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Post by tims on Nov 9, 2016 1:19:34 GMT -5
Found a few pockets-full of (*DEFINITELY NOT*) amber today and might grab some more ... not sure how it will polish but it's super easy to shape.
Only brought one piece in out of the soak bucket tonight but will shoot the lot tomorrow. Before and after 10 minutes on the coarse wheel:
This one has some pesky bubbles but it's just a play piece, might shine on it a little tonight.
Does anybody tumble this stuff?
Somebody forgot the corners but it shines up ok.
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Post by tims on Nov 9, 2016 5:39:47 GMT -5
This stuff might be copal. Not certain how to tell the difference. Didn't know there was a difference until i started googling amber and saw all the fakes available. Anyway, no malicious intent --- the few old farts i've had the pleasure of kicking rocks with locally call it amber (or leaverite, depending) so i think of it as amber.
Pretty and easy to play with in any case.
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metalsmith
Cave Dweller 
Member since October 2012
Posts: 1,537
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Post by metalsmith on Nov 9, 2016 8:24:42 GMT -5
Hi Tims Cool! ... if it can be worked, it can be worked. Whether or not it is Copal or Amber may influence its durability. A good treatise on the differences and how to test it can be found here. There are clear differences that gemmological testing can identify (before the durability test disappoints you) see Charts here. In the absence of much else, ether and polarising filters can be used to achieve a reasonable level of comfort that you have one or the other. |
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Fossilman
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2009
Posts: 20,723 
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Post by Fossilman on Nov 9, 2016 10:05:17 GMT -5
Looks like your on the way with a good polish......NICE!
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Post by tims on Nov 9, 2016 20:17:59 GMT -5
Hi Tims Cool! ... if it can be worked, it can be worked. Whether or not it is Copal or Amber may influence its durability. A good treatise on the differences and how to test it can be found here. There are clear differences that gemmological testing can identify (before the durability test disappoints you) see Charts here. In the absence of much else, ether and polarising filters can be used to achieve a reasonable level of comfort that you have one or the other. Thanks for the links, I looked through that first page and a few of its links last night, and tried isopropyl alcohol with no noticeable stickiness. I'm not really concerned with doing the homework to determine an exact classification unless I get lucky and find a plant inclusion or something. I am confident that the resin is old enough to work with, otherwise I suspect my polishing pads would have been gummed up beyond repair (something I didn't even consider beforehand).
Anyway, you're right, it doesn't really matter what it is if I can play with it. Since it's easily workable and not messy i'm comfortable lapping it in the house which will give me something to get me through the winter. It also looks to be easily drilled, unlike stone, which might give some cheap and easy options to actually finish some pieces into pendants / beads etc. to throw at relatives for gifts instead of the oh-so personal gift cards I usually resort to 
Here's another handful of the rough. Some of it has nice translucence and it ranges in color through yellow / tan / red-brown and almost to black.
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metalsmith
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 1,537
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Post by metalsmith on Nov 10, 2016 1:45:45 GMT -5
Thanks for the links, I looked through that first page and a few of its links last night, and tried isopropyl alcohol with no noticeable stickiness. I'm not really concerned with doing the homework to determine an exact classification unless I get lucky and find a plant inclusion or something. I am confident that the resin is old enough to work with, otherwise I suspect my polishing pads would have been gummed up beyond repair (something I didn't even consider beforehand).
Anyway, you're right, it doesn't really matter what it is if I can play with it. Since it's easily workable and not messy i'm comfortable lapping it in the house which will give me something to get me through the winter. It also looks to be easily drilled, unlike stone, which might give some cheap and easy options to actually finish some pieces into pendants / beads etc. to throw at relatives for gifts instead of the oh-so personal gift cards I usually resort to
Here's another handful of the rough. Some of it has nice translucence and it ranges in color through yellow / tan / red-brown and almost to black.
If you're pulling the stuff out of the ground then some small amount of research might be able to date it and there's your answer. The difference between Copal and Amber is simply one of age and ageing causing the resin to progressively denature losing the volatiles. If it is really old i.e. coming out of rock millions of years old, it is amber; if it is coming out of soil, tens to hundreds of thousands of years, it is copal. I'd want to know for when I finished working it - what is it - or before, so I didn't put too much effort in only to see it craze. But if you knew it was copal you might consider working it anyway then coating it to prevent further denaturing and preserving your work. |
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Post by tims on Nov 10, 2016 1:50:18 GMT -5
Well i don't think this is copal either. Supposedly copal should pass the salt-water amber test, floating in a 4 to 1 water / salt solution. This stuff feels rather light but sinks like a rock. It appears to be a hardened resin, but a red-hot nail applied doesn't melt it or create any smell. It scratches easily with a nail but not as easily as i'd expect if it were only ~2.5 mohs.
I find this material alongside baculite and pelecypods. I'm reading through the USGS geological report for the area and so far it has mentioned the baculite, clams, and also iron oxide nodules (i've always known them as hematite) that are in the area so maybe this stuff will get a mention as well. If all else fails this may go to the ID thread ...
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Post by tims on Nov 10, 2016 1:52:11 GMT -5
PS this is just scattered on the surface, no digging for this kid.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2016 11:21:38 GMT -5
What happens with open flame?
Curious goods you got there!
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Post by tims on Nov 10, 2016 18:23:53 GMT -5
Open flame doesn't seem to have any effect. I thought it could possibly be siderite, which should display magnetic properties when heated, but using a nail on a string didn't show any magnetism although just heating over a candle may not get it hot enough. Siderite is still my best guess for now since it's listed in the geological survey for the area and some googled specimens have a similar look.
Here's a pic broken up:
It does seem to have a crystalline structure and may be a mix of several things. I'm convinced it's not originally organic. No cloned dinos for me 
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Post by braders on Nov 10, 2016 22:33:33 GMT -5
I've been watching this post with curious eyes I have picked that stuff up a number of times and always wondered what it was ? Never put it to the wheels but did throw a handful in tumbler to only have it disapoint !! It seems I'm my area to be found more often with stromatolites <-----think that's right name lol and with calcite and in petwood areas ... not sure if this is same stuff but sure looks the part ? Also heard a lady call it root beer calcite once but she was half crazy so who knows ha ha |
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Shannon
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since July 2015
Posts: 145 
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Post by Shannon on Nov 10, 2016 23:52:17 GMT -5
If it's calcite it'll fizz when you put vinegar on it! Worth a shot.
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Post by tims on Nov 11, 2016 0:12:51 GMT -5
No reaction to vinegar but worth a try ... i could imagine red-brown calcite formations looking similar.
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Post by tims on Nov 11, 2016 0:35:09 GMT -5
Streak test with yellow / red / black pieces all gave a white streak. If i can find a torch i might put more heat to it and see if it shows magnetism. I've about convinced myself it's at least partially siderite.
Posting to the ID thread.
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Post by braders on Nov 12, 2016 9:55:43 GMT -5
If it's calcite it'll fizz when you put vinegar on it! Worth a shot. Now I'm gonna have to go dig threw the leaves and rock pile to see if I can find some , I never did a reaction test so I'm curious now |
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