br347213
starting to spend too much on rocks
Henderson, NV
Member since October 2015
Posts: 106
|
Post by br347213 on Oct 29, 2015 14:19:14 GMT -5
Ok I'm back! The past few days went just fine with the barrel rubbing on the keeper wheel. No need to worry about that anymore I don't think. Today was day 7 of stage 1. First recharge. I have some questions and photos! So upon opening the barrel. I see the water is really thin and feels very thin. No slurry. Uh oh. So after pouring out the barrel into the strainer I see that there is all sorts of grit and slurry stuck to the bottom of the barrel! What happened??? I wonder if this has been stuck during the entire process and not integrating with the other rocks or did it all just settle done there are I took the barrels off the tumbler as I was setting up? hmm. Could it have to do with my water level being too high/too much? Need some input on this! Thanks. Some of the smaller rocks looked great! I really think they will be ready to move on to stage 2 by next week but I need to make sure I have enough to fill an entire barrel. The larger ones had progressed quite a bit but were still in very rough shape. No doubt these are some of the '2 monthers.' I will eventually have to reject some due to major pits and vugs. Giving them another chance though before I do that. I was really astounded by the mess this all makes. So glad I went outside to do it. What a process! It's tough doing this in an apartment where I have no hose or lawn. yikes. I will absolutely need another barrel to make sure I have one for each stage. I did not realize how difficult it is to clean the silicon carbide out! wow. I put 3 tbsp of 60/90 in with the recharge. I did not fully clean out the barrels as it looked like I had a bunch of great grit still sitting in the bottom. One barrel (my perpetual stage one barrel) was refilled with a few new rocks to make up for lost volume and continue the cycle. The other barrel which will eventually become a stage 2 barrel was given some ceramic media to make up for lost volume. I give myself a decent 5/10 for this first attempt, definitely need some improvement and new tactics but was overall not a total failure. Please give any feedback or input you have, thanks for reading everyone!
|
|
|
Post by glennz01 on Oct 29, 2015 14:23:36 GMT -5
That barrel looks way to full.. past 3-4 full.. unless its just the photo. If it is that is why you still have grit... you also have too much water
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Oct 29, 2015 14:51:07 GMT -5
alrighty...
I agree that you have too much water in there (pic 1) the water ought to be just visible down in the rocks, not covering them. Level rocks filled to I'm good with.
The grit on the bottom - did you set your barrel aside while doing the leveling tweeking? If so, did you set it upright? That would allow your grit to settle like that. If you have to take your barrel off during a run, set it on it's side. Any grit that settles to the side will be remixed when you start tumbling again.
You might want to check around your apartment building for a hose bib. Most buildings have at least one. If you find one, you can buy a short hose and take it with you to do your clean outs. Maybe one of those hoses that scrunch up when empty? Save on storage space. They have 'em at Home Depot. Outside hose bib may not have a handle on it. Some places remove just so no one can use them. Screw that, you pay a lot of rent! Take a pair of pliers and you can turn on water at will. Might want to be mindful of neighbors - don't make a mess that they can complain about. Anyone gets nosy, talk to them about the rocks and what you are doing. Who doesn't like rocks!
Those rocks have a LONG time to go! sorry... maybe the grit was stuck to the bottom of the run from the get go so you didn't really do much actual grinding this round. Is picture 2 when you first opened the barrel? If so, most of your grit was stuck to the bottom the whole time.
I add my grit last when filing a barrel. It will spread it self out when it starts tumbling. Also mix my ceramic media in with the rocks, but yours should mix on their own.
You don't really need ceramic media in the rough stage. Waste of money. Just add more rocks.
Keep on rockin'!
|
|
br347213
starting to spend too much on rocks
Henderson, NV
Member since October 2015
Posts: 106
|
Post by br347213 on Oct 29, 2015 15:09:13 GMT -5
That barrel looks way to full.. past 3-4 full.. unless its just the photo. If it is that is why you still have grit... you also have too much water Ok, great, thank you. I've lowered the water level now. It looks and sounds much better now. A lot more "thudding" going on.
|
|
br347213
starting to spend too much on rocks
Henderson, NV
Member since October 2015
Posts: 106
|
Post by br347213 on Oct 29, 2015 15:14:27 GMT -5
alrighty... I agree that you have too much water in there (pic 1) the water ought to be just visible down in the rocks, not covering them. Level rocks filled to I'm good with. The grit on the bottom - did you set your barrel aside while doing the leveling tweeking? If so, did you set it upright? That would allow your grit to settle like that. If you have to take your barrel off during a run, set it on it's side. Any grit that settles to the side will be remixed when you start tumbling again. You might want to check around your apartment building for a hose bib. Most buildings have at least one. If you find one, you can buy a short hose and take it with you to do your clean outs. Maybe one of those hoses that scrunch up when empty? Save on storage space. They have 'em at Home Depot. Outside hose bib may not have a handle on it. Some places remove just so no one can use them. Screw that, you pay a lot of rent! Take a pair of pliers and you can turn on water at will. Might want to be mindful of neighbors - don't make a mess that they can complain about. Anyone gets nosy, talk to them about the rocks and what you are doing. Who doesn't like rocks! Those rocks have a LONG time to go! sorry... maybe the grit was stuck to the bottom of the run from the get go so you didn't really do much actual grinding this round. Is picture 2 when you first opened the barrel? If so, most of your grit was stuck to the bottom the whole time. I add my grit last when filing a barrel. It will spread it self out when it starts tumbling. Also mix my ceramic media in with the rocks, but yours should mix on their own. You don't really need ceramic media in the rough stage. Waste of money. Just add more rocks. Keep on rockin'! Cool yeah the rock level looks good now, and I've lowered the water level. It's too bad all the grit was sitting down there the whole time. It wasn't a wasted week but definitely could have been far more productive. I'm hoping with these changes and less taking the barrels on and off that this next week will be a better result Would it be useful to take the barrels off once a day and just shake things up a bit to make sure it's all level and the grit is spread out? I do put in the grit last I guess it all just settled down there after the many times I took them off the tumbler. I had thought of checking for a hose outlet around the complex, i'll take a look. I only put the ceramic media in there because I didn't want to add more rocks to that barrel as I am trying to phase it out to become a stage 2 barrel only. I know it wears out the media quickly but I only used a bit. not too worried. Thanks bob!
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Oct 29, 2015 15:34:17 GMT -5
You just did this clean out, so your grit probably isn't going to get stuck on the bottom here while it's new. But, you just lowered the water level, so I reckon you had to set the barrel upright while you did all the stuff with the lid. That is when the grit settles. Probably couldn't hurt anything to give the barrels a shake right now, (snort) but once it's paste on the bottom, it's not going anywhere - shaking or not. The picture with the ceramic media doesn't look like you put the grit in last, or there would be a pile of grit on top. whatever... try that in the future. As to barrel 1 & 2 - coarse grit or medium grit, doesn't really matter as much as a dedicated polish barrel. I'd keep using them both for coarse and in the meantime get yourself another barrel for polish - if you want. MANY folks don't have separate barrels and do just fine. IF you HAVE to dump anything (grit wise) in your apartment, use the toilet, not the sinks. The toilet has the much wider drain and more water flow. Not that I would recommend that, just saying. Don't clog up your (or neighbor's) drains - could get expensive! Not recommended if you own home Don't know where you are, but if you have winter snow / bad weather, maybe a cat box with some kitty litter in it would provide a place to do clean outs. Slurry could be poured out into an empty jar and go in the trash. And the kitty litter can be thrown out as cat owners do. Minimal down toilet.
|
|
br347213
starting to spend too much on rocks
Henderson, NV
Member since October 2015
Posts: 106
|
Post by br347213 on Oct 29, 2015 15:52:10 GMT -5
You just did this clean out, so your grit probably isn't going to get stuck on the bottom here while it's new. But, you just lowered the water level, so I reckon you had to set the barrel upright while you did all the stuff with the lid. That is when the grit settles. Probably couldn't hurt anything to give the barrels a shake right now, (snort) but once it's paste on the bottom, it's not going anywhere - shaking or not. The picture with the ceramic media doesn't look like you put the grit in last, or there would be a pile of grit on top. whatever... try that in the future. As to barrel 1 & 2 - coarse grit or medium grit, doesn't really matter as much as a dedicated polish barrel. I'd keep using them both for coarse and in the meantime get yourself another barrel for polish - if you want. MANY folks don't have separate barrels and do just fine. IF you HAVE to dump anything (grit wise) in your apartment, use the toilet, not the sinks. The toilet has the much wider drain and more water flow. Not that I would recommend that, just saying. Don't clog up your (or neighbor's) drains - could get expensive! Not recommended if you own home Don't know where you are, but if you have winter snow / bad weather, maybe a cat box with some kitty litter in it would provide a place to do clean outs. Slurry could be poured out into an empty jar and go in the trash. And the kitty litter can be thrown out as cat owners do. Minimal down toilet. haha...oh boy, yes for just a minute or less I did have to leave it on it's side while I did that. but other than that I made sure to leave it like it is on the tumble. I also shook it up afterward just to make sure. Did I already screw up again?! Last week I left it on its side for about an hour while I ran to home depot to get motor oil...heh. Much worse. That explains everything right there. I just figured it's a tumbler, everything should be getting mixed up. The pic with the media, yeah I put one scoop in before then the media (took the pic), then I put in 2 on top of that. good eye. Ok, so course and medium grit go in 1, does pre-polish (500) and polish go in the same or just polish? so 1+2, 3+4, or 1+2+3, 4? I've been dumping stuff off my patio, there are some rocks below that and it seems to sink in there just fine. Hopefully the SC doesn't build up too much over time LOL. I will spare my toilet for now haha...that sounds like a recipe for disaster. maintenance: "what have you been putting in here?" me: "oh you know just rock fragments and silicon carbide." hahaha ) I buy a lot of kitty litter as it is for my two kittens I live in southern Nevada, no winter. Going outside should be ok year round, yeah 40's in the winter but I lived my whole life in upstate NY. I'll be ok
|
|
Intheswamp
Cave Dweller
Member since September 2015
Posts: 1,910
|
Post by Intheswamp on Oct 29, 2015 15:57:17 GMT -5
Shoot no, it wasn't a failure....failure is when you give up. It don't look like you've given up to me. Btw, I recognize that box from Shawn! You noticed that it's kinda....messy, eh? It kinda surprised me, too. I'm a newbie, too, so I'm just learning. Seriously, you could paint with that stuff...but, it'd wash off if it didn't have a porous surface to embed into. I can only respect you for doing this in an apartment. You might want to consider a large pan for working inside. You would have a container to work in without having to worry about spills too much. A lot of times we'll buy a large batch of fried chicken for church events...it usually comes in a big tin pan probably 12x20 inches or a little bigger. I've found that that slurry loves to DRIP and having something to contain it in is nice. Using a colander you might want to look into grabbing a 5-gallon bucket...do some rinsing inside (hand spray bottle) and carry the bucket to an outside drain when it gets to your "carry weight". Here's some comments on a few of your images, you're doing great, keep it up!!! ....way to much water. ...when you open your barrel up this is more like what you want to see...mud, slurry, milkshake covering all your rocks...but no water. Especially on the first coarse stage you want to find all of your rocks completely covered by this slick coating...from the top of the barrel, to the bottom....really messy. Later stages might not be as thick, depending on if the rocks had a soft "crust" on them that got knocked off in the first stage...plus, in the first stage a lot of sharp points and edges get knocked off and smoothed which contributes to the slurry. ...these rocks are drowning, throw'em a life jacket!!! ...more drowning rocks, but now there's some drowning ceramics in there, they must have thought they could rescue the rocks!!!...noble gesture by them, but they gonna drown, too! So sad. Save the ceramics for later, finer stages. As Bob said, just add more rocks in the rough/coarse stage. Naturally, if you don't have more rocks you need to add *something*.
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Oct 29, 2015 16:03:46 GMT -5
maintenance: "what have you been putting in here?" me: "oh you know just rock fragments and silicon carbide." That was FUNNY! IF you want another barrel, it is polish only. The 500 will go in a well cleaned grit barrel. If buying barrels is no big deal, get one for the 500 / 1000 - sounds like something I would do, which probably means it's not necessary.
|
|
Intheswamp
Cave Dweller
Member since September 2015
Posts: 1,910
|
Post by Intheswamp on Oct 29, 2015 16:07:29 GMT -5
maintenance: "what have you been putting in here?" me: "oh you know just rock fragments and silicon carbide." That was FUNNY! IF you want another barrel, it is polish only. The 500 will go in a well cleaned grit barrel. If buying barrels is no big deal, get one for the 500 / 1000 - sounds like something I would do, which probably means it's not necessary. Ya'll type too fast for me!!!! <grin> Ya'll have it wrong on what you tell the maintenance/plumber guy. You simply tell him, with a painful look on your face, "Well, the doctor's been having to crush a bunch of kidney stones for me, do you 'reckon that could be it?"...and grimace really bad!
|
|
br347213
starting to spend too much on rocks
Henderson, NV
Member since October 2015
Posts: 106
|
Post by br347213 on Oct 29, 2015 16:26:23 GMT -5
Shoot no, it wasn't a failure....failure is when you give up. It don't look like you've given up to me. Btw, I recognize that box from Shawn! You noticed that it's kinda....messy, eh? It kinda surprised me, too. I'm a newbie, too, so I'm just learning. Seriously, you could paint with that stuff...but, it'd wash off if it didn't have a porous surface to embed into. I can only respect you for doing this in an apartment. You might want to consider a large pan for working inside. You would have a container to work in without having to worry about spills too much. A lot of times we'll buy a large batch of fried chicken for church events...it usually comes in a big tin pan probably 12x20 inches or a little bigger. I've found that that slurry loves to DRIP and having something to contain it in is nice. Using a colander you might want to look into grabbing a 5-gallon bucket...do some rinsing inside (hand spray bottle) and carry the bucket to an outside drain when it gets to your "carry weight". Here's some comments on a few of your images, you're doing great, keep it up!!! ....way to much water. ...when you open your barrel up this is more like what you want to see...mud, slurry, milkshake covering all your rocks...but no water. Especially on the first coarse stage you want to find all of your rocks completely covered by this slick coating...from the top of the barrel, to the bottom....really messy. Later stages might not be as thick, depending on if the rocks had a soft "crust" on them that got knocked off in the first stage...plus, in the first stage a lot of sharp points and edges get knocked off and smoothed which contributes to the slurry. ...these rocks are drowning, throw'em a life jacket!!! ...more drowning rocks, but now there's some drowning ceramics in there, they must have thought they could rescue the rocks!!!...noble gesture by them, but they gonna drown, too! So sad. Save the ceramics for later, finer stages. As Bob said, just add more rocks in the rough/coarse stage. Naturally, if you don't have more rocks you need to add *something*. Thanks! haha yea I did order from Shawn. I was really pleased with the delivery and product I actually have a large pan and 5 gallon bucket already. Not sure why I didn't use them heh...guess I just wanted to see if I could get away with using as little stuff as possible but it is clear I will need the bucket next time. Thanks for the comments! I have saved the drowning rocks and ceramic. They are now happily swimming along in the barrel with the grit. Really didn't realize I used too much water I thought I read somewhere you should only see the tips of some rocks poking through. Obviously I still somehow managed to fill even over that. I really hope next time I open them that there is a good slurry going.
|
|
br347213
starting to spend too much on rocks
Henderson, NV
Member since October 2015
Posts: 106
|
Post by br347213 on Oct 29, 2015 16:29:30 GMT -5
maintenance: "what have you been putting in here?" me: "oh you know just rock fragments and silicon carbide." That was FUNNY! IF you want another barrel, it is polish only. The 500 will go in a well cleaned grit barrel. If buying barrels is no big deal, get one for the 500 / 1000 - sounds like something I would do, which probably means it's not necessary. Glad you got a laugh out of it haha Yeah I guess I will hold off on the 4th barrel and see how it goes without. Next time I make a decent order of grit and things i'll nab one. I did end up getting the extra parts ya'll had recommended and that's when I also bought the 3rd barrel. 5lbs of 60/90 and 2lbs 120/220 as well oh and some burnishing compound and plastic pellets. LOL woops. I got excited.
|
|
br347213
starting to spend too much on rocks
Henderson, NV
Member since October 2015
Posts: 106
|
Post by br347213 on Oct 29, 2015 16:30:12 GMT -5
maintenance: "what have you been putting in here?" me: "oh you know just rock fragments and silicon carbide." That was FUNNY! IF you want another barrel, it is polish only. The 500 will go in a well cleaned grit barrel. If buying barrels is no big deal, get one for the 500 / 1000 - sounds like something I would do, which probably means it's not necessary. Ya'll type too fast for me!!!! <grin> Ya'll have it wrong on what you tell the maintenance/plumber guy. You simply tell him, with a painful look on your face, "Well, the doctor's been having to crush a bunch of kidney stones for me, do you 'reckon that could be it?"...and grimace really bad! hahahaha
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Oct 29, 2015 16:45:32 GMT -5
Plastic pellets GOOD. I buy them 50 pounds at a time. Must only use in one stage, they can't travel along. (save your tupperware & butter dishes for storing them) Burnishing compound *sigh* I don't even want to know...
|
|
br347213
starting to spend too much on rocks
Henderson, NV
Member since October 2015
Posts: 106
|
Post by br347213 on Oct 29, 2015 17:54:04 GMT -5
Plastic pellets GOOD. I buy them 50 pounds at a time. Must only use in one stage, they can't travel along. (save your tupperware & butter dishes for storing them) Burnishing compound *sigh* I don't even want to know... what do u mean? whats wrong with the burnishing compound???
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Oct 29, 2015 18:14:50 GMT -5
I doubt there is anything "wrong" with it. Simply most here just use soap of one sort or another.
I use 20 Mule Team Borax. Some here use Tide or use shavings off a bar of Ivory soap. Figure many other soaps will work as well.
Didn't realize that anyone sold something as "burnishing compound" when you can probably use something in your shower, your laundry room or under your kitchen sink.
Hope it was cheap.
Burnish on Garth!
|
|
br347213
starting to spend too much on rocks
Henderson, NV
Member since October 2015
Posts: 106
|
Post by br347213 on Oct 29, 2015 21:02:37 GMT -5
I doubt there is anything "wrong" with it. Simply most here just use soap of one sort or another. I use 20 Mule Team Borax. Some here use Tide or use shavings off a bar of Ivory soap. Figure many other soaps will work as well. Didn't realize that anyone sold something as "burnishing compound" when you can probably use something in your shower, your laundry room or under your kitchen sink. Hope it was cheap. Burnish on Garth! I hear you on that. It was cheap enough to throw it on the order and not worry about it. it'll last forever too.
|
|
br347213
starting to spend too much on rocks
Henderson, NV
Member since October 2015
Posts: 106
|
Post by br347213 on Oct 30, 2015 2:12:20 GMT -5
quick question, i am going away for two days and i do not feel great about leaving my tumbler without being able to check on it. should i just leave the barrels on the tumbler in the position they roll in or is there another way i should be doing it? I'm wording about things settling too much and getting clumped.
|
|
Intheswamp
Cave Dweller
Member since September 2015
Posts: 1,910
|
Post by Intheswamp on Oct 30, 2015 6:07:56 GMT -5
What are you worried about? Fire or leakage? Those are the only things I could think of. I leave two old Thumlers (Model A and a Model T) running 24/7. One of them is at the office and sometimes it's by itself for two or three days with no problems. If I needed to I wouldn't worry about leaving them alone for a week+. I don't know whether or not if letting the rocks and slurry sit for a couple of days would make the slurry turn to cement or to compact to a degree that it couldn't be remixed when turned back on...maybe someone else more knowledgeable than I will chime in on the time factor.
|
|
|
Post by Jugglerguy on Oct 30, 2015 7:41:30 GMT -5
I leave mine running all the time too. They're running while I'm at work every day. If anything bad was going to happen, that would be plenty of time for it to happen. If I leave for a week, I leave my tumblers running. My tumblers are on a concrete basement floor out from the walls about a foot. I hope that gives me good fire protection.
I do not leave my vibratory tumbler running while I'm gone for more than a day or so. It needs to be checked for dryness more often than that, especially when it's running more coarse grit. If it was running a polish stage, I'd leave it for 2-3 days without worrying.
|
|