tkvancil
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since September 2011
Posts: 1,548
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Post by tkvancil on Jan 21, 2016 12:32:33 GMT -5
I have heard the words "skilled" or "talented" here on the board to describe a member in their success at an outstanding tumble batch. That combined with my satisfaction in my most recent batches lead me to ponder this question ... Is there indeed a skill to rock tumbling or is it simply the machines doing their job within the guidelines of a good process?
I know that there are variations in our processes. Slightly different amounts of water and grit are one. Some do full cleanouts without thickeners. Some do recharges and use thickeners. Some prefer a natural look and move rocks from stage to stage on a set timetable. Others prefer well rounded near perfect rocks and tumble them weeks to months. Just some differences that spring to mind, there are more.
Within these variations most stay with some constants ... correct volume, cushioning for softer rocks, and good cleaning between stages to name a few. Rocks are for the most part pretty forgiving and if you do all the basics success is almost always a guarantee. So what do you all think, skill or process?
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Jan 21, 2016 13:48:22 GMT -5
I cant see any one item that fits.
I do think a trained monkey could do it. (If said trained monkey had all the right equipment)
I do think garbage in garbage out is also very true
I also think it is mostly process - mine not the manufactures. My lotos run 24-7 all year with the same steps taken every week and every week it yields the same results. why wouldn't it right?
There are small exceptions to made for certain types of rock but what I said above covers 95% of my tumbles.
Chuck
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Post by jakesrocks on Jan 21, 2016 13:51:50 GMT -5
None of the above, (or both). It's a process which with time and experience you will gain certain skills. You will get skilled at determining how long to run each batch in each grit stage. You will get skilled at determining which rocks will take a polish and can be added to a tumble batch, and which to add to your driveway gravel. You will get skilled at determining the hardness of rocks so only rocks of like hardness go into a tumble batch. There are other things you will learn as you go along. And once you've mastered these skills, it becomes just a process. When that happens, you'll find yourself looking at saws, grinders & other equipment so that you can learn new skills.
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Post by Pat on Jan 21, 2016 14:58:15 GMT -5
I tried tumbling once and didn't like it. However, I would say All of the Above is probably the appropriate answer.
Maybe you could add that as a category.
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Post by orrum on Jan 21, 2016 15:46:06 GMT -5
X2 Don/Jakesrocks!
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Post by victor1941 on Jan 21, 2016 16:27:58 GMT -5
I vote for both skill and process for materials that can be vibe processed. My multiple votes are for 2, 3, and 5 in the above list.
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Jan 21, 2016 17:28:48 GMT -5
I vote for both skill and process for materials that can be vibe processed. My multiple votes are for 2, 3, and 5 in the above list. I would sure like to think it is skill but I am not sure I would classify adding rocks water and grit a skill. If you think about it rock tumbling is all done by machine. The only part that I think might be considered a skill is choosing what rocks advance from stage one and go to stage two. After that its just load, run, wash repeat isn't it? Chuck |
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Fossilman
Cave Dweller 
Member since January 2009
Posts: 20,722 
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Post by Fossilman on Jan 21, 2016 17:39:49 GMT -5
I'm still new at the tumbling game-I found out that agates and petwood tumble great,when directions are followed (EASY)..
Obsidian and other rocks(some others), take a bit more skill,which in hand,I listen to the pro's on here that have tumbled Obsidian,get some ideas and answers..Same with other types of rocks..
Listening,trial and error,stubbornest,nose to the grind stone and some skill ...
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Post by krazydiamond on Jan 21, 2016 18:52:49 GMT -5
High quality material and a little bit of experience and good practice make for a good tumble. Patience is everything.
KD
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Post by 150FromFundy on Jan 21, 2016 21:46:38 GMT -5
Rock tumbling is like baking cookies. Ten people can follow exactly the same recipe, with exactly the same ingredients, but you are not likely to have 10 batches of equally good cookies. Same with rock tumbling. It took me about a year to get reasonable at tumbling and about two years to get to the point where people would pay for my tumbles.
In my opinion, it's a skilled process.
Darryl.
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tkvancil
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since September 2011
Posts: 1,548
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Post by tkvancil on Jan 24, 2016 12:08:00 GMT -5
I cant see any one item that fits. I do think a trained monkey could do it. (If said trained monkey had all the right equipment) I do think garbage in garbage out is also very true I also think it is mostly process - mine not the manufactures. My lotos run 24-7 all year with the same steps taken every week and every week it yields the same results. why wouldn't it right? There are small exceptions to made for certain types of rock but what I said above covers 95% of my tumbles. Chuck If I were to enlist the help of a trained monkey it would be to sort the tumble. He would of course be required to maintain high standards in which rocks get moved on.  Maybe figuring out the process is the skill. From my observations most of the successful tumblers here have departed from the manufactures instructions. Generally using less water and grit with better results. Last time I deviated from my usual formula was to double the amount of AO1000 in the vibe. Still only 75% of manufacturer suggestion. I got less of a shine after 48 hours than usual, less is often more. |
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Jan 24, 2016 12:20:12 GMT -5
I cant see any one item that fits. I do think a trained monkey could do it. (If said trained monkey had all the right equipment) I do think garbage in garbage out is also very true I also think it is mostly process - mine not the manufactures. My lotos run 24-7 all year with the same steps taken every week and every week it yields the same results. why wouldn't it right? There are small exceptions to made for certain types of rock but what I said above covers 95% of my tumbles. Chuck Maybe figuring out the process is the skill. I agree with that 100%. Figuring out the process does require skill. In rock tumbling the equipment does all the work on the rocks VS cabbing or metal smithing where its all skill making the piece. Chuck |
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tkvancil
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since September 2011
Posts: 1,548
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Post by tkvancil on Jan 24, 2016 12:31:13 GMT -5
None of the above, (or both). It's a process which with time and experience you will gain certain skills. You will get skilled at determining how long to run each batch in each grit stage. You will get skilled at determining which rocks will take a polish and can be added to a tumble batch, and which to add to your driveway gravel. You will get skilled at determining the hardness of rocks so only rocks of like hardness go into a tumble batch. There are other things you will learn as you go along. And once you've mastered these skills, it becomes just a process. When that happens, you'll find yourself looking at saws, grinders & other equipment so that you can learn new skills. I like the description you have given. Very much along the line I was thinking. Started with one tumbler ... liked it and got a second one. Next a larger tumbler to add more rocks. Then a tile saw for prepping tumbles. Still not satisfied so get me a vibe ... now my tumblers are too small to fill the vibe so an even bigger tumbler. This year its a flat lap. I intend to use it mostly to grind off bad spots in my tumble stones and speed up their finish. I also have some slabettes cut on the tile saw I'd like to smooth and polish. And the write up on the lap says you can do free form cabs. Want to try that too. I can see where this is going .... |
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tkvancil
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since September 2011
Posts: 1,548
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Post by tkvancil on Jan 24, 2016 12:33:00 GMT -5
I tried tumbling once and didn't like it. However, I would say All of the Above is probably the appropriate answer. Maybe you could add that as a category. Tumbling isn't for everybody that's for sure. An all above along with a none of above would be appropriate, however my "skill" at modifying the poll has been tested. At this point I lost. |
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tkvancil
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since September 2011
Posts: 1,548
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Post by tkvancil on Jan 24, 2016 12:40:37 GMT -5
I'm still new at the tumbling game-I found out that agates and petwood tumble great,when directions are followed (EASY).. Obsidian and other rocks(some others), take a bit more skill,which in hand,I listen to the pro's on here that have tumbled Obsidian,get some ideas and answers..Same with other types of rocks.. Listening,trial and error,stubbornest,nose to the grind stone and some skill ... I totally know what you mean where it comes to stubbornness. Got a good supply of that myself. |
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Post by Jugglerguy on Jan 24, 2016 12:58:24 GMT -5
I agree with most of the comments above. I really think patience and good directions from the manufacturer are what is missing for most people. I did a lot of reading here before my first batch and I consider my first batch (granite) a success. I just followed good instructions. I haven't had as much luck making cabs. That definitely requires skill.
Understanding what is happening inside the tumbler allows you to make adjustments for more difficult rocks, so that requires a bit more skill. Knowledge might be a better word than skill.
The only comment I really disagree with above is from Darryl (sorry Darryl!). I think if someone started with the same materials and truly followed the same recipe, they would have the same results. Once again, it comes down to patience, if you cut corners, you're not going to get the same results.
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Post by rockjunquie on Jan 24, 2016 17:53:07 GMT -5
I have never cabbed and probably never will. I am not the patient type. As an outsider, my opinion is that successful tumbling does require skill. Yes, most people could probably learn those skills to one degree of success or another, but I still think that it takes skill. Any type of hobby (or whatever you choose to call it) has some degree of difficulty and some learning curve. It takes true skill to be someone who can easily pick it up and consistently succeed. At least, that's my opinion. BTW- I think it takes skill to decide what will be best to tumble, as well. You gotta have an eye for it.
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