jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,561
|
Post by jamesp on Dec 19, 2016 9:45:40 GMT -5
Try aluminum oxide 80 for your 2nd step in your rotary. You can get small amounts from Ebay cheap. Ebay search 'aluminum oxide blasting media'.
It will remove scratches from SiC 30-46-60. After 5 days you should get a 500-1000 sheen. My test is on day 6. Day 5 rocks have a slight sheen. No clean outs, no grit additions, just let them roll. Will not be surprised if it takes the rocks to pre-polish shine by day 10. Fine prep for the vibe or finishing out in rotary.
Never had a sheen using SiC 220 for 2nd step after 10 days much less 5.
Same thing happens in vibe, 2 days AO 80 makes a decent polish. Rotary just takes longer.
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Dec 19, 2016 10:21:02 GMT -5
When have I ever bought anything in small amounts? Are you using it with clay? I just reloaded three 15 lb barrels, 1 yesterday, 2 this morning. Rocks progressing nicely and culled a few. 1 barrel of rios/ stone canyon move to 320 grit 1 barrel of rios from our trip went from 30 to 46/70 - meant to go to 60/90, but grabbed the wrong container. 1 barrel big honkin' rio in barrel solo with ceramic media , litter and 30 grit. Got more to get checked on or started, but way too busy. I hope you are sitting down Mr. jamesp - I added cat litter to all 3 barrels. Kinda figured that either you are right and it will help or you are pulling one heck of a trick on the group here. Never done the cat litter thing... will see. Will look into 80 AO today if time permits. Wondering where it fits in rotation. Go from 80 AO to 500 SiC?
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Dec 19, 2016 10:27:29 GMT -5
Try aluminum oxide 80 for your 2nd step in your rotary. The brown or the white - are they different? ETA: Care to explain the difference between Sand Blasting Abrasive and the grits we now use? Do they break down or wear out differently? save me from having to figure it out!
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,561
|
Post by jamesp on Dec 19, 2016 10:55:13 GMT -5
There is a lot of different aluminum oxide forms. Some sharp, some like balls. Balls expensive. I am using the cheap (probably crushed) sharp stuff. Mine is brown. Don't think it matters, crushed-spherical-white-brown. Sand blasting is sharp. The tumbler will put it to use in any form.
It would not pick up the first day so I tossed some clay in with it day 2. Lost a day there.
Judging from 5 days I would do AO 1000 the next step. Anxious to see day 10 shine. However I am looking for a lazy tumble and shooting for a decent polish after day 10-14. No clean outs, no grit additions. A true captbob metabolism.
Aluminum oxide way different than SiC. It has the ability to to smooth and polish skipping many middle steps.
I am almost out of AO 80 so I ordered like 10 pounds this morn. Also ordered 25 pounds of AO 24. Both Ebay. Will get link when wife fixes connection.
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,561
|
Post by jamesp on Dec 19, 2016 11:02:17 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Dec 19, 2016 11:10:43 GMT -5
Thanks for the info. I see that stuff comes in most any grit. Pretty cheap too. You see any reason to even use SiC grits anymore other than for the coarse grind? I am looking for a lazy tumble A true captbob metabolism. As you saw in Texas, I can get inspired and motivated. Just gotten bored with tumbling over the years. Well maybe not bored, just unmotivated. I know what I can do and pretty much what the end results will be before I even start the rocks. meh ... not exciting anymore, at the present time anyway. Still enjoy seeing my end results, just don't care how I get there or how long it takes. If I forget the barrels for a month at a time, the rocks don't care. They just keep rolling. Kinda a get to 'em when I get to 'em attitude. Enjoying these rios from our trip more than most rocks I've tumbled lately, guess because we found them ourselves.
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Dec 19, 2016 11:19:52 GMT -5
Gotta ask, why the AO 24? You looking to start with that, do a couple recharges with the same and run it to finish with all one grit?
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,561
|
Post by jamesp on Dec 19, 2016 11:51:52 GMT -5
Dito the tumbling motivational issues. The big tumbles added a spark. Self finds are yes, rewarding to tumble. Yes, SiC 30 to shape. Or 45/70 or whatever people prefer for shaping. That's it for SiC. SiC 220-500-1000 useless as teats boar hog. AO is the master of finish. Finish involves the last few microns of the surface of the rock. Let the AO handle that. Fine SiC sizes can do it, but are far better at scratching than polishing. Yes captbob a race horse in Texas. Me did not want to keep up w/you. Very motivated, wide eyed and hungary. The AO 24 is just a curio. To see if it will round and polish. I don't think size matters with AO. I think you could put AO 4 in a tumbler and end up with a nice pre-polish.
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Dec 19, 2016 12:03:54 GMT -5
Run that AO 4 long enough and wouldn't it break all the way down to AO polish?
One grit to do an entire load start to finish would be - interesting. And put a lot of other grits on the back shelf.
|
|
huskeric
spending too much on rocks
Member since May 2016
Posts: 353
|
Post by huskeric on Dec 19, 2016 13:15:11 GMT -5
Wow, they have a lot of good stuff in their eBay store. What about using some of the other abrasives? I *believe* that since Garnet is so hard, it wouldn't be good simply because it won't break down over time. However, if you're doing rough tumbling, maybe it would be really good for that.
Or, maybe I'm just getting distracted by shiny-- SQUIRREL!!!
What was I talking about? Oh yeah, lunch. I'm sure hungry...
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,561
|
Post by jamesp on Dec 19, 2016 13:54:27 GMT -5
Run that AO 4 long enough and wouldn't it break all the way down to AO polish? One grit to do an entire load start to finish would be - interesting. And put a lot of other grits on the back shelf. I am not so sure AO breaks down. It only smooths. That is why you can re-use AO polish many times. We can't see it because it is so fine, but I would guess AO 500-1000-14,000 all rounds and does not 'break'. AO is friggin hard. Unlikely to 'break'. SiC breaks. Yes, grits on back shelf. My vibe does AO 80 and then AO 14,000. Intermediate grits already given away. I sent several 5 pound bags of 500 and 1000 to RTH members. Don't need it for the vibe no mo. Hopefully not needed for the rotary either, time will tell.
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,561
|
Post by jamesp on Dec 19, 2016 13:56:49 GMT -5
Wow, they have a lot of good stuff in their eBay store. What about using some of the other abrasives? I *believe* that since Garnet is so hard, it wouldn't be good simply because it won't break down over time. However, if you're doing rough tumbling, maybe it would be really good for that. Or, maybe I'm just getting distracted by shiny-- SQUIRREL!!! What was I talking about? Oh yeah, lunch. I'm sure hungry... Garnet too slow Rick. It is about 1/3 as hard as aluminum oxide. It will take a thin layer off though. Enjoy lunch, what is being served and be right over.
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,561
|
Post by jamesp on Dec 19, 2016 14:04:55 GMT -5
This is the AO 80 I have(black particles are SiC 220). It is both brown in color and sharp. I just ordered AO 80 in white and sharp.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2016 18:42:26 GMT -5
captbob I was using kitty litter in the spring when I got my crappy rotary rolling. In a month I had confirmed Jim's 'all grit used up in 2-3 days" observation and even saw large ones rounding fast. Went from milkshake to soft serve in two weeks of 72 hour additions of grit. The clay "gelled" with the addition of silica.
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,561
|
Post by jamesp on Dec 20, 2016 7:11:02 GMT -5
There is an old saying in the grading business.
"95% of the work is in the last 5% of the grade."
Not so much in the tumbling biz. 95% of the work is in the rough shaping, 5% in the finish(with a vibe anyway).
I would suggest AO 80 after coarse shaping. Vibe or rotary.
|
|
|
Post by glennz01 on Dec 26, 2016 15:19:49 GMT -5
There is an old saying in the grading business. "95% of the work is in the last 5% of the grade." Not so much in the tumbling biz. 95% of the work is in the rough shaping, 5% in the finish(with a vibe anyway). I would suggest AO 80 after coarse shaping. Vibe or rotary. Would this stuff work the same after sic 60/90 and a week or would it still need to be ao 80? www.blackcatmining.com/rock-tumbling/pre-polish-5lb.cfmI have 5 lbs of that stuff as it was the best deal at the time. If this turns out to work it could save a lot of time and money.
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,561
|
Post by jamesp on Dec 26, 2016 15:45:15 GMT -5
There is an old saying in the grading business. "95% of the work is in the last 5% of the grade." Not so much in the tumbling biz. 95% of the work is in the rough shaping, 5% in the finish(with a vibe anyway). I would suggest AO 80 after coarse shaping. Vibe or rotary. Would this stuff work the same after sic 60/90 and a week or would it still need to be ao 80? www.blackcatmining.com/rock-tumbling/pre-polish-5lb.cfmI have 5 lbs of that stuff as it was the best deal at the time. If this turns out to work it could save a lot of time and money. Hi Glen I use a clay slurry thickener that grabs all the SiC and about guarantees it is all broken down after a week. Can't speak for your slurry so it is hard to answer. AO pre-polish is AO 1000 ? I have seen AO 500 called pre-polish. May not matter. I say run the 60/90 a week and give it a try for a week. Pull a rock after a week in pre-polish and see if you are getting a sheen. Best if you have milkshake slurry for the week you run the 60/90.
|
|
|
Post by captbob on Dec 26, 2016 16:59:01 GMT -5
Whether your pre-polish is 500 or 1000, I'm of a mind that going from SiC 60/90 to a 500 or higher AO with no step in between is just too big a jump in a rotary barrel. Unless you run the heck out of the 60/90, basically wearing it down to nothing and leaving very minimal grit scratches for the AO pre-polish to have to remove. YMMV
As Jim says, give it a try and see if it works for ya! Nothing to lose other than time.
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,561
|
Post by jamesp on Dec 26, 2016 17:10:29 GMT -5
Whether your pre-polish is 500 or 1000, I'm of a mind that going from SiC 60/90 to a 500 or higher AO with no step in between is just too big a jump in a rotary barrel. Unless you run the heck out of the 60/90, basically wearing it down to nothing and leaving very minimal grit scratches for the AO pre-polish to have to remove. YMMV As Jim says, give it a try and see if it works for ya! Nothing to lose other than time. I agree. AO 100 or 220 OK. Even at 500 a stretch. However, I got some pre-polish AO that is a mix of 200-1000 from a reputable tumbler supplier. When the word 'pre-polish' is used be suspicious of reject mixes.
|
|
|
Post by glennz01 on Dec 26, 2016 18:54:44 GMT -5
Whether your pre-polish is 500 or 1000, I'm of a mind that going from SiC 60/90 to a 500 or higher AO with no step in between is just too big a jump in a rotary barrel. Unless you run the heck out of the 60/90, basically wearing it down to nothing and leaving very minimal grit scratches for the AO pre-polish to have to remove. YMMV As Jim says, give it a try and see if it works for ya! Nothing to lose other than time. I agree. AO 100 or 220 OK. Even at 500 a stretch. However, I got some pre-polish AO that is a mix of 200-1000 from a reputable tumbler supplier. When the word 'pre-polish' is used be suspicious of reject mixes. Yeah, typically my slurry gets thick.. I don't have any more rocks to tumble yet to fill my big barrel.. but sometimes it goes on for too long and becomes like a pudding. after that i went to sic pre polish generally. but ran pre polish for a week just about. With the size of the rocks I polish, grit doesn't last too long.
|
|