firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 4, 2009 9:57:41 GMT -5
Navi, thank you for the great tips! I hope all of you don't mind that I am printing out many of your comments to refer back to. Another question which has come to mind is the use of "makeup media". My husband purchased a couple of the starter grit packages from The Rock Shed, and also a couple of bags of the white beads (for lack of a better term)  Hart talks about these and the small ceramic shapes which he prefers. Do you use the makeup media in all batches, or just the final couple of batches? Bonnie |
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 4, 2009 10:03:29 GMT -5
Dr. Joe, you almost had yourself a deal there! I was excited with the prospect of installing you in the other house to babysit the rocks during the winter months, therefore relieving me of the need to wander back and forth over there in the cold to check the tumbler. But I couldn't bear the thought of being responsible for making you "goose bumply" for several months in a row.. ;D Option 2 is viable though. We have several cameras with audio/video capabilities as I used these when I had mares up for foaling so I could monitor them through the night. I bet I could talk my husband into running one of those from the old house to here. I just know he's going to love that this hobby is beginning to take on a life of its own.  Bonnie |
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 4, 2009 10:10:15 GMT -5
Susan2 (I'm don't know how to make that little two) Thank you for the warm welcome!! You are so right in that I'm thankful to have found this forum, I already feel as though I have so much more information than I possibly could have gained on my own. You're all very generous and patient with the "newbies" and that doesn't always happen on internet forums. So again, thank you for that. I'll get a pic of the tractor pulled rock and share it with you all. It really is a gorgeous rock. I made a new home for it in one of my butterfly gardens and I know the butterflies will make good use of it for a resting stop this summer. When we finally got it to the garden, the tractor had to be abandoned as a helper and we were down to trying to "roll the rock" into place. I wanted it just right in the garden, so typically like putting up a picture or moving furniture, I was experimenting with various placements. My poor husband finally put a stop to that and said "that's where it's staying". ;D Bonnie |
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 4, 2009 10:13:56 GMT -5
ejs, thank you so much for the great advice (and the humor, you all make me laugh) ;D I am going to use your comments as a guide to lead me through my first rock tumbling attempt. I plan to start my first batch today, so all of you wish me luck. I decided I can play chicken on here for only so long, but at some point I need to just get the rocks in the tumbler and have a go, so today is that day. I'm excited and nervous. Bonnie |
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 4, 2009 10:23:38 GMT -5
Amy, thank you for the welcome!! In response to your comments, some of the rocks which are my "favorites" are those which have a more rounded and smooth surface. Will these rocks finish up more quickly than those which have all the jags and rough edges? Also Amy, would it be advisable to tumble the smoother rocks with others of the same characteristics, or could you do the jagged and smooth together and still have good results? Thank you as well for the tips on navigating the forum! This is such a great goldmine of information, but I did have problems trying to find information for those people like myself who are just starting. I wish we had a forum just for that, something along the lines of "Introduction to Rock Tumbling" where all this great advice and wonderful tips could be collected and put into one place. But I also have this bad tendency to wander over to the Photos area and I could stay stuck there for hours just looking at the beautiful creations. By the time I've been there oohing and aahing for an hour, I've forgotten my question. Bonnie |
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CUL-Ann
spending too much on rocks
rock lover~
Member since September 2008
Posts: 380
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Post by CUL-Ann on Jan 4, 2009 11:01:20 GMT -5
You might want to take photos of what you start with before tumbling. Also note weight. these suggestions might of been made but I didn't see them reading fast.  This is the best place to be the members are just wonderful. Oh you can also post photos of your garden;-)))) ;D I started all this with stones/rocks in the garden then moved on to when my my mother gave me boxes she had found about 50 years ago;-)) |
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huffstuff
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since August 2007
Posts: 1,222
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Post by huffstuff on Jan 4, 2009 15:08:53 GMT -5
Yes, Bonnie, the rounded rocks should take less time in rough than really jagged ones. But any rock that has a deep pit (even an otherwise rounded one) will take forever to grind down to the level of the pit. Many here will take a rock like that and split it at the deep pit, then start it again. How to split it.... a very common way is the infamous WorkForce tile saw from Home Depot. Your husband probably isn't ready for that step yet!
You can tumble the jagged and rounded together, if they are all the same hardness the rounded ones will be ready for the next step much earlier. That's OK, you can take them out and put more jagged ones in... keep tumbling until you have enough for step 2.
I use pellets or ceramic media starting at step 2 (your term "makeup media" makes me grin, I picture putting my powdered foundation into my tumbler.... ;D ) Some prefer ceramic media because you can keep it with the rocks all the way through to the end, and because it doesn't float. Some prefer plastic pellets because they float (and some of us think plastic pellets are a pain because they float) and are easy to skim off the top of a rinse bucket. I did use plastic pellets with a recent glass batch, I thought they would be more gentle. The thing to remember about plastic pellets (maybe it's in your book), they must always be used for the same step. If you have used pellets for step 2, do not let them continue into step 3 - there may be embedded grit. Put them aside, I put mine into a zip-top baggie and label them "step 2." and use different pellets for step 3, and different ones for step 4, etc.
There was discussion of a forum just for beginners, but it was decided that it is better for newbies to post here, where they can get lots of responses. A forum just for beginners might rarely be visited by the veterans, and questions would go unanswered. There has also been talk of combining particularly helpful posts or specifically-written articles for an encyclopedia-type section.
I keep my tumblers in the garage. Since I go out there every day, that's how I keep an eye on them.
Another thought - do a search in this section or the general one, look for.... hmmmm.... maybe "recipes," and see how many different ways we tumble to get our results. Different numbers of steps, different numbers of days, rinse cycles, burnishing, etc....
Whew! Is that tumbler tumbling yet? You can't reallly hurt them, they're ROCKS! ;D ;D
Keep us posted!
Amy
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Post by NatureNut on Jan 5, 2009 8:58:02 GMT -5
Well, I can offer Connrock's tutorial and the comments in that whole thread. forum.rocktumblinghobby.com/index.cgi?board=tottumb&action=display&thread=26081 He used a vibe and 220 grit, but there are pics of rocks that are ready to be moved on and pics of rocks that need to be rebroken/cut. It was really helpful to me! He did a great job with this. I'm sure somebody else will have some good tips to point you in the right direction. Good luck and Welcome! Jo |
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Post by Michael John on Jan 5, 2009 9:43:16 GMT -5
Bonnie, it's SO nice to have you here! Reading your posts, you seem like a real nice lady.
I'm just an old desert rat rockhound, but I'll give you my 2 cents and reiterations...
* Scratch tests are simple. The bottom line is that you test all of the stones that you want to put in the same batch just before you put them in there, just to make sure. It's just a scratch per stone, using the same "scratcher", so it'll only take you like 5 minutes. Every stone should have about the same result. This extra little test is just cheap insurance, just in case something snuck into your tumbling pile that shouldn't be there.
* The importance of thoroughly rinsing the barrels and stones when changing grit cannot be emphasized enough.
* Proper usage of filler is also very important, to minimize chipping and scratching. There are many types of filler, such as walnut shells, ceramic pellets, plastic pellets, marbles, pea gravel, etc. Ask for help when the time comes if you're unsure about which and how much to use.
* If you don't have a saw yet, I HIGHLY recommend that you run down to Home Depot IMMEDIATELY and buy a WorkForce tile saw. With tax, it'll set you back just under $100, but you'll find that it'll be the smartest money you ever spent on this hobby. There are about 200 of these saws floating around this forum! Rumour is that this saw is being discontinued, which is why I recommend getting one now.
* If you find that waiting a couple of months for a batch of stones is too frustrating, consider adding a vibratory tumbler to your arsenal. A LOT of people here do their rough tumbling in a rotary, then the rest of the procedure in their vibratory. It speeds-up the process a LOT, producing a LOT more finished stone over time. A vibratory tumbler will also give you the ability to tumble preforms, resulting in nice tumbled cabs with more defined edges ... great for pendants!
Not bad for a guy who's never tumbled a batch in his life, huh? LOL
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 5, 2009 10:11:09 GMT -5
Hello CUL-Ann! You must have heard my thought processes yesterday as I started my very first batch of rocks ;D and after they'd been tumbling for about 15 minutes, I looked at my husband and said "I should have taken pictures of the rocks before I put them in there" ...  I think I got too excited with the fact of finally having the nerve to get my feet wet and didn't think through. But I thank you for the great advice, if I had been more patient, I could have utilized it. I meant to add that I will very gladly share pictures of my gardens with all of you!! At this point, they're in their winter rest, so not much to see, but come Spring when they once again begin their show, I'll show them off! I added a Butterfly/Hummingbird garden this year off the side of the deck, and it's truly my favorite garden at this point. I have some pics of that in its infancy and I'll post them here. |
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Post by NatureNut on Jan 5, 2009 10:22:47 GMT -5
Bonnie, I'd love to see pics of your garden. I have one too! It's been going a few years now and I keep getting baby butterfly bushes and am now running out of places to transplant them! Looking forward to the pics! Jo
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 5, 2009 10:30:53 GMT -5
Amy, your post made me laugh ;D but again, a fountain of great advice and information! Thank you so much. From the posts on here I can see it's time to start in on my husband in efforts to convince him of how much "He" needs a Workforce saw.. I'm pretty good at this after 20 years together. I really do appreciate your comments on re-using the pellets, I had thought to just discard them after each batch. I'm proud to tell you that I did start my first batch yesterday, however you all failed to inform me of how difficult it was going to be to keep my paws off that thing once it started. I think I was running over there every 15 minutes wanting to stop the tumbler and look at the rocks! I am surprised that it's much quieter than I thought it would be. We are experimenting with running it in one of the far back bedrooms where my husband does some of his woodworking and so far it's not been bothersome at all as to noise. Thank you for the background info on the forum. Very good point about the experienced tumblers overlooking a newbie forum, I surely hadn't thought of that. Perhaps in the future (I truly don't wish to infringe on the forum at all) but maybe a sub-forum, closed to posting, where all this great information could be gathered and read. Just in this post alone, there is a wealth of experience and knowledge and excellent advice. I loved your ending comment about them being just rocks ;D I did have a small chat with them, advising them that this was probably not going to be the most pleasant experience they'd ever had, but the results would be worth the ride. ;D |
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 5, 2009 10:38:34 GMT -5
Jo, thank you for the welcome!! Gosh what a great link you sent. That was so informative and the pictures truly help to bring this process into some finer level of understanding. Thank you! I think at this point the vibratory tumbler is in the future, but for now I'll have to stay with the rotary and see what I can accomplish with that.
I'll send some pics of the Butterfly garden I planted last spring. It's truly in its baby stages in the pics, but I think this year it's really going to put on a show. If you ever have too many Butterfly Bushes you can send them to Missouri, I'd love to give them a home. ;D
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 5, 2009 10:47:29 GMT -5
Michael John, thank you for the welcome and the laughs! I never knew rock tumblers had such great senses of humor, what a great place to have landed! Well I started on the husband about the Workforce saw, I actually sent him a link to Home Depot just so "he could look at it" ...  I'll keep all of you posted on this adventure. I am definitely going to put a vibratory tumbler on the list of future additions. I think one of the most difficult aspects of this for me is going to be the "waiting". But I also think it will teach me much about the rewards of patience. I do have the plastic pellets and did put some with my first load. I'm also going to purchase some of the ceramic pellets just due to Amy's comments about preferences on filler material. I'd like to get a feel for which I would prefer to work with. I plan to share some pics of my first batch with all of you, but you have to promise not to laugh (well okay you can laugh, just do it nicely) ;D Once again, thank you to each and every one of you for your generosity and kindness. This is really a great group of people and already I feel as though I know so much more than I did just a couple of days ago. |
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navi
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since November 2008
Posts: 229
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Post by navi on Jan 5, 2009 10:56:13 GMT -5
for patience, sit by your tumbler, listen to the sound of the rocks grinding, close your eyes and meditatate, thinking about the beautiful bands that are coming out of the once dull stones!!!
Ommmmmmmmmmmmmm.......
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huffstuff
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since August 2007
Posts: 1,222
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Post by huffstuff on Jan 5, 2009 16:17:18 GMT -5
Bonnie, the pellets may get chewed up fairly quickly in the rough grit. That's why I usually wait until the second stage to add pellets.
I re-charge (replace or add to) my grit once a week, and I almost always rinse off every rock and check its progress! I can't help it. It's a lot more work with my 12 lb tumbler, though, so I'll probably get out of the habit.
My first batch, I found this forum too late and only did each stage for 1 week. It was a good learning experience. I got some shine, but there were lots of pits and crevices. That motivated me to have patience!
Amy
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 5, 2009 16:48:55 GMT -5
for patience, sit by your tumbler, listen to the sound of the rocks grinding, close your eyes and meditatate, thinking about the beautiful bands that are coming out of the once dull stones!!! Ommmmmmmmmmmmmm....... ;D Navi do I need to get that "ommmmmmmmmm" just right?? |
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 5, 2009 16:55:00 GMT -5
Amy, I'm so glad you brought up the issue of grit as I was just on here searching for guidelines on that. Hart's books gave some general rule of thumb guidelines, and essentially he said to use 4 TBS of grit for a 3 lb tumbler at 3/4 full (which is what I have) and it's also the amount I used. However, I was just looking through the manual which came with the tumbler from The Rock Shed and it states that once you have the rocks in the barrel, to pour in the package of grit. But this is a one pound package, do I use the whole one pound for just a couple pounds of rock? That just doesn't equate in my mind.
On the pellets, fortunately I used only a few of those in this stage, but definitely your advice would save me some money and I'll discontinue using those in the first stage. Do you ever add water to the barrel during the week?
Bonnie
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MikeS
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since January 2009
Posts: 1,081
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Post by MikeS on Jan 5, 2009 19:08:38 GMT -5
The 4 TBS per 3lb. is the correct one. I tend to use 1 TBS per lb. rock in my rotory tumbler. IME it's better to use too little grit rather than too much. If you use too much, it seems to just get trapped in the slurry that is quickly produced and loses its effectiveness and ends up getting wasted. As for adding water, you don't need to add additional water in a rotory if you start with the correct amount. Hope this helps....
Mike
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firstrune
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2009
Posts: 156
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Post by firstrune on Jan 5, 2009 20:04:35 GMT -5
Mike, thanks a million, that REALLY does help. I've been worried that I already made a disaster out of my first attempt at this.  , so your comments have been very reassuring. Thank you also for the comments on needing to add water, one less thing I'll worry about. Bonnie |
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Hart talks about these and the small ceramic shapes which he prefers. Do you use the makeup media in all batches, or just the final couple of batches? 
I think I got too excited with the fact of finally having the nerve to get my feet wet and didn't think through. But I thank you for the great advice, if I had been more patient, I could have utilized it. 
I'll keep all of you posted on this adventure. 
, so your comments have been very reassuring. Thank you also for the comments on needing to add water, one less thing I'll worry about. 
