Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2013 15:33:58 GMT -5
Need help, What am I doing wrong? Lortone 33b small tumbling mixes I've been filling 2/3 full of various size rock, 4 tbs of 60-90 and water up to the point I can see it touching top level of rocks
I run them for 4-5 days and check them, rocks are not looking too good. the water is just thin milky water, no grit at all, dump it out in strainer, all the $$$ grit is on the bottom.
clean it all up try again fresh, same results
whats wrong?
Appreciate any advice Dave
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Post by Toad on Apr 12, 2013 15:57:35 GMT -5
Never used barrels that small, so not sure...
Sounds like you have a good mix of rocks. Do you have any ceramic media that is even smaller than the rocks - or maybe some rock chips?
Water level sounds right too, but maybe try a little less.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 12, 2013 16:07:36 GMT -5
If the tumbler is too full and the rocks are not rolling grit can not mix.Most likely it is too wet though.So that all the grit falls to the bottom by the time you get the lid off.Clean water usually means too much water.If you lower the water you make the rocks stickier and then the grit will start to get circulated.I run mine a bit lower than the rocks-try an inch.In 24 hours i think your water will be muddy with rock dust.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Apr 12, 2013 17:04:39 GMT -5
I use four ounces of water in my Lortone 33B. I always add the water and then the grit so I don't wash the grit to the bottom. I don't think that really matters, but that's what I do.
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Post by deb193redux on Apr 12, 2013 17:07:35 GMT -5
possibly do not have as much smaller rock as needed. can you post a pic of the sizes and variety of you rock load?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2013 17:29:04 GMT -5
Thanks for the responses so far, I do believe I have plenty of small stuff & variety of size, Also used a few small ceramic pellets, I went ahead and loaded up again, 2 drums This time I added water up to about an inch below the top of the rocks, Then added grit, I'll check it tomorrow evening, if its too thick I can add a little water
Dave
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 12, 2013 17:33:53 GMT -5
Yep.The grit has no choice but to stick if you lessen the water.Does that make sense to you?
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Minnesota Daniel
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Post by Minnesota Daniel on Apr 13, 2013 1:17:03 GMT -5
After 4 or 5 days in a 3 lb barrel your slurry should be thin and watery and the grit should be mostly coarse still, and sunk to the bottom. Sounds like you doing it right. I started with a 33b, and now use a qt66. The smaller diameter 3lb barrels are slow. Really slow. Wait ten days before you check it, and expect to still feel some coarse grit at the bottom of the barrel even then.
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Geoff
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Post by Geoff on Apr 13, 2013 14:19:11 GMT -5
I had problems with slow/no slurry. reduced water worked great.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 13, 2013 15:28:05 GMT -5
Water should get dirty soon.If not the grit is not cutting.Clean and/or thin water is due to lack of grinding action...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2013 17:04:57 GMT -5
Its been 24 hours, I opened them up and the rocks are a little gritty, water is still somewhat clear, not gray, and 75% of the Grit is all on the bottom stuck together with a layer of rocks that obviously were not tumbling, My guess now is Alot of my rough is just too big, Looking at my 1st successfull batch, they are mostly smaller rocks Either I start breaking rocks or get a QT66
Dave
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Post by deb193redux on Apr 13, 2013 17:22:08 GMT -5
even with the bigger barrel, you need a lot of the small stuff to carry the grit and fill the voids. you can just have a few more larger ones with a larger barrel.
it is a size pyramid, and you cannot eliminate the base of the pyramid.
Remember the bottom is the side when tumbling. That grit had to settle while you were opening the lid. So all rocks were tumbling, but not touching other rocks enough. Likely because no small rocks between the larger ones.
maybe you can add some rock crumbs to help jump start slurry.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 13, 2013 19:47:44 GMT -5
Yep,add smalls.
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Minnesota Daniel
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Post by Minnesota Daniel on Apr 14, 2013 1:38:02 GMT -5
Water should get dirty soon.If not the grit is not cutting.Clean and/or thin water is due to lack of grinding action... When was the last time you used a 3lb barrel? There's no way you'll see much of a difference after just 24 hrs unless you're tumbling something pretty soft, like sodalite. If you're tumbling Lakers, you'll see NO difference at all after just 24 hrs. Dave, you're getting a lot of good advice, but you haven't said anything that convinces me that you actually have a problem. What are you tumbling - how hard is it? What size are the biggest rocks in your barrel? When I talk about adding "smalls", I mean smaller than a marble. What do you mean when you say you have a good mix of sizes? The next time you have it washed, maybe you can take picture of the load and post it? OK, assuming you have the right mix, and about the right amount of water, I'd only suggest adding a bit more soap, and try adding some Borax if you haven't already. I use about one tbls. in a 3 lb barrel. Then let it tumble for a whole week before you take a look at it.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 14, 2013 7:27:12 GMT -5
That's true,things should take a while in a small barrel.I insist on a sticky slurry though.And reducing the water is a simple way to get there.Especially when tumbling round rocks,they are the worst about letting the grit wash off.I mostly tumble sharp flat chips and they are efficient at circulating the grit even when real wet.Or coral w/rough skin.But river pebbles wash off and are best run a lot dryer in the beginning to get a cutting paste to coat the rocks.You may not see a big change in the hard pebbles but you should see the grit sticking totally to everything.Clear slurry means there is zero rock dust in the slurry.Dirty is necessary,dirty is good.That means you are removing particles off the rock.Smalls and balanced sizes helps.I takes 5-10 minutes to get the grit to stick.Try using less water,say a quarter full for 2 minutes.Bet you got a sticky mess in there.Let it run fo a while.You can't damage bulletproof lakers in slow rolling 3 pound barrel.THEN add water to keep it from being too sticky till you arrive at a wet mud consistency. It realy is all about the water. If you really want to make the grit stick.Put 1/4 wet rocks in barrel,sprinkle 1/4 grit on those,add another 1/4 wet rocks and sprinkle 1/4 of the grit etc and etc.Add no water and put cap on and let it roll.That will make it very difficult for the grit to settle to the bottom and force it too stick to the rocks.Then slowly add doses of water till you get a nice sticky slurry.
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tkvancil
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Post by tkvancil on Apr 16, 2013 12:23:50 GMT -5
I have two 33b's that I have been running for a little over 2 years. My first attempts were failures. My issues were overloading the barrels, and too much water. You are at 2/3rds so your good there. I have seen the grit settled at the bottom thing when opening the barrels. Sounds to me like you've got too much water. These days I add 1/2 cup water to a 2/3rds loaded barrel. Depending on the size of the rocks on top I sometimes can't even see the water unless I tip the barrel a little. Also it has been my experience that the 3# barrels won't use up all the coarse grit in 5 days. I run mine 7 days until I open them. Even after 7 days there is a small amount of unused grit but the slurry is gravy thick and the rocks are under the slurry level. My advice would be cut back on the water and let 'em run longer. If you have too little water the sound will tell you. In a "dry" barrel the rocks stick to the sides and fall instead of rolling and tumbling. Hard to describe the sound it makes but I think you'll know it if it happens. In that case open and add more water, otherwise go the 7 days without opening. Lastly , like the others said small rocks are important. In my 3# batches I generally have 30% or so rocks in the 1/4 to 3/8 inch range. Lots of smalls help get grit to all the rock surfaces. Best of luck and keep asking questions. You'll get good advice here.
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