bobmac
starting to shine!
Member since March 2008
Posts: 28
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Post by bobmac on Sept 23, 2008 9:05:48 GMT -5
apologies for a boring question: I have had two pretty successful batches polished, but took the summer off for lack of stones and lost my notes. I have the UV10 directions but need some clarification: How many grit changes (including initial) for grind, pre polish, and final polish. Suggestions for length of each stage much welcomed because my UV 10 directions are vague ("2 -7 days in grind"). Many thanks, Bob
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Post by deb193redux on Sept 23, 2008 13:58:18 GMT -5
initial grit changes is as many as it takes. Maybe 2 on medium, but generally only 1 on everythign else.
the instructions at therockshed.com are for you model.
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Post by Hard Rock Cafe on Sept 23, 2008 14:02:41 GMT -5
I use a rotary for the initial rough grind, then do the following only changing when I change grit size:
1. 120/220 for 2 days
2. 400 for 2 days
3. 1000 1 day
4. Add pre-polish to 1000 for another day
5. Polish 24 hrs
I have a UV-18, but it should be the same for you.
Make sure you fill it as full as you can and have a mix of large and tiny material.
Hope this helps!
Chuck
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bobmac
starting to shine!
Member since March 2008
Posts: 28
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Post by bobmac on Sept 24, 2008 16:25:32 GMT -5
Chuck...
Thanks so much for being so specific. It tells me I'm basically on the right track. I have some of the plastic pellets, but I'm guessing you see no need for them.
Much appreciated,
Bob
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Post by Bikerrandy on Sept 24, 2008 18:05:15 GMT -5
Bob, plastic pellets depends on the rock. I use them for on all rocks during the polish stage, especially on tigereye!! (they'll have white edges in you don't). I use the UV-10 as well.
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bobmac
starting to shine!
Member since March 2008
Posts: 28
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Post by bobmac on Sept 25, 2008 18:29:45 GMT -5
Thanks Randy... Where I'm still uncertain is the number of times I should change the grit when I go coarse to fine and finer (AO). If I'm at 500 for three days should I just stick with the initial 500 charge for the three days? BTW... If this NE wind keeps up all our Jersey Shore stones are going to be in Va Bch. Breezy there I bet (Thurs PM).
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Post by deb193redux on Sept 25, 2008 19:24:42 GMT -5
The higher the grit, the more likely the initial charge will be suitable. For polish, you can even re-use it.
I often do one recharge on 500 - depends on the rock.
But I repeat, for course, AS MANY AS IT TAKES. When tumbling pre-formed slabbetts, I might do only as few as two 1 day course charges. If I have less pre-forming or mixed slabbetts and regular rough, I might do 4 or 5 120g charges going for about 18 hours on the 1st and maybe getting 36 hours on the last.
If I had rough that needed lots of rounding or matrix removal, I might do 10 or more course charges. THe brazilian that takes 16 weeks to shape in rotary course will take about 10 to 12 charge in a vibe. Roughly 1 day = 1 week, but this varies with the range of rock sizes and amount of mud being thrown.
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dscratch
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since June 2008
Posts: 214
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Post by dscratch on Sept 25, 2008 22:11:25 GMT -5
Run the following and you should have good results.
1.) Rotary Tumbler for grind.
2.) 120/220 in the UV-10 (2 days - change grit after 24 hrs)
3.) 500F (2 days - change grit after 24 hours)
4.) AO 1000 (1 day)
5.) AO polish (1 day)
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bobmac
starting to shine!
Member since March 2008
Posts: 28
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Post by bobmac on Sept 26, 2008 8:12:34 GMT -5
Hey dscatch... That's what I needed.
And deb193redux... I understood about half of that but got the important parts and learned alot. Thanks for education. Bob
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Post by johnjsgems on Sept 26, 2008 9:05:39 GMT -5
bobmac, if it isn't obvious, the rotary grind is not really necessary with your beach rocks if you are happy with the shapes/condition as found.
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Post by deb193redux on Sept 26, 2008 11:48:22 GMT -5
well if you tell me the half you missed I can rephrase.
I did not mention rotary for grind because you did not say you had one, and because I assumed beach stones might not need as much shaping.
The key element you seem to be missing is the difference between course and any other stage. Without this understanding, any "recipe" will only work by luck.
Course shapes. Other stages smooth. All 500g has to do is get out the 120g scratches. All pre-polish has to do is get out the 500g scratches. ... etc.
Course has to change the shape, remove varying amounts of rock, and leave a surface where the largest imperfections are are 120g (or whatever you course grit is.) The amount of time and charges to do this will vary with the hardness of the rock, the initial shape, and the number of imperfections. Rotary do this best but do take longer. Vibes will not round as much, but can do the job. Use as many course charges as it takes, you will need to recharge every 10 to 36 hours.
If you have a good mix of stone sizes, and fairly uniform hardness, then most times one charge on the higher grits will do, and two charges will cover almost anything. Except, I usually do longer in polish to get that little extra bit of shine.
These recipes with days, grit changes, and grit sizes are guidelines. Try to get a feel for you barrel. Grit coating rocks without being so thin you see just wet rocks or so thick you have cream preventing abrasion. The weight and size range of the load so that it is moving and turning over swiftly but not bouncing all around and popping rocks out. Add water with a spray bottle to keep things slightly wet and moving.
Rocks differ in hardness but also in density and porosity. That "exact recipie" of water to start the newly charged load will not penetrate some rocks and it will soak in to others. So you need to adjust. A few softer stones inthe load will generate mud before the other stones have had enough abrasion. The mud will impair the efficiency of the load. YOu add a little water to cut the mud. At some point you need to recharge even if not all grit is used because there is too much mud and water inthe barrel to manage.
... so treat recipie as a guideline. Think about whether you have stone that water beads on or stone that stays looking wet for a long time after you put water on it. Think about whether you have all the same stones or mixed. If you have some softer jasper, some obsidian, some ukanite, butter jade, or any other softer rocks in the mix, expect mud to form faster.
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bobmac
starting to shine!
Member since March 2008
Posts: 28
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Post by bobmac on Sept 27, 2008 9:44:35 GMT -5
DEB193... Thanks for your time and expertsie... May I ask your opinion on another 'Problem' and sorry for the history: My first batch I did according to UV10 directions and was pretty thrilled with the results. My second batch came out just as good in terms of gloss and shine, but I seemed to have a lot more fractured - - but not broken - - stones, so I got some plastic pellets. My current, third, in-progress batch is now at the AO1000 stage (another addition suggested by helpers) and while cleaning thoroughly I notice what seems to be the same fracturing phenonemeon... so I tossed in some pellets. I don't think I did anything differently between my first and current batches, so I wonder why the fractures/cracking? Now questions: 1) should I use pellets at 500 grit stage and how much? 2) Same for AO1000 stage and final polish (AO)? and - -with apologies - - is there any advantage or disadvantage to using more grit than recommended in terms of "speed" and/or polish? The consistency seems about right... and where I've initially started with maybe too much water (stones rinsing themselves), that seems to go away in a couple of hours as the water cooks out. These are just beach stones, not the Hope diamond, but the more selective I get in picking up the stones the more I hope for optimal results. Oh... how much Borax in final? Man... I'm testing folks' patience. Thanks, Bob
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Post by deb193redux on Sept 27, 2008 15:00:26 GMT -5
I suppose from batch to batch of beach stones there could be some varation that just by luck the 1st batch had les fractured rock. I think most are liekly to be quartzite nuggets, where quartz has cemented small quartz grains that are much older. Generally polishes well, but not as fine as micro-crystalline agate.
I have a Lot-o and a couple Gy-Roc vibe tumblers. I never use plastic pellets, and always use ceramic. I know some UV-10 people put inthe plastic pellets with good results. Here is my opinion.
Plastic does carry grit but lacking mass does not do much to rub against stones. It can cushion but adds nothing to the weight of the load, and weight is important - too little and the rocks get thrown about with too much energy. Too much and the vibe action is suppressed - but except for taking longer, no harm.
So, ceramic pellets carry grit, cushion and help rub against stones and add weight to the load. It is possible that you attempt to cushion with pellets made too light a load and caused more damage than good. But hard to say w/o seeing the barrel and even trying a few experiments.
Also, rocks differ and it is hard to tell when they are ready to move on or when they are sufficientely coated with slurry. I get used to telling when the pellets are coated just right and wehn they look uniformely smooth - and even when they polish.
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