jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 31, 2016 12:31:18 GMT -5
Glad I hit a happy nerve with the new addition to the vocabulary captbob. My spellcheck attacks debitage, go figure. One of my favorite words. Can be used in an insulting manner and the insulted has no idea what the word means. I have only seen it used in an archaeological context. Used heavily by southern archeologists where coastal plain chert and coral litter found at native man's encampments. Floridians are debitage occupying the SE appendage (duodenum) of the US. insulting context ex. PS Don't let the Rotties choke on the MIL's little one.
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bushmanbilly
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Post by bushmanbilly on Jan 31, 2016 14:46:00 GMT -5
Not going to worry about whats in them. Going to use them until they grind down to dust and not replace them. I believe they are part of the problem with premature bowl erosion. Just going to use the white ones after that. They did shorten my course grind 220 and 600 down by a day in each cycle. I'm surprised on how fast both the white and blue wore down. They still look like new in my polish bowl.
A little advice for those who want to use ceramic in the pre and polish cycle. Run your ceramic through your course cycle twice and then to the rest of the stages. From factory they have sharp edges and burrs on them.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 31, 2016 14:58:04 GMT -5
Not going to worry about whats in them. Going to use them until they grind down to dust and not replace them. I believe they are part of the problem with premature bowl erosion. Just going to use the white ones after that. They did shorten my course grind 220 and 600 down by a day in each cycle. I'm surprised on how fast both the white and blue wore down. They still look like new in my polish bowl. A little advice for those who want to use ceramic in the pre and polish cycle. Run your ceramic through your course cycle twice and then to the rest of the stages. From factory they have sharp edges and burrs on them. The white and blue ceramic media probably has SiC particles and are much more sacrificial. The SiC chips particles chip away allowing the ceramic to wear faster. Benefit is faster cutting but not good for finish or bowls. I would loose lose the white and blue ones Dale for finishing and bowl life.
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bushmanbilly
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Post by bushmanbilly on Jan 31, 2016 15:46:43 GMT -5
I only use the pure ceramic white ones for polish. I will be eventually replacing them with small agate cubes. But this takes time to cut them. They are a pain. And I don't have that many sacrificial agates to cut up. I switched to ceramic in course grinds because I could not keep up with agate media wearing out and the slurry was uncontrollable. A slurry too thick would keep my picks from getting a even grind. It would just glue them together so one side got a more even finish than the other. As it stands I still have to add water and soap to it every few hours. When I was hard into making and selling picks. I would take my tumbler to work with me so I could keep an eye on it. Cleaned many of loads whole on location with my truck. Was kinda handy with a 1000 gallons of warm water in my boiler room. Plus disposal of the waste water was as simple as opening the door and dumping it.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 31, 2016 16:13:56 GMT -5
I only use the pure ceramic white ones for polish. I will be eventually replacing them with small agate cubes. But this takes time to cut them. They are a pain. And I don't have that many sacrificial agates to cut up. I switched to ceramic in course grinds because I could not keep up with agate media wearing out and the slurry was uncontrollable. A slurry too thick would keep my picks from getting a even grind. It would just glue them together so one side got a more even finish than the other. As it stands I still have to add water and soap to it every few hours. When I was hard into making and selling picks. I would take my tumbler to work with me so I could keep an eye on it. Cleaned many of loads whole on location with my truck. Was kinda handy with a 1000 gallons of warm water in my boiler room. Plus disposal of the waste water was as simple as opening the door and dumping it. Yes warm water in the great white north. Picks look like a challenge from several standpoints. Delicate, pointed edges and flat. Liking the agates. I use them too. High grade quartz pea gravel too. My vibe may be best with softer media, not ceramics. Not round balls anyway. Bet your coworkers were amazed at the vibe.
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tkvancil
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Post by tkvancil on Jan 31, 2016 16:58:12 GMT -5
So jamesp I originally thought round would be okay as I had used marbles to fill a vibe batch of obsidian. Now I see the pics of the damage your rocks incurred. Some of the obsidian in the marbles batch I ran had similar damage. Some not all. At the time I thought I had somehow gotten a small agate chip or the like in there. Looked but never found any contamination. Am now putting two and two together. Round and relatively hard not good vibe fill ......
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 31, 2016 18:20:52 GMT -5
So jamesp I originally thought round would be okay as I had used marbles to fill a vibe batch of obsidian. Now I see the pics of the damage your rocks incurred. Some of the obsidian in the marbles batch I ran had similar damage. Some not all. At the time I thought I had somehow gotten a small agate chip or the like in there. Looked but never found any contamination. Am now putting two and two together. Round and relatively hard not good vibe fill ...... It hit ya. Nip points of the balls, and marbles probably 1/2 to 5/8. This one was easy to analyze because I run a simple vibe formula over and over. Never such equally distributed divots. Or divots anywhere. If you think about all that rock at the bottom it could be stacked up on balls and getting peened with the weight above. Good to know that you probably did not have a mysterious foreign object. The quartz got peened a lot, coral and agate not hardly. But, they had a crappy luster. No doubt it was effecting the polish of the hardest materials. I wonder if your marbles had divots, do you remember ? The ceramic balls did not, and should not, ceramic media very hard and very tough. They had a fine polish LOL. Just started the vibe up with SiC 220 to skin the damage off. May take two runs w/220. no problem, divot damage easy to see.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 1, 2016 23:43:37 GMT -5
SiC 220 in the vibe removed the damage in 24 hours. Have had good luck removing light frost damage too with SiC 220 in the past. Difficult to know if you should go all the way back to SiC 80. Before After 24 hours in 220, looks like divots are gone.
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tkvancil
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Post by tkvancil on Feb 2, 2016 11:35:51 GMT -5
Nice save jamesp . Looks like the batch will be good. No the marbles didn't have divots just some of the rocks. The marbles were about 15% of the load, 50% obsidian and the rest ceramic. Going to stick to ceramic only in the future, but didn't have enough back then. Bought more a while back.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 2, 2016 12:38:52 GMT -5
Nice save jamesp . Looks like the batch will be good. No the marbles didn't have divots just some of the rocks. The marbles were about 15% of the load, 50% obsidian and the rest ceramic. Going to stick to ceramic only in the future, but didn't have enough back then. Bought more a while back. Moral to story, stay away from round shaped media 3/8" and larger. Thanks for feedback tk.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Feb 2, 2016 17:30:14 GMT -5
Wow, that 220 made it look like a completely different rock.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 2, 2016 20:49:35 GMT -5
Wow, that 220 made it look like a completely different rock. SiC 220 did quick work on the surface Jugglerguy. When doing a 2 day SiC 220 run I have been adding a teaspoon of AO 500 after one day. Rocks come out a lot shinier and easier for the straight AO 500 step. Can't hurt, teaspoon is not much. When running SiC 30 and 80 in the rubber lined Viking they both break down to about nothing in 24 hours. The 30 grit is easy to see, it's gone at 24. I think you did an experiment rough shaping with SiC 80 in the Lot-O. Can't remember how long you ran before clean outs. Thinking a clean out every day would be the best because of the fast break down. Maybe even every 12 hours. It would be a lot of work though. But after 24 hours I don't think the grit is big enough to do any shaping. Curious how much shaping 80 grit could do in say 2 weeks if you did a clean out every day. Unlike the rotary, the vibe uses a smaller dose each clean out. May get more shaping in 2 weeks than the rotary. May use more grit too.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Feb 2, 2016 20:59:35 GMT -5
You're talking about this thread. I used 120/220 and changed grit every day.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 2, 2016 21:21:13 GMT -5
You're talking about this thread. I used 120/220 and changed grit every day. Rob, the hyperlink took me back to this thread. Ah, clean out every day. Good. The Lot-O may not be designed for 80 grit. Is that why you used 120/220 ? Do you think the rocks would have shape a lot faster if you used 80 ? Sometime I will try your experiment with the SiC 30 in the Viking since it has a crazy tuff urethane liner.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Feb 2, 2016 23:18:43 GMT -5
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 2, 2016 23:35:47 GMT -5
20 days, and did darn well for 120/220. So do you think 80 grit would have a big difference ?
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bushmanbilly
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Post by bushmanbilly on Feb 3, 2016 2:15:17 GMT -5
Wow, that 220 made it look like a completely different rock. Good one thanks for the chuckle.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 3, 2016 6:23:51 GMT -5
Wow, that 220 made it look like a completely different rock. Good one thanks for the chuckle. Metaphysical 220 grit does wonders.
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Intheswamp
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Post by Intheswamp on Feb 3, 2016 8:01:07 GMT -5
LOL...I wasn't going to say anything *this* time....
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