Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test

connrock
still telling self it's just a hobby

Ranger,,,My little buddy

Member since July 2004
Posts: 4,374

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 4, 2008 11:36:06 GMT -5

Quote

Post by connrock on Nov 4, 2008 11:36:06 GMT -5

There always seems to be a question about which tumbler type is better,rotary or vibe.

The most common answer is ,we rough in a rotary and finish in a vibe.

The next question is how well does a vibe rough.

I decided to do a test run in 1 of my LO's starting with rough rocks and #220 grit(I don't have 120/220 grit).

I weighed some mixed rough to come up with as close to 4 lbs as possible.The load consists of agate,jasper,petrified wood,unknowns and cuttings from my trim saw.

I tried to balance the size of the rocks to show what an ideal load should look like.

What I am showing here is not Gospel and if 120/220 grit was used the results would be faster.

I'm going to "try" to take daily photos of the progress and so far I've been a good boy!

I took photos of the rough,the rocks on my scale to show the weight,what the rocks look like after 24 hours and today decided to take a daily close-up of the same rock throughout the entire process.

I'll keep adding daily photos to this thread,,,,,,,,

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Day 2:

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Day 3:

(note) I added just a few small pieces today to make up for what has been ground away.

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Day 4:

I realized that there might be some question as to the size of the rocks in this load so I separated them into 3 size groups:
(sorry for the blurry photo's but I shot them at 1/8 second without my tripod,,,,,just me being lazy at 4:30am)

I also added a small slab of pink limb cast today just to show how slabs can be polished in the LO.

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Day 5:

I moved the test rock here for an easier comparison.

As you can see the limb cast is ready for the next step so I removed it from the load.
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Day 6:

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Day 7:

Missed day 7,,,,Sorry!

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Day 8:

These rocks are ready to go on to the next step.Most of them are the tiny rocks I put in for surface contact purposes:

These next photo's are to show problem rocks that should either be re-broken and or re-roughed but NOT continued in the process:

These last "trouble rocks" should have never been roughed in the first place.I put them in the load to show what a waste of time and grit it is to try to rough these rocks.
Granted they would have been in better shape if done in a rotary but they would still have to be re-broken or tumbled for a very long time.
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I'm going to end this thread here as I think I have shown how rocks progress in the roughing stages in a vibe.

I used 17-1/2 heaping full table spoons of #220 grit and a bunch of electricity.In my opinion I don't think it's a very efficient way to rough in rocks.

I am thinking of starting another thread on how the Lot-O-Tumbler finishes rocks.This is where this unit really does a fantastic job.

I'll do some small slabs and cabs as well just to show how great they come out and how fast they can be done.

I hope I've helped someone to decide on buying a vibe and or a rotary tumbler.

THE END!!!!!!
connrock

Last Edit: Nov 11, 2008 13:07:04 GMT -5 by connrock

Beacon Falls,CT

Hard Rock Cafe driving up their electric bill Rock tumbling is harder than it looks. Mohs definitely. Member since April 2008 Posts: 2,735	Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 4, 2008 12:25:02 GMT -5 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by Hard Rock Cafe on Nov 4, 2008 12:25:02 GMT -5 Great idea!
	Some rocks aspire to greatness; others are destined to be grit carriers.

Michael John
driving up their electric bill

Member since June 2007
Posts: 2,432

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 4, 2008 13:25:01 GMT -5

Quote

Post by Michael John on Nov 4, 2008 13:25:01 GMT -5

If a more coarse grit were used, the rough process would be faster, but that would also mean that the next step would take a little longer. I think you're better-off with the grit you're using, especially considering wear and tear on your vibe tumbling bowl. Recharging the grit when you consider the rough stage to be at the half-way point would speed-up the process.

I think the main reasons that people rotary tumble in coarse grit for a long time are to well-round everything and to wear down the entire outsides of the rocks to remove almost all surface imperfections. To achieve that, a lot of material is unnecessarily removed.

If you use a grinder or the side of a saw blade to remove the sharp corners and grind out the major imperfections before tumbling, much less time will be needed in the rough stage, and better overall results will be had, regardless whether you're using a rotary or vibe tumbler. Much less material is unnecessarily removed this way.

morticiamonroe starting to spend too much on rocks Member since October 2008 Posts: 147	Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 4, 2008 14:22:11 GMT -5 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by morticiamonroe on Nov 4, 2008 14:22:11 GMT -5 I'm definitely following along, since I'm beginning to think that I really need a vibe as well as my rotary..

Michael John
driving up their electric bill

Member since June 2007
Posts: 2,432

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 4, 2008 14:37:45 GMT -5

Quote

Post by Michael John on Nov 4, 2008 14:37:45 GMT -5

Mort, it just depends what kind of results you're after, how much polished stone you want to have steadily available, and how much patience you have. If you just want rounded, shiny stones, and you're in no hurry for each batch (months), then a rotary will do you fine. But if you want well-defined stones, such as Randy's pendants and other purposeful forms, and you want batches in and out within a couple of weeks, then you need a vibe. A lot of people use both, for their intended purposes.

connrock
still telling self it's just a hobby

Ranger,,,My little buddy

Member since July 2004
Posts: 4,374

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 4, 2008 16:35:29 GMT -5

Quote

Post by connrock on Nov 4, 2008 16:35:29 GMT -5

One important point I'd like to brig up here is the savings on grit/polish using a vibe for finishing.

I use 1-1/2,,,,2 tablespoons of #220 for my second stage after the rocks have been roughed in a rotary.

Then it,1/2 TEASPOON #400 or #500

1/2 TEASPOON #1000 or Tripoli

1/2 TEASPOON polish

I use these amounts of grit/polish to do 4 - 4-1/2 lbs of rocks with excellent results.

It's a lot easier on the pocket book then using a rotary.

connrock

Beacon Falls,CT

Gem'n I freely admits to licking rocks Member since March 2008 Posts: 980	Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 4, 2008 20:26:40 GMT -5 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by Gem'n I on Nov 4, 2008 20:26:40 GMT -5 Hey Homer's Dad, Great idea..super info and right on the money!! Thanks for taking the time!! Larry
	If necessity is the mother of invention, who is the father??? What do we call the kids???

Jack ( Yorkshire)
has started giving rock gifts

God created - I'M Investigating

Member since November 2004
Posts: 3,076

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 6, 2008 3:05:13 GMT -5

Quote

Post by Jack ( Yorkshire) on Nov 6, 2008 3:05:13 GMT -5

Hi Tom,

Its something I wanted to do

Hope you come up with some good results

Im sure it will be a big help to those starting out with a Vibe to get to know its limitations and and acheivements

Jack
Yorkshire UK

Never stop learning , I'm Trying to learn somthing new every day.

connrock still telling self it's just a hobby Ranger,,,My little buddy Member since July 2004 Posts: 4,374	Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 6, 2008 6:08:49 GMT -5 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by connrock on Nov 6, 2008 6:08:49 GMT -5 Hi Jack, I hope the results help others as well. I have to wonder though why no one is looking at them?? connrock
	Beacon Falls,CT

ksk
having dreams about rocks

Member since October 2008
Posts: 69

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 6, 2008 6:39:29 GMT -5

Quote

Post by ksk on Nov 6, 2008 6:39:29 GMT -5

Could be you are editing your initial post rather than adding new post. I have been following this thread, but when I check back I look to see if the number of posts has changed. I just noticed the day 2 photos after reading your last post. Perhaps when you add new photos you can still edit your first post but add a new message stating new photos added above. Just a thought.

Hard Rock Cafe
driving up their electric bill

Rock tumbling is harder than it looks. Mohs definitely.

Member since April 2008
Posts: 2,735

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 6, 2008 7:59:56 GMT -5

Quote

Post by Hard Rock Cafe on Nov 6, 2008 7:59:56 GMT -5

Hi Tom,

I completely missed that you were updating the initial post until KSK pointed it out.

How long do you plan to run in 220? The reason I ask is that the rough still looks, well, rough. Since we normally tumble at least a week in a rotary, it will be interesting to see if there is any time savings in the first stage.

There does seem to be some improvement on the high spots on the test rock, but not much in the low areas.

Chuck

Some rocks aspire to greatness; others are destined to be grit carriers.

connrock
still telling self it's just a hobby

Ranger,,,My little buddy

Member since July 2004
Posts: 4,374

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 6, 2008 8:29:21 GMT -5

Quote

Post by connrock on Nov 6, 2008 8:29:21 GMT -5

gemni
Thanks,

Hoer and I are starting to show our age! We went for a hike in the State Forest and when we got back took a long nap after licking our wounds!

ksk,
Yes I finally figured that out just after I replied to Jack!

I'll make a new reply every day from here on.

H R Cafe,,,

I don't know how long I'll keep this run in rough but I will keep it long enough to prove a point on roughing in a vibe!
I've done this before and that's when I decided to do my roughing in a rotary.

connrock

Beacon Falls,CT

Hard Rock Cafe
driving up their electric bill

Rock tumbling is harder than it looks. Mohs definitely.

Member since April 2008
Posts: 2,735

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 6, 2008 9:30:30 GMT -5

Quote

Post by Hard Rock Cafe on Nov 6, 2008 9:30:30 GMT -5

This is a very educational thread. You can really see how the rock is retaining it's shape, but progress on removing the cuts and rough area on the left is relatively slow compared to how smooth the high areas are getting.

I'll keep roughing in a rotary!

Chuck

Some rocks aspire to greatness; others are destined to be grit carriers.

Hard Rock Cafe
driving up their electric bill

Rock tumbling is harder than it looks. Mohs definitely.

Member since April 2008
Posts: 2,735

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 6, 2008 18:37:53 GMT -5

Quote

Post by Hard Rock Cafe on Nov 6, 2008 18:37:53 GMT -5

I had another thought: I had been planning on tumbling my bubble gum agates in the vibe only because so much of their appeal (and their name) is based on their shape. I didn't want to lose it.
So, now I'm wondering how the valleys will polish.

Connrock: It doesn't look like you have much in the way of small pieces in there, correct? Wouldn't small ceramic pellets help get into the low spots?

I realize that's not the point of this thread. Just wondered if you have relevant experience.

Thanks!
Chuck

Some rocks aspire to greatness; others are destined to be grit carriers.

lapidopterix
starting to spend too much on rocks

Member since March 2008
Posts: 216

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 7, 2008 0:47:11 GMT -5

Quote

Post by lapidopterix on Nov 7, 2008 0:47:11 GMT -5

Nov 6, 2008 18:37:53 GMT -5 Hard Rock Cafe said:

I had another thought: I had been planning on tumbling my bubble gum agates in the vibe only because so much of their appeal (and their name) is based on their shape. I didn't want to lose it.
So, now I'm wondering how the valleys will polish.

Connrock: It doesn't look like you have much in the way of small pieces in there, correct? Wouldn't small ceramic pellets help get into the low spots?

I realize that's not the point of this thread. Just wondered if you have relevant experience.

Thanks!
Chuck

I usually fill a third to half of my vibe loads with rough carnelian. They polish up except for small pits. Some of the pieces go through 4 or 5 times before all the pits are gone. I usually do 2-4 days in 120/220 and use lots of little pebbles and saw scraps.

Jack ( Yorkshire) has started giving rock gifts God created - I'M Investigating Member since November 2004 Posts: 3,076	Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 7, 2008 3:18:14 GMT -5 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by Jack ( Yorkshire) on Nov 7, 2008 3:18:14 GMT -5 Hi Tom KSK above has a good point You got to alter the headining each day you post ? Jack Yorkshire UK
	Never stop learning , I'm Trying to learn somthing new every day.

Hard Rock Cafe
driving up their electric bill

Rock tumbling is harder than it looks. Mohs definitely.

Member since April 2008
Posts: 2,735

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 7, 2008 7:51:56 GMT -5

Quote

Post by Hard Rock Cafe on Nov 7, 2008 7:51:56 GMT -5

I realized after my post that not everyone will know what bubblegum agates look like. It's funny, but I had to go to a Japanese site to find a good picture of a South Dakota agate! :-)

www.lithos-graphics.com/rocks/n&camerica/bubblegum.html

Chuck

Some rocks aspire to greatness; others are destined to be grit carriers.

connrock
still telling self it's just a hobby

Ranger,,,My little buddy

Member since July 2004
Posts: 4,374

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 7, 2008 8:26:50 GMT -5

Quote

Post by connrock on Nov 7, 2008 8:26:50 GMT -5

H-R-Cafe
I added a few photos to show the tiny rocks in the load.

The bubblegum agates will turn out fantastic in the vibe as long as you use a LOT of ceramic media throughout the entire process.

I've done some pet wood and it comes out great.

connrock

Beacon Falls,CT

Hard Rock Cafe
driving up their electric bill

Rock tumbling is harder than it looks. Mohs definitely.

Member since April 2008
Posts: 2,735

Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 7, 2008 12:12:10 GMT -5

Quote

Post by Hard Rock Cafe on Nov 7, 2008 12:12:10 GMT -5

Thanks for the update Connrock!

I use about 5 lbs. of large ceramics and 5 lbs. of pellets in each load. The 18 lb. limit on the UV-18 is conservative. :-)

The snow started flying today, so I may be done until Spring. :-( At least we don't have it as bad as the Black Hills! Deadwood got over 45 inches between Wednesday and Thursday. Yikes!

Chuck

Some rocks aspire to greatness; others are destined to be grit carriers.

connrock still telling self it's just a hobby Ranger,,,My little buddy Member since July 2004 Posts: 4,374	Lot-O-Tumbler test run(photo intensive)end of test Nov 7, 2008 13:27:16 GMT -5 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by connrock on Nov 7, 2008 13:27:16 GMT -5 H-R-Cafe Where the heck are you from Siberia? connrock Ps:Put your tumblers in the living room for the winter months! ;D
	Beacon Falls,CT