Haleysdream
has rocks in the head
K-9 unit Rock Hounds
Member since January 2010
Posts: 654
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Post by Haleysdream on Feb 17, 2010 11:49:11 GMT -5
HI I am looking at 2 saws to buy ( first one) please help me *& give your opinions on these, the first one is used and is a Highland Park 6'' Lapidary Trim Rock Saw Cab Polisher. I don't know what a fair price would be and also is it any good. Then second is a Lortone LUX6-130 Combination Rock Saw/Grinder/Polisher New & is priced under $500. My main question about both is that can I saw slabs & polish with both ( seems like it) . An is the Highland Park 6'' too small a of a blade, meaning I would only be able to cut rock with a max thickness of 3"? I realize these may seem like elementary questions but I need your experience to make a decision. Thanks
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Post by deb193redux on Feb 17, 2010 17:34:33 GMT -5
Can't really do slabs with either. If you put a thickish (e.g., .040) 6" blade on those you might be able to cut 1.5" nodules into slabbetts w/o bending blade. Unless you drive it faster than 1750 RPM it will be slowish compared to a 7" tile saw.
They only way you come close to cutting 3" of rock on a 6" blade is if you have close to 1.5" above the table and you carefully rotate the rock on the blade. Most likely you will not get an even slab or escape w/o a center nipple.
For good slabs of a 3" rock, you need a 10" saw.
SOme people like saw/grinder combo units and others don't like the saw running while they grind and polish.
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Post by frane on Feb 17, 2010 22:19:23 GMT -5
My first saw was on the inland swap top. The saw had a 6 1/2" trim saw and it could only slice about 3/4" max depth. It was really only for trimming preforms from slabs and the blades wore out really fast. It was very frustrating because, like you, I thought with that size blade, I could cut a larger rock. I listened to the folks on this board and got a tile saw to try out and see how that worked. I bought one at Sears for 79 dollars and I am so happy I did! Now, it has a 7" blade and will only cut about 1 1/4" and I have had to learn to roll larger rocks to get an even slice and that is hard, but I have learned that I do not have to spend a fortune to get a good saw that doesn't take forever to cut stones. I guess my advise would be keep your grinders and wheels separate from the saw. If you want, you can get a good tile saw for under $100 and the replacement blades are $20 or less and they last so much longer than the specialty ones that you need a specific blade for. Then, if you find that you enjoy cutting stones (and I am sure you will) you can plan out what will fit your space and pocketbook. That is just my two cents. Fran
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Post by johnjsgems on Feb 18, 2010 23:56:33 GMT -5
6" saws equal maybe 1.5" cutting height. Nice trim saw size. I'd buy a Highland Park anything over a Lortone anything if I had a choice. It is commonly said HP went broke because they built equipment that didn't wear out so customers never came back.
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brent
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since November 2008
Posts: 1,316
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Post by brent on Feb 19, 2010 8:35:38 GMT -5
The 6" combo unit is the first piece I bought when I was 13, and still have it. It was great when I was younger, but seems like I need an eight inch unit now.
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Post by Donnie's Rocky Treasures on Feb 19, 2010 8:37:44 GMT -5
I just recently got my first saw too & I got a Husky for a little over $100.00. Home Depot had it on sale. It's a good strong saw for cutting slabs but you can't cut rock that are too big. I haven't learned to roll them too good yet so had so messes to straighten out on my cabbing machine.
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Haleysdream
has rocks in the head
K-9 unit Rock Hounds
Member since January 2010
Posts: 654
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Post by Haleysdream on Feb 20, 2010 9:44:57 GMT -5
Thank you all for your response, the last thing I want to do is buy equipment that Isn't what I thought. I will look into the tile type saws. Nancy
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nancyid
has rocks in the head
No stone goes unturned.
Member since January 2009
Posts: 563
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Post by nancyid on Feb 20, 2010 14:38:22 GMT -5
Nancy, you should check with Tony (Catmandew). He usually has used saws for reasonable. I got my HP 10" from him and it is a workhorse! idahorockshop.comGlad you got your package in good shape Nancy
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cornorstone
off to a rocking start
Member since February 2009
Posts: 19
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Post by cornorstone on Feb 23, 2010 12:00:11 GMT -5
for what it's worth, I have a 3 year old Lortone 6" trim saw that I would like to sell. I live in minneapolis, and can send pictures if you wish.
Don
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docharber
has rocks in the head
Member since October 2008
Posts: 716
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Post by docharber on Feb 23, 2010 23:16:51 GMT -5
Good input from all. i have a ROck Rascal 6" saw I bought off eBay. Simplem, cheap and reliable. You can get a small rock vise for these. Usually, you must provide a 1/4 HP or larger 1750 RPM motor. The Indian made blades sold by ROcklady on eBay are very good values, by the way. You'll need to make sure you have an appropriate adapter for your saw, so email the vendor to make sure you get one. these are the sintered blue blades. For minislabs and small nodules, a 7" Work Force is often cited. What is sokld as a WF sw now from Home Depot is the same as the Sears saw. The original blades with the old WFs were very good but the new ones have a crummy blade that won't last long at all. You will get maybe 3-4 hours work out of a decent blade. I got an eMail from a board member about the Hot Dog blades I have used and they are wonderful. They may be onsale at home Depot now and he said he found 10" blades for $20- a terrigic deal. They cut smoothly and leave a nice surface. I have read comments about a Ryobi saw that seemed a good value and was about $150. I'd checkl it out over the current WF, if I cared about the blade quality.
If you make the jump to a combination saw, 10" or larger for both trim sawing and amall alabbing work, there are lots of options. A more expensive tile saw might do, but the blades last better with oil coolant and that means you need a hood to catch the spray. i'm considering a 14". Basically, a saw can cut no more than the exposed blade width in one pass, or 1/3 the blade diameter max. So a 10" blade will only cut a 3+" rock in one pass. You can roll the material over the blade easily with the smaller tile saws, though, but expect the cuts to have a step-off on the cut surface. For any large material, I would get a lapidary saw with a vise and power feed. It gets really tiring to hold a rock in [place as it's cut if it's big.
As for a grinder, lots of options. I started with a flat grinder like the inland b and still like it a lot- an Ameritool 8: machine. It has its falts, but is a pretty rugged machine overall. It's a good buy at about $640 plussshipping. includes all needed accessories. If you aren't doing production work or want to polish flat surfaces, it's a great maching. A 6" vertical grinder is a good idea for most cabbers. Anything larger is more costly to buy and replacement wheels more expensive. Given a choice, ALWAYS opt for diamond wheels. My unit has 2 8" metal wheels with diamond abrasive in 80 and 220 grit. i have 2 3" wide expanding rubber drums for belts that take the finish home to polishing stage. Finally, I have a velvet buff plate onone end and a leather covered metal plate on the other. These are charges with diamond or other polish as desired. The elather pad is used, as I understand, without any added abrasive for wet polishing by some hobbyiosts. I am not using it at all yet, but plan to try it with cerium oxide.
Importabnt considerations include the material of the cabinet/splash guard, ease of draining, water supply- plumbed as mine can be, pump in a bucket like mine is, or gravity drip like many small units including my Ameritool flat lap. Differences in the construction quality that matter include the thickness of the metal housing, which is important in vibration control and durability, The material itself, in regard to corrosion resistance- mine is stainless steel with a powder coat, versus light weight steel in the Lortone, or aluminum, which makes the unit ligghter and more protable. The drive shaft on my machine is 1" stainless steel and won't rust. The motor is separate on mine, whereas on the Diamond pacificGenie, the mounting shafty is in one piece with the motor. If the Genie breaks, you got a major repair bill. With a separate motor, just switch it out for a used appliance motor bought locally from a repair shop for $20-30. The better machines have better motors. mine is a Baldor, a famous manufacturer of industrialquality motor. No cheap chinese Dung Poo. Mine is a 150 lb monster, and it goes NOWHERE, but If you want to splurge, the Genie is a very popular and high quality, fairly portable machine but prticey (2 grand). The COvington equipment is heavy duty and very good quality by all accounts, at a fair price. Rather than quote prices from memory, i'll refer you to John's website JSGems, where I bought my equipment. You WON'Tdo any better than John pricewise and you certainly won't get better unbiased advice- refreshing in a dealer. He's been a lot of help to me. Barranca diamond still manufactures some of their saws and equipment to original HighlandPark sepecifications, by the way.
I would not buy Inland equipment for more than occasional light use, based on others' experiences. Lortone is lower priced equipment than other brands, but for the money is probably sufficient for most hobbyists. The metal is lighter guage, the motors a little cheaper, the machine not as feature packed generally, and less rigid/durable in hevy use. One nice thing about Lortone, though, is that they spare parts are easy to come by and their customer service is good. Some of their saws have overly aggressive pwer feed, ar not adjustable, and will wear out expensive blades real fast. So, fast cutting is not necessarily a good thing. I would have to say that for what they aer, lapidary equipment is very expensive, but will last a long time and you generally will be better off buying a little more machine than you think you'll need. In my case, the flat lap is really nice for indoor work and for flats, and overall easier to use for me than the vertical wheel machine. i find I get more uniform surface grinding and polishing on the flat lap than the wheel, but I'm suyre I'll get better in time. I can cut shallow concave shapes with the vertical wheel maching i can't cut on the flat lap. The flat lap is slower and thus more forgiving for novices like me. Whatever you choose, do yourself a favor and go for quality. You won't regret it.
Mark H.
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bobh
having dreams about rocks
Member since September 2009
Posts: 55
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Post by bobh on Feb 24, 2010 0:13:14 GMT -5
Nice comments, Mark.
Bob
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Haleysdream
has rocks in the head
K-9 unit Rock Hounds
Member since January 2010
Posts: 654
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Post by Haleysdream on Feb 24, 2010 16:16:26 GMT -5
Yes, Thanks Mark, that's alot to take in and absorb but very helpful. Nancy
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Post by Bikerrandy on Feb 24, 2010 17:08:00 GMT -5
Get a 10 inch saw! 6 inch saws are pretty much good for cutting preforms, that's pretty much it.
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Post by johnjsgems on Feb 24, 2010 19:29:16 GMT -5
Randy is correct. The 10" "slab and trim" type saws are the most versatile saws if you can only have one. Good used ones run from $300-$500 and brand new in the $900-$1100 range. You can generally slab up to 3.5" rocks and trim slabs also. Jump to 14"-16" and price pretty much doubles. 18"-20" doubles again.
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