lloyd1wv
starting to shine!
Member since December 2010
Posts: 47
|
Post by lloyd1wv on Jan 9, 2011 12:24:59 GMT -5
I've been using a Raytech Tumble Vibe, but recently bought a Lot O. Looks like there's a good bit of difference on how to handle this machine. Maybe a bit of experience down the road I can do a comparison between the two units.---- In the mean time, to satisfy my curiosity, does any one know why Cerium Oxide polish does not work well in the Lot O ? (That's what the instructions say). Thanks !
|
|
|
Post by Jack ( Yorkshire) on Jan 10, 2011 4:04:32 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by deb193redux on Jan 10, 2011 8:44:14 GMT -5
couly you quote exactly what that bit of instructions say? are these manafacturer, or something posted here?
|
|
|
Post by johnjsgems on Jan 10, 2011 9:41:25 GMT -5
For some reason it is commonly said that cerium won't work as well as sub micron aluminum in a vibe. I hear tin oxide for vibe laps also. According to Covington, cerium just went up 700% so if you have some I would save it for special projects like apache tears or faceting quartz or something. Maybe hide it under your mattress.
|
|
lloyd1wv
starting to shine!
Member since December 2010
Posts: 47
|
Post by lloyd1wv on Jan 10, 2011 9:43:31 GMT -5
This is taken from the manufacturer's instructions::: "Cerium Oxide has not proven to be a good polish for use in the Lot-O-Tumbler". - Sure beats me as to what difference it would make. (I haven't tried it yet myself. I was just wondering about the manufacturer's recommendation) -Good to see you had good luck with it Jack. Thanks!
|
|
lloyd1wv
starting to shine!
Member since December 2010
Posts: 47
|
Post by lloyd1wv on Jan 13, 2011 8:39:43 GMT -5
Yesterday I wrote n "E" mail to the folks who make the Lot O, asking them to further explain why they put that statement in their instructions. --Here's what their response was::: "Because it has been proven not to work in the Vibrator like the Alu oxides or tin, but is made for rolling tumbler Thanks" ---- That really doesn't tell us much more. But apparently they seem to believe that there is a general consensus that CO doesn't work well in Vibes. I just can't wrap my head around what would be the difference in the vibe vs the rolling tumbler in so far as a polish working differently is concerned. I would say this particularly about the Lot-O, because when you observe the action of this machine, the materials are moving much like they would in a roller. Oh well.....
|
|
|
Post by johnjsgems on Jan 13, 2011 9:31:03 GMT -5
If you have cerium it wouldn't hurt the tumbler or rocks to try it. If you don't have any, submicron aluminum would be less expensive now anyway. I had a long conversation with Val Carver at MLS about polish. According to his tests:
3-4 micron aluminum - great for most rocks in a barrel tumbler, works as well as cerium on most hard stones on buffs
.3 micron aluminum - Great in vibes, wider range of rocks on buffs, good for faceting in most cases where Linde A would be used
Tin oxide - best for vibe laps of all polishes.
|
|
Digforcrystals
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2008
Posts: 351
|
Post by Digforcrystals on Jan 13, 2011 10:06:11 GMT -5
John, When you mentioned the cerium going up I went to the covington website to see what it was running. Next I went to Kingsley North because I was going to order some now if their price had not of went up yet. Oddly enough, it is the same price now on kinglsey North and they have the same peculiar wording as the covington website. This makes me suspect that Covington was the supplier for Kingsley North ?
|
|
firewalker45
freely admits to licking rocks
Member since August 2006
Posts: 929
|
Post by firewalker45 on Jan 13, 2011 10:19:48 GMT -5
I think I read in one of my tumbling books;that CO tends to break down too rapidly in a vibe tumbler. Daniel
|
|
|
Post by johnjsgems on Jan 13, 2011 10:30:54 GMT -5
A lot of companies do sell to each other but I have no idea on the cerium. Covington said it comes out of China though and the Chinese raised the price.
|
|
rockhound97058
freely admits to licking rocks
Thundereggs - Oregons Official State Rock!
Member since January 2006
Posts: 760
|
Post by rockhound97058 on Jan 13, 2011 10:51:42 GMT -5
John - I have a lortone vibra-lap I've had for 12+ years. I've had it strictly set up for polishing and I used Tin Oxide for years - wonderful polish! The a few years ago the price of it sky rocketed and I switched to Super Cerium as I could buy it from Richardson's Ranch for $15.00lb - I called there a few weeks ago on a different matter and Bonnie told me they raised the price on Cerium - Their wholesale cost for it was now $70.00lb - So there were looking for other dealers and other products.
Luckily I have 5lbs stashed away as that's all I use now is Super Cerium.
This past summer I ordered through Kingsley for a ton of stuff, and I bought 5 pounds of their polish called Raybrite A - Their statement (It works great in vibra-laps) - So I got some, tried it in a vibra lap and that stuff sucks! It never would polish anything, and it made a hell of a mess due to foaming. Never in my life had I seen a polish do that. Almost like it's cut with tide soap or something.
Anyrate before long the cost of all of our supplies will get to the point it will kill the hobby. I'm amazed so far the Government doesn't try to enforce us to carry a rock collecting permit and charge a annual fee so they can fill thier pockets deeper.
|
|
|
Post by johnjsgems on Jan 13, 2011 11:00:06 GMT -5
I heard AZ is doing that now on some of the government land. The tree hugging powers in CA are regulating by making everything Wilderness Study areas with roads closed. You can hobby collect as long as you hike in and pack out. Pretty much eliminates rock hounding for all but the fittest. Time to adopt a burro from BLM maybe.
|
|
lloyd1wv
starting to shine!
Member since December 2010
Posts: 47
|
Post by lloyd1wv on Jan 13, 2011 11:46:02 GMT -5
Thanks folks! Really good discussion. So then it seems that the particle size of the polish is kind of the key to it's effectiveness?? - And this may sound sort of dumb, But in a small vibe it doesn't take much polish; so would there be a problem with using a little of each added together to take advantage of the positives of each?
|
|
Digforcrystals
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2008
Posts: 351
|
Post by Digforcrystals on Jan 13, 2011 12:14:54 GMT -5
I have wondered this exact same thing!
|
|
snowdog
fully equipped rock polisher
RIP David Fildes, aka: snowdog
Member since January 2005
Posts: 1,527
|
Post by snowdog on Jan 13, 2011 14:05:08 GMT -5
-- sounds to me like someone didn't like cerium -- I don't have a lot'o but do have the vibra-sonic 's -- used it in them for thirty years before I ever tried another polish --- granted there are some rocks that don't like to polish with cerium but ------- I was wondering if the polish they make today is alot softer than the old stuff ? and breaks down quicker but isn't that what you want ? like when using any grit you start out with the bigger then move to finer ? 60/80, 220 ,600 etc. ---and the same with diamond wheels --some will quit with 3000, or maybe 8000 ,but others will go on to 25000, 50000, 100,000 etc ----- the finer it is the better the shine -------- but you don't want to start out with 50,000 -- and that may be what the cerium is doing, getting crushed before it's time , but, it will still polish , just take alot longer
|
|
|
Post by johnjsgems on Jan 13, 2011 16:07:45 GMT -5
Gy-Roc markets a grit kit that includes their blend. Aluminum, chrome oxide, and a third one they wouldn't tell me. It is very pale green so not much chrome oxide.
|
|
lloyd1wv
starting to shine!
Member since December 2010
Posts: 47
|
Post by lloyd1wv on Jan 13, 2011 19:09:56 GMT -5
Several times in this thread we speak about polish "breaking down". In other threads I read that it doesn't break down, and in fact, can be used over and over. Which is it?
|
|