playin4funami
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since March 2011
Posts: 87
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Post by playin4funami on May 6, 2011 22:16:00 GMT -5
I have been using 120 in 1st stage and 220 in 2nd stage, followed by tripoli and then polish, has anybody really worked with the harsher grit for a first stage like 60 or 80 grit? Does it speed up shaping and smoothing on the rough? I am thinking about ordering some for the really rough stuff that goes into the tumblers, cause 120 seems to take forever to smooth down some of these rocks, it seems it would also save on grit cost in the long run as more rough work would get done in a less amount of time(electricity) and less recharges (grit).
Please voice your opinions, thanks.
Also I heard mention of dry tumbling to speed things up, does this work and explain it to me pros and cons,etc.
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quartz
Cave Dweller
breakin' rocks in the hot sun
Member since February 2010
Posts: 3,352
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Post by quartz on May 6, 2011 22:43:37 GMT -5
You didn't say how big your tumbler is, or size of mtl. you're running. We run a 1 3/4 gallon and a five gallon unit, tumbling mtl. runs from tiny to 8-9 pounds. Always start with 80 or 60-90 for roughing beach or river stuff that's pretty well rounded by Ma Nature, then to 220 and ... For really rough "hillside" mtl., we start with 16 grit, sometimes having to run it twice. Our main tumbling mtl. is quartz; agate, jasper, and pet wood. Never heard of dry tumbling, no comment there.
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Digforcrystals
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2008
Posts: 351
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Post by Digforcrystals on May 7, 2011 5:14:59 GMT -5
Not meaning to get off topic here, but you mentioned tumbling rocks "8 or 9 pounds"? I'd really like to see pictures of these! Maybe you could start another thread with some pictures of large tumbles?
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Post by johnjsgems on May 7, 2011 9:26:07 GMT -5
Most people use 60/90 as first step in a rotary. Not available in all countries but is a little less expensive than straight grade 80. It used to be called "80 ungraded" and is a mixed grade 60-90 with 80 average.
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Post by susand24224 on May 7, 2011 19:00:39 GMT -5
I use the following on "harder" rocks:
80 grit, first stage (got a good deal and it was cheaper than 60/90, but really works about the same).
120/220 second stage (or I run the 80 for two weeks and skip this stage)
500 third stage
wash
polish
Burnish.
On *very* fragile rocks, I skip 80 (or 60/90) and go straight to 120/220, then 500, then 1000, etc.
I've used 46/70--didn't see that much difference between using this and using 60/90 but it made me feel better when I was frustrated.
I can image 120 taking forever, as sometimes I feel that way about 80!
Susan
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quartz
Cave Dweller
breakin' rocks in the hot sun
Member since February 2010
Posts: 3,352
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Post by quartz on May 8, 2011 9:32:53 GMT -5
In answer to digforcrystals question; if we ever get a sunny or even bright overcast day I'll put up a pic. Tried bunches of light box attempts and can't get the bright spot out. Larry
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charles kuchar
spending too much on rocks
getting ready for the second coming
Member since November 2010
Posts: 300
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Post by charles kuchar on May 9, 2011 6:15:00 GMT -5
with my ar-2 three pound tumbler, two barrels, i use 60/90 sic in the first stage for most types of rocks. i use three rounded tablespoons or 4 level tbsp in the first stage. then use 3 tbsp of 120/220 for the second stage. now i am trying ao500 for a third stage instead of tripoli. does anyone have and amount of 500 for this stage? i did use 2 tbsp this time but might need less than that? and any suggestions on the time for the third stage. two weeks? i have found that longer stages do a better job. charlie
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stefan
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2005
Posts: 14,113
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Post by stefan on May 9, 2011 8:26:49 GMT -5
My "usual" cycle is: 60/90- till done (checking every 2 weeks, recharging, and filling up for lost volume) 120/220- 2 weeks 500- 2 weeks- with pellets Tripoli- 2 weeks with pellets Polish- 2 weeks with pellets Burnish- 24 hours, borax and pellets
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playin4funami
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since March 2011
Posts: 87
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Post by playin4funami on May 9, 2011 22:56:46 GMT -5
thanks all guess I missed the boat on the rougher tumbling grit when I started this stuff,time to get some rough stuff ordered, anybody use what they call synter(sp?) or something like that, I can get that at the local welding and sandblasting supply place pretty cheap.
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Post by johnjsgems on May 10, 2011 8:40:14 GMT -5
Most sand blasting supplies will be much softer than SC. SC breaks down but stays sharp where softer materials just break down. Costs less to pay more in this case.
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stefan
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2005
Posts: 14,113
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Post by stefan on May 10, 2011 8:41:16 GMT -5
Don't bother- I called one of the media companies to ask what it was. Basically coal slag klinkers that are ground up. The rep told me in no uncertian terms that it WOULD NOT work as a tumbling media.
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Post by Jack, lapidaryrough on May 10, 2011 9:54:19 GMT -5
some other nice material to run in a large load, Blasting Garnet 4 - 8mm hardness of 8 - 8.5
SC wheel broken up to 3/4 minus.
ceramic, though they mud slurry fast.
Ore-met in Albany Oregon, has use`d Sapphire wheels, for their titanium grinding.
Rare to get i may have them all. best rough grinding material ever!.
40/70 take forever to break down, good rough cutting. in large barrels.
60/90 breaks down good. 3 weeks in a 15 lb. size it may be 220 grit to fine 3-F grit.
120 waste to use skip that phase.
on to 600 grit. 4th week.
though i use 45 - 70 lb. loads. in a rotary
Jack in Oregon
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Post by Jack, lapidaryrough on May 10, 2011 10:01:53 GMT -5
You didn't say how big your tumbler is, or size of mtl. you're running. We run a 1 3/4 gallon and a five gallon unit, tumbling mtl. runs from tiny to 8-9 pounds. Always start with 80 or 60-90 for roughing beach or river stuff that's pretty well rounded by Ma Nature, then to 220 and ... For really rough "hillside" mtl., we start with 16 grit, sometimes having to run it twice. Our main tumbling mtl. is quartz; agate, jasper, and pet wood. Never heard of dry tumbling, no comment there. Fiction weight, and size of barrel. depend on how fast a rough grind 1st stage well take. And the amount of water used. rocks circulate in a tear drop fall from top to bottom, 15 lb. with a wide diameter work best. for the action of the course grit in 1st stage. barrels that are design like a pipe i don`t use. 10" by 14 tube design. best to have a wide diameter like 20" by and the length of barrel 14". so on. sizes does matter. in rotary tumblers.
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Post by Jack ( Yorkshire) on May 10, 2011 12:29:55 GMT -5
Hi I agree with Jack above from personal experiance as I started of with 1 1/2 lb barrels that took ages to grind and then progressed on to paint tins 6 lb the difference was amazing I run a 6lb hex lortone and 1 x 6 lb Thumbler on stage one rough stage
Put simply there is more cross area friction in a bigger barrel + weight on stones giving a faster grind
Speed also needs to be considered as it all works out into feet per minuite , as a barrel going at 30m RPM to One going at 60 RPM I dont have to coment on the obvious
Jack Yorkshire UK
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Post by rocklicker on May 10, 2011 14:27:58 GMT -5
My grit sequence is the same as Stephan's except I cut down 120/240 and 500 down to a week each, and 7-10 days in Tripoli.
As far as barrel speed, you want the rocks o be able to come up the sides of the barrel and fall down. Too slow and they won't "tumble" down. Too fast and they will just keep going around the side. For barrel diameters, here's a rough guess (based on my experience only) 3lb barrel 35-40 RPM 12lb hex barrel 24 RPM Steve
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Post by Jack, lapidaryrough on May 10, 2011 19:16:04 GMT -5
By lapidary at 2008-09-19 By lapidary at 2008-09-19 This one is 11" x 24" RPM 16.5
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Post by paulshiroma on May 10, 2011 23:57:04 GMT -5
Gang, this was a GREAT thread. While it's not my line, I do appreciate all of you sharing and weighing in like this. Playin4funami - thanks for starting this!
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Post by Jack ( Yorkshire) on May 11, 2011 2:49:37 GMT -5
Hi Steve and all Grit how it is made and graded , 5 pages on polishing different rocks a excelent little book first published in 1962 at $2 -00 For all intersted in Calculations ,Critical speeds, and constructions of a tumbler, Goop constiuancy www.therockshed.com/grit.htmlI have given more detail in a new thread as it is not about Grits see www.therockshed.com/grit.htmlJack Yorkshire uk
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Post by Jack, lapidaryrough on May 11, 2011 17:55:08 GMT -5
Best shop manual ever, Lapidary Journals. Shop works. 1964.
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Jasper-hound
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since June 2010
Posts: 208
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Post by Jasper-hound on May 11, 2011 21:15:19 GMT -5
With My 24 pound Diamond Pacific Rotary, I keep it charged with 60/90 and every two weeks removed any rocks that are ready to finish, add new rough, and freshen up the charge. The machine runs all the time. On average, a rough agate will stay in there for one to two months.
Rocks ready to finish move directly to the ultravibe and I use AO 1000 for about two days. After that, the rocks are returned to the Ultravibe after washing and receive AO polish, with a little bit of rice hulls to slow the action some. After a couple days they have a mirror finish.
You might wonder how I can go directly from 60/90 to 1000, but believe me, after going for a month or two in coarse, the rocks get smoothed pretty quickly in 1000. If I have preforms with grinding scratches remaining, I'll do a couple days in the vibe at 220 before proceeding to the 1000.
Craig
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