wrock
off to a rocking start
Member since February 2017
Posts: 5 
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Post by wrock on Feb 6, 2017 11:39:32 GMT -5
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Post by wigglinrocks on Feb 6, 2017 11:43:14 GMT -5
No photos
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wrock
off to a rocking start
Member since February 2017
Posts: 5
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Post by wrock on Feb 6, 2017 12:16:11 GMT -5
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Don
Cave Dweller 
He wants you too, Malachi.
Member since December 2009
Posts: 2,616
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Post by Don on Feb 6, 2017 12:57:46 GMT -5
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Post by orrum on Feb 6, 2017 15:07:54 GMT -5
Those appear to be spalls or flakes from knapping but the patina is nonexistent on some areas so I would lean toward modern not ancient man.
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Sabre52
Cave Dweller
Me and my gal, Rosie
Member since August 2005
Posts: 20,514
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Post by Sabre52 on Feb 6, 2017 16:09:28 GMT -5
Yeah, middle left is a base of a Pedernales projectile point. A couple on the right are possibly worked flakes used as knives or scrapers. Most are spalls and waste flakes. I have a flint quarry on my hill that is full of that stuff. Here in south central Texas, that sort of stuff can easily be archaic period stuff 3-5000 years old as the top soil often erodes leaving material sitting right on the surface....Mel
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Post by 1dave on Feb 6, 2017 16:25:16 GMT -5
I tried looking at the first one and only got: Never did see a photo. jpg usually works better than the larger png. Edit: It finally showed up. Shouldn't be a problem.  |
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agatemaggot
Cave Dweller
Member since August 2006
Posts: 2,195
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Post by agatemaggot on Feb 8, 2017 4:22:23 GMT -5
Have to agree with Mel on the Pedernales point / knife base and some are obviously waste flakes (debitage ). There are a couple pieces tho that would qualify as problematic tools. Those you find fairly frequently and they have secondary flaking along the length of one or more edges with well rounded small notches in different sizes. Maybe they were used like little Exacto knives to scrape bark from arrow shafts or something similar. They all have a common denominator , the flaking is always done from one side only and most all have one of those well rounded notches like you have on the items pictured. I have about a gal. jug full somewhere in my garage and studied them under a high powered magnifier at work.
The edges all showed wear / no longer razor sharp,some had a piece of edge broken off probably from excess pressure at some point. They are referred to as problematic tools because none of the Archies can say what they really are.
After looking at the darn things for lots longer than I care to admit, I believe that to de-bark an Arrow shaft, remove high spots and make a notch to fit the point into and a notch for the Bow string, a person would need a tool that resembled those exactly. Those could be made in about a minute or less and like an Exacto blade, used once or twice and discarded.
It's hard to say without an in hand look but a couple of those pieces could possibly be crudely made scrapers, made quick, used and discarded or set down and forgotten .
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wrock
off to a rocking start
Member since February 2017
Posts: 5
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Post by wrock on Feb 8, 2017 9:33:23 GMT -5
thats what i was thinking was scrappers or exacto blade, i found them in a remote location in Comanche county, tx. they were found in like a bar ditch of red clay like dirt in about a 20'x15' area. on the edge of a tree line.
i thought if they were in fact tools it would be neat to frame some and hang in my house.
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Post by 1dave on Feb 8, 2017 9:40:32 GMT -5
Around here we don't dare mention anything about our finds.
The Antique Police would love to lock us up or hound us to suicide.
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Fossilman
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2009
Posts: 20,726
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Post by Fossilman on Feb 8, 2017 10:34:46 GMT -5
Around here we don't dare mention anything about our finds. The Antique Police would love to lock us up or hound us to suicide. Same around here David!!!!! |
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Fossilman
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2009
Posts: 20,726
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Post by Fossilman on Feb 8, 2017 10:35:29 GMT -5
thats what i was thinking was scrappers or exacto blade, i found them in a remote location in Comanche county, tx. they were found in like a bar ditch of red clay like dirt in about a 20'x15' area. on the edge of a tree line. i thought if they were in fact tools it would be neat to frame some and hang in my house. Find someone that knapps and have them finish them off for you.... |
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agatemaggot
Cave Dweller
Member since August 2006
Posts: 2,195
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Post by agatemaggot on Feb 8, 2017 16:36:32 GMT -5
It's a good idea to keep QUIET after any surface find other than human bones. When the laws were passed concerning artifact hunting they were signed by Jimmy Carter who added a bit of wisdom of his own, it's referred to as the ( Carter clause) which makes it legal to pick up Artifacts from the surface of the ground because being exposed as they are, they no longer have ANY value to archaeology. This means they are out of context with their former surroundings. President Carter owned a huge collection and was quite the student of archeology himself !
Before signing the current laws he added his own section and it included hunting public lands, BUT , every state has it's own way of interpreting
federal laws it seems. I carry a copy in my vehicle just in case I should be questioned by an overly ambitious authority figure. I personally would ( NOT ) post pictures anywhere that weren't backed up with the statement that they were found back in the 50's by my long dead Grandfather who left them to me or a family member in his will !
Because of all the( PC ) bullshit going around when it comes to ( Indian ) REAL / ORIGINAL AMERICAN cultural items :::::
Silence is golden !
I still hunt but do not show or discuss any finds with anyone other than close friends in the hobby.
Anyone interested can do a Google search on (Carter clause) if they care to read it.
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flrocks
starting to shine!
Member since December 2013
Posts: 40
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Post by flrocks on Feb 8, 2017 19:29:19 GMT -5
Tools or just rocks? Are you buying or selling? Of course they're tools if you own them, if your neighbor owns then they're just old rocks.
FLRocks
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Sabre52
Cave Dweller
Me and my gal, Rosie
Member since August 2005
Posts: 20,514
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Post by Sabre52 on Feb 8, 2017 21:19:20 GMT -5
Texas is so cool most all pvt property so artifact collecting is a huge hobby. Lots of fee digs you can go to if you can't get legal access any other way. Have annual artifact shows, knap-ins etc. Great place to be an artifact collector.....Mel
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Fossilman
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2009
Posts: 20,726
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Post by Fossilman on Feb 8, 2017 23:08:43 GMT -5
To many artifact laws in Oregon,sticky laws,so best not to hound points and tools at all.........For us anyhow!
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Post by 1dave on Feb 9, 2017 8:29:55 GMT -5
To many artifact laws in Oregon,sticky laws,so best not to hound points and tools at all.........For us anyhow! Control freaks ruin it for everyone. No one will share with them so valuable material disappears in the sands of time. On the other hand, people like Dinosaur Jim glorified the people that brought new finds to him, allowing stupendous finds.  |
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agatemaggot
Cave Dweller
Member since August 2006
Posts: 2,195
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Post by agatemaggot on Feb 11, 2017 4:29:46 GMT -5
Some of you guy's down there are just plain flat out lucky with all the material available to you. Here in Iowa I can sort thru 100 tons of rock in a local gravel quarry and if I get REALLY lucky, I might go home with 3 or 4 pounds of workable material.
Take 4 to 6 hours doing it and go thru a pair of work gloves.
Those flat rate boxes are about the only thing keepin me in the game !
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ottog
off to a rocking start
rock classics
Member since January 2017
Posts: 6
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Post by ottog on Feb 22, 2017 14:55:36 GMT -5
Some of you guy's down there are just plain flat out lucky with all the material available to you. Here in Iowa I can sort thru 100 tons of rock in a local gravel quarry and if I get REALLY lucky, I might go home with 3 or 4 pounds of workable material. Take 4 to 6 hours doing it and go thru a pair of work gloves. Those flat rate boxes are about the only thing keepin me in the game ! |
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agatemaggot
Cave Dweller
Member since August 2006
Posts: 2,195
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Post by agatemaggot on Feb 23, 2017 3:09:56 GMT -5
I buy flat raters from Neolithics Supply that is run by a gentleman named Craig Ratzat. He carries everything you need in the way of Flintknapping supplies. Raw stone, heat treated rock, tools and preforms.
Just google Neolithics and his store will be at the top of the page !
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Maybe you can post some pictures here
Maybe you can post some pictures here