and LOVE doing this sort of thing!
I doubt V E R Y seriously if anyone reading this will EVER make one of these contraptions but there a few things to consider even for you.
The 2 main points are that the oil DOES NOT sink until it reaches the "filter" and that it comes to the top and center of the oil/muck.
If you don't believe me try this.
Next time you filter your oil/muck through a paper bag keep the filtered oil/muck in a COVERED bucket.Let it just sit for several weeks-several months,depending on the type of oil you are using (viscosity makes a BIG difference).You will be amazed at how much oil comes to the top!!
Yeah I know,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,I'm Loonytoons at it's finest!!
connrock
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Post by stonesthatrock on Apr 30, 2008 19:28:18 GMT -5
i just spend the money and buy new lol
call me lazy, but i don't wanna mess with 2 18" saws full of oil. so i really can't give you any advice.
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lparker
fully equipped rock polisher
Still doing too much for being retired!
Member since March 2008
Posts: 1,202
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Post by lparker on Apr 30, 2008 19:51:58 GMT -5
Jack, I'm staying local this year (after the 3 FL knappins) Nothing scheduled more than 6 hours from home.
To keep this rock related, I started cabbing scrap from knappins, which lead to tumbling. <G>
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Post by Jack ( Yorkshire) on May 2, 2008 2:58:42 GMT -5
Hi all. I find that apaper bag is usless after a short time Definatly to short a time and not enough oil. [glow=red,2,300]Oil rises Muck/soil goes down [/glow] I sit mine outside through a hot summer in tall containers and let them settle then get the oil of the top Jack Yorkshire UK PS Knapper WELCOME to the board |
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Post by connrock on May 2, 2008 6:06:20 GMT -5
Jack ,
Good idea you have to let the heat of the summer get to the oil.
I will incorporate so sort of heater to my "gismo".
Thanks for the great idea!!
connrock
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cutter
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since February 2008
Posts: 129
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Post by cutter on May 2, 2008 8:44:26 GMT -5
Howdy All. The man I bought my saw from always wants things done fast. This is how he suggested that I clean my oil. First off, were talking about a large quantity. 40gal. but I'm sure this process can be downsized.
After not running the saw overnight, collect the top oil in buckets and set aside.
Take the dregs out and put it in however many buckets it takes so that the buckets are only about half full.
Then take an electric drill with a paint or drywall mixer in it. It needs to be a sturdy one.
Add about 1/2 gal. of water to each bucket and start mixing.
By mixing, the water will bind with the sludge and expel the oil.
What is left is a heavy almost like cottage cheese curds.
Pour off separated oil.
Consolidate curds from separate buckets and add a little more water, mix and pour off oil.
Repeat.
Then let the curds set for a few days and you will get just a touch more oil.
Double bag curds and dispose of.
The man tells me that out of almost 40 gals. he losses less than a gallon. And this all happens in a mornings time.
Discloser: I have not had to try this although I am getting close to having to. I did see his buckets of cottage cheese.
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Post by rocklicker on May 2, 2008 15:02:06 GMT -5
Great ideas. GLad to see I'm not the only one trying to engineer a new saw oil filtering method. I was thinking of building a device to spin the oil, like a giant centrifuge. It would have a number of smaller buckets (~1 gallon) around the outer edge of a rotating ring. The buckets can either have filtration out the backs (lots of holes drilled in the bottom with about two layers of paper over the holes) so the oil will fling out and and be collected. THe other (easier) option was to leave the buckets as they are and pour the oil off the top after the sediment is forced to the bottom. I was thinking of trying it small scale at first to see if it's possible.
Conrock, I agree with your settling oil idea. I recently got a lot of oil from a bucket of post-filtered oil that had been sitting around for a couple months. I was amazed at how much came off the top.
Steve
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Post by connrock on May 3, 2008 9:01:38 GMT -5
cutter,
Thanks for the tip.
I'll have to give it a go!
Steve,
I tried to use centrifugal force once and ONLY once!!! LOL
I tried it with my drill press and in my hast and excitement forgot to slow the speed down!! Yeeee Hawwwww!! I'll give ya tip!!! It tastes TERRIBLE!!! lol Not to mention what it looks like on the walls,floor and ceiling!!! LOL
I'm sitting here laughing because I sometimes feel like "The Mad Professor" with all my experiments!
Hey,,,,Do ya think a new TV show called "Experiments Gone Wild" would go over??? LOL
Dunno if I should tell you this but I was toying with the same idea to dry my polished rocks! Forgot to change the speed again!
Todays tip,,,The rocks hurt like heck when the fly at warp speed!!! LOL
Good luck and keep us posted!!
connfessor!!!
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Post by catmandewe on May 3, 2008 22:59:02 GMT -5
What would really be ideal would be a big plunger type of contraption with a milk washer type tube filter in the chamber, and an air chamber on the plunger part you could pump up with compressed air. The air would put constant pressure on the goop and expel all the oil.
I thought about making one to try it out, but I would have way more into it than a whole barrel of oil would cost me, so I just thought I would keep buying oil when I need it. I only have to buy 10 gallons every 6 months or so, so thats not bad at all.
The centrifugal idea has some good merits. Anyone know where they can get an old honey separator that no one uses anymore?
Tony
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mirkaba
spending too much on rocks
Member since August 2006
Posts: 321
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Post by mirkaba on May 5, 2008 12:11:11 GMT -5
Howdy.......All good ideas! I use vacuum cleaner bags from the Goodwill store. I bent a piece of expanded metal to fit into the top of a 5 gal. bucket and half fill 2 bags at once. The more liquid oil goes in one and sludge in the other. In good weather it takes about a month to month and a half. Patience is indeed a virtue.....Bob
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Steve
has rocks in the head
Member since June 2005
Posts: 506
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Post by Steve on May 5, 2008 14:47:24 GMT -5
I no longer use paper bag filters - too messy. I put the oil into a bucket and let it sit at least overnight. I decant off as much of the clean oil as I can without unduly re-contaminating the oil. Then I pour the liquid sludge into gallon jugs and let them sit for a few months. By then the oil and sludge has separated and the sludge is pretty solid. Pour off the good oil and add more sludge - continue until the jug is more than half full of solid sludge - cap and discard. Steve
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Post by bobby1 on May 5, 2008 19:28:34 GMT -5
connrock,
I think the idea for a TV show "Experiments Gone Wild" would only be a hit if you performed them in the nude.
Bob
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