|
Post by helens on Jun 19, 2013 21:17:02 GMT -5
His winning the election proves how self centered he is?! Billy... he's the President of the United States. Many things have changed and are changing in the world, but that's still the most powerful office on planet earth, by ANYONE's reckoning. If anyone deserves to feel a bit self centered, I would think the man in that office would be. And he won not once, but twice, it was no accident. What do you want to wager that the Dems lose both Houses in 2014? Didn't you owe me a piece of amber already ?
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,557
|
Post by jamesp on Jun 20, 2013 7:25:23 GMT -5
The 2 wins of Obama proves an unhealthy America.This is what we keep trying to tell you. Because the population has swung unfavorably and the slackers came out to vote that day. It has set us back 8 years.Meantime China stepped it up and may have irreversibly passed us by. I hope our younger generation are miracle workers.I do not see too much killer instinct in them,perhaps i am blind.It takes a dozen i have to get rid of before i find a great young worker.And i pay him max so i do not have to find another. Voting in Obama saddens me.It shows a large percentage of our population came to vote that were needing miracle.And an easier way.Hard work and frugality is going to be our motto if we are to continue as world power.Obama looks like he is more into his pretty wife's bangs.
|
|
bushmanbilly
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2008
Posts: 4,719
|
Post by bushmanbilly on Jun 20, 2013 11:36:00 GMT -5
His winning the election proves how self centered he is?! Billy... he's the President of the United States. Many things have changed and are changing in the world, but that's still the most powerful office on planet earth, by ANYONE's reckoning. If anyone deserves to feel a bit self centered, I would think the man in that office would be. And he won not once, but twice, it was no accident. What do you want to wager that the Dems lose both Houses in 2014? Didn't you owe me a piece of amber already ? Pm me your address.
|
|
|
Post by helens on Jun 20, 2013 11:41:26 GMT -5
The 2 wins of Obama proves an unhealthy America.This is what we keep trying to tell you. Because the population has swung unfavorably and the slackers came out to vote that day. It has set us back 8 years.Meantime China stepped it up and may have irreversibly passed us by. I hope our younger generation are miracle workers.I do not see too much killer instinct in them,perhaps i am blind.It takes a dozen i have to get rid of before i find a great young worker.And i pay him max so i do not have to find another. Voting in Obama saddens me.It shows a large percentage of our population came to vote that were needing miracle.And an easier way.Hard work and frugality is going to be our motto if we are to continue as world power.Obama looks like he is more into his pretty wife's bangs. You do not see that the economy is improving? Seriously? You see NO difference from 2009 at all? No building, no spending, no more traffic, no busier restaurants, no difference from 2009? You see no difference in your stock acounts, the prices of real estate (check out the FLORIDA prices, even in the boonies it's gone up)? You are living the miracle, but you don't see it?
|
|
robsrockshop
has rocks in the head
Member since August 2012
Posts: 715
|
Post by robsrockshop on Jun 20, 2013 19:48:17 GMT -5
Now let's be fair about stock prices. If it weren't for massive liquidity injections by the FED the fraud market would be nowhere near these levels. Time will tell but i'm convinced it's not worth half it's current level. The Fed's have saved this market time after time all the way from 2009 to where it is now.
|
|
|
Post by helens on Jun 20, 2013 20:37:16 GMT -5
Now let's be fair about stock prices. If it weren't for massive liquidity injections by the FED the fraud market would be nowhere near these levels. Time will tell but i'm convinced it's not worth half it's current level. The Fed's have saved this market time after time all the way from 2009 to where it is now. Which market? You're not convinced that it's worth 1/2 the level it was at in 1999? Which stock? Which index? Nasdaq in 1999 was over 5000. At the close today it was 3364. And it's not worth 1/2 the price... when it was nearly double the price 15 years ago? Really? So 15 years later, you think that stock prices should be 1/4 of the price it was 15 years ago. How many things do you buy today that costs 1/4 what it cost 15 years ago? Yet the stock market should? Microsoft in 1999 was $58+ a share. Today it's $33.49 at the close. Bank of America was almost $59 in 2005. Today's close is $12.89. Is Bank of America smaller, will it start making less money going forward, now that it's absorbed Merrill Lynch too? Obviously, some stocks are overbought. I told you guys last year gold was a BAD IDEA... you can dig up the threads. But the stock market? I can't say we won't have a 10% correction or even a crash, depending on news going forward, but do we have room to run? Absolutely.
|
|
robsrockshop
has rocks in the head
Member since August 2012
Posts: 715
|
Post by robsrockshop on Jun 21, 2013 8:01:48 GMT -5
Helen, your comparisons are irrelevant. This system crashed in 2008 and has been nothing but papered over since. Which market? Don't ask me such stupid questions trying to make yourself look so smart you know damn well what i'm talking about. And truthfully I don't give a shit about 15 years ago i'm talking about Today. Your logic is ill-conceived. For instance.........was the Nasdaq worth 5k back then? The answer is hell no which is why it reversed. It's a market, not a price indicator, and if a bunch of people want to plow $ into overpriced garbage then the price of garbage will keep going up. However the gov't will surely try to convince you otherwise. In 2009 Obama said this: www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/03/obama-good-time-buy-stocks/So now Obama is a better stock forecaster than the pro's??? It's easy to say that when you have the printing machine in your corner. They knew full well they were going to save the markets. Just because someone comes along and offers you $100 for one of your $5 trinkets doesn't suddenly mean they are revalued at $100. It means someone has too much money to spend. There is no recovery and what appears to be a recovery is all based on bs and held together with ZIRP. This economy is still on total life support and the only miracle is that people are falling for it. I'm sticking with my original thesis and without saying too much more you are correct...I believe it's not worth 1/2 what it is now and I don't care to dig up your old threads I could care less about your predictions I have my own and it's what i'm going with. Like I said before, time will tell and we both have a 50/50 shot at being a pure genius.
|
|
robsrockshop
has rocks in the head
Member since August 2012
Posts: 715
|
Post by robsrockshop on Jun 21, 2013 8:38:56 GMT -5
So now you've effectively covered all bases and will be right no matter what happens. Smart move. You should be a columnist for a stock picking service:
"I can't say we won't have a 10% correction or even a crash"
|
|
|
Post by helens on Jun 21, 2013 9:47:52 GMT -5
The stock market is like Vegas, zero sum game. For everyone who makes money, another loses, and it's stacked towards the house, which are the insiders and the MM. If it were a sure thing, everyone would be rich.
I don't advocate anyone buy stocks, let alone particular stocks, all I said was *I* think there's more to run, and it IS an indicator for the economy.
You sound bitter, so I guess you have been burned in the market before, as have I. I'm still not fully recovered from the 2000-2003, and I think a lot of people learned the hard way too. The 2008-2009 crash didn't affect me much, because I bought at the very bottom, and the pittance of cash I could put in and reallocate saved my butt. It's not a game for the cautious.
The reason I always try to put in the 'we won't have a 10% correction or even crash' is because it can happen at any time, I am no stock picking service. That's the buying opportunities, as I learned the hard way. I did not say people should play the market, I said I think that it's still got legs, NOT so people should jump in with their money, but as an overall indicator of confidence in our economy.
As for the gratuitous insults and bizarre comments, ie., "And truthfully I don't give a shit about 15 years ago i'm talking about Today. Your logic is ill-conceived. For instance.........was the Nasdaq worth 5k back then? The answer is hell no which is why it reversed. It's a market, not a price indicator, and if a bunch of people want to plow $ into overpriced garbage then the price of garbage will keep going up. However the gov't will surely try to convince you otherwise."
Who sets the 'value' for any stock? Was the Nasdaq 'worth' 5K, then or now? Like any product on earth, a product is 'worth' what people will pay for it. How do you set 'worth'? Book value? Good luck ever buying another stock again if it must drop to book value to be a buy. P/E? The entire market's based on FUTURE P/E, today's doesn't matter much, as you can see by looking at the P/E's across the board. People dump low P/E stocks, they generally don't do anything for a very long time, or there's too much volatility.
That said, the rest of the paragraph is intriguing. What will the 'gov't' convince us of otherwise? That the stock market should keep going up, or go down? I can't tell what you meant to say in that last sentence: "It's a market, not a price indicator, and if a bunch of people want to plow $ into overpriced garbage then the price of garbage will keep going up. However the gov't will surely try to convince you otherwise."
If the overpriced garbage keeps going up, and you sell after it goes up, you make money. That's how the stock market works. Are you saying that people should not be making money, or are you saying that you don't like to make money? This sentence makes no sense at all.
|
|
robsrockshop
has rocks in the head
Member since August 2012
Posts: 715
|
Post by robsrockshop on Jun 22, 2013 8:40:19 GMT -5
It makes perfect sense to me. Being a pessimist on the economy and markets it's my view that the markets are severely overpriced and so stocks are basically garbage. But if you'd like to keep running up the price then feel free. As for the gov't....they like to prance around preaching recovery and can't really do that with crashing markets. I don't consider anything I said bizarre however it may sound bizarre to someone with the opposite views.
I don't care to get into stock market mechanics, the direction i'm trying to take is that I believe there is no recovery, it's all bs and the stock market is just a big side show used to make everyone 'think' everything is ok and it's not.
No one can deny it's the FED's money printing that is largely responsible for this rally they will openly admit that now where at one time years ago you were looked at like a fool and conspiracy theorist to mention the PPT. We could end this discussion real quick if the Fed would come out and say "Ok no more we're cutting you all off". Then you'd truly see it for what it is.
And yes I am bitter because of the FED's crap like ZIRP has TOTALLY SCREWED my future plans and now i'm spending principle and not earning any interest all in the name of the precious stock market. In retrospect having plowed cash into the markets based on Obamas hint would've been the way to go but there's no way in hell i'd do it now. At one time before the crash I made 6 figures for several years, paid off the house and put $ in the bank. Thank god because i'll never make money like that again.
So I apologize for the insults I am just fed up with people talking about the glorius stock market when people like me are getting sucked dry to support the bs. Kinda like my sisterinlaw who unfort moved just down the road that is an RN and says she's glad she's educated implying that i'm an idiot because all I basically know how to do is construct an entire building from the ground up which is worthless knowledge to her. She confuses being educated with demand and i'm convinced she's one of the most stupid people i've ever talked to. If she were so smart she wouldn't weight almost 300lbs and be diabetic, I just loving being preached to about my health from people like that. If it weren't for guys like me her retarded ass would be working out of grass ******* hut. It just depends which side of the fence you are on, if you did well with all of this then I can see where someone might think everything is fine and dandy. It's my opinion it's not and that the high from all of it isn't letting people really see things for how they are. I'm not going to spend time posting all my opinions and data points to just argue about them I am set in my mind where things are heading and that's all there is to it.
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,557
|
Post by jamesp on Jun 22, 2013 9:25:48 GMT -5
I am in your boat Rob.Your outlook is inline w/what i 'feel'.I think accurate.I know Helen is in dream world;that is her right.I do not know how she comes up with her theories.LOL I made some good money in the real estate boom 5-8 years ago and decided to get out of leverage business and paid all to debt free life. I have nice collection of property that will not give me the security that it once did for retirement.Hopefully property will rebound over next 5-10 years.
But paying off was great.Because earning power is way reduced and even worse is buying power.That is what is making standard of living so much lower.We can't earn and we can't buy. I am hunkering down by paying off and reducing cost lifestyle.
|
|
robsrockshop
has rocks in the head
Member since August 2012
Posts: 715
|
Post by robsrockshop on Jun 22, 2013 9:29:41 GMT -5
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,557
|
Post by jamesp on Jun 22, 2013 9:48:25 GMT -5
Evil mentality Rob.Please look out for yourself.That's what i am doing.Tough to know how LOL
|
|
|
Post by helens on Jun 22, 2013 11:48:42 GMT -5
Rob, you should be thrilled, the Fed announced that easing will be tapered off by the end of the year. Further, Bernanke's being replaced. So if the last few years have got you down, it's all going to change again, interest rates are going to rise.
At this point, I agree, if you're not in the market already and missed the runup, it's NOT the time to get into the market, because you won't know where to get in. If you already were, unless you have the worst luck on the planet, you have been making money as they mint it. You know what they say, when retail hops in with both feet is when it's time to crash. The REASONS why the market goes up may not be sound, but it doesn't change the fact that it's gone up. Standing in the rain insisting that it can't be raining because it wasn't forecasted makes no sense to me.
Good luck, outcomes tends to be as negative as your outlook. For many people, things are much better than they were in 2009, but apparently not for all.
Have to edit... now is not the time to get into stocks if you aren't already in. However, it IS the time to get into real estate (but not to sell). You can quote me on this a few years from now:).
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2013 15:16:04 GMT -5
Real estate in depressed areas, silver and gold.
Cash too strong lately.
|
|
|
Post by helens on Jun 22, 2013 17:59:10 GMT -5
Gold isn't done crashing yet... It's only lost 24% off the highs, it has more falling to do before it's a good deal again. Gold is almost a direct inverse to the economy... the better the economy does, the worse gold does. It's going to be a while before metals are a good deal. Doh! Edited to say, this is MY opinion only:)!
|
|
robsrockshop
has rocks in the head
Member since August 2012
Posts: 715
|
Post by robsrockshop on Jun 22, 2013 19:02:29 GMT -5
Oh i'm def looking out for myself these days it's turned into do or die and I don't trust one word that comes out of the gov't. I'm not anti-gov't im anti the jackasses that are in control of it. I'm also not a dem or rep and hate probably 99% of the politicians if not all of them. I also believe interest rates will rise. However I am not optimistic at all about several other things that I don't care to debate that I think will negate all benefits of high rates but that remains to be seen.
As for gold I think it will crash with the market just like it did last time. It's not an investment it's an insurance policy. If you have thousands laying around you don't need go for it. In the early 2000's my grandmother died and we split a sizeable estate and I was ready to put $50k on gold in the $550 range and my professional advisor talked me out of it. So even professionals don't know wtf they are talking about a lot of the time. If they were so smart they'd be making a mint and not need a job telling everyone else what to do why would you want that headache? To help people? Yeah right try again. That's kind like hearing people say they are going to open up a Mcdonald's franchise if they win the powerball. What a stupid idiotic idea that is. But not as bad as the occasional "I don't want to win because I don't want to have to pay the taxes on it" which i've actually heard lol. Doesn't make me sound too smart being around people like that but I did work on construction sites for almost 20 years and yes a lot of them aren't very bright.
|
|
robsrockshop
has rocks in the head
Member since August 2012
Posts: 715
|
Post by robsrockshop on Jun 22, 2013 19:13:24 GMT -5
Another blog that I like to follow: globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/I already knew training for some other dip**** job wasn't the answer. I'm only 45 but have decided im not spending my last 20-25 years surrounded by morons.
|
|
|
Post by helens on Jun 22, 2013 21:38:23 GMT -5
Interesting. Gold went from $1000's in the mid 80s to $300 and stayed there for a decade or more. At $550, it was obvious it was going to break the old $1000 record. Just like the stock market. Bad advisor.
Gold doesn't have any more intrinsic value than lead or chunks of coal does. What's intrinsic about it other than it makes better looking jewelry? It's fluxed from $300 to $1800 in just 20 years. That's more of a range than any stock index, with MORE ups and downs. If that's what you like investing in, you should go hang out in Vegas, you'll have more fun:).
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,557
|
Post by jamesp on Jun 22, 2013 21:47:44 GMT -5
Should have sold gold 2 years ago OOOPS That is a print of a Hymenocallis 2 years ago:
|
|