jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 16, 2018 9:05:54 GMT -5
I would like to try wrapping with jewelry grade wrapping wire. Four small rolls, black, copper, brass and silver(color). Thanks in advance.
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Apr 16, 2018 9:27:59 GMT -5
I would like to try wrapping with jewelry grade wrapping wire. Four small rolls, black, copper, brass and silver(color). Thanks in advance. Well that should wake up the wire wrapping section. 100 new wraps every day! That's a loaded question. Maybe show an example of what type of wrap you want to do? We use round wire, half round wire and square wire. Each of those in multiple gauges and multiple hardness. Lots of variables but if you just have one style in mind we can narrow it down. Chuck
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minerken
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Post by minerken on Apr 16, 2018 10:22:21 GMT -5
I tried what I could find for black one time, but all I could find was black aluminum that was probably anodized it didn't work well at all, it tended to mar very easily showing the silver. It was definitely cool with the silver if it wasn't for the scratches. Hope someone knows of a way or a wire that would work too.
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Tommy
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Post by Tommy on Apr 16, 2018 10:48:30 GMT -5
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 16, 2018 10:50:00 GMT -5
I would like to try wrapping with jewelry grade wrapping wire. Four small rolls, black, copper, brass and silver(color). Thanks in advance. Well that should wake up the wire wrapping section. 100 new wraps every day! That's a loaded question. Maybe show an example of what type of wrap you want to do? We use round wire, half round wire and square wire. Each of those in multiple gauges and multiple hardness. Lots of variables but if you just have one style in mind we can narrow it down. Chuck Going to say round to avoid the twist issue Chuck for starts. Going to go with 3 most common gauges. Going to go with 2 most common hardness. Going to go with silver. Not 925 for starts. 3 X 2 = 6 rolls, one of each. How does that sound ? Average pendant size is 3/16 thick and 1.5" X 2". Rounded girdle. Low dome. Thanks Chuck(consultation rate ?)
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 16, 2018 11:02:59 GMT -5
Thanks Tommy, Rio is the most common source I see you guys talk about. Prefer to start with the real McCoy. I think Chuck is getting ready to link me up.
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
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Post by jamesp on Apr 16, 2018 11:15:01 GMT -5
I tried what I could find for black one time, but all I could find was black aluminum that was probably anodized it didn't work well at all, it tended to mar very easily showing the silver. It was definitely cool with the silver if it wasn't for the scratches. Hope someone knows of a way or a wire that would work too. Thanks minerken, looks like answers are close at hand.
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Apr 16, 2018 11:41:35 GMT -5
If you want the silver look but want to save a little money I would recommend going with .925 silver filled wire. Going with anything less really takes away from your product. Craft wire or coated wire is also a pain in the ass to work with compared to silver or filled silver. Rio is good for silver filled. I still need to see an example of what your end goal is. If it is an actual wrapped cab they require a stack of wires going around the outside. Stacking round wire is a challenge compared to stacking square wire. I rarely use round for my main wires for that reason. I am doubting you are thinking of a traditional stacked set of wires. Are you thinking something along the lines of just some twisted wire that hold the rock? I had to dig to find one of my wraps prior to my groove wrapping phase. This shows where the square wire comes in handy. Chuck
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Apr 16, 2018 11:45:57 GMT -5
If you are just going for a simple twisted wire wrap then round wire is the way to go. I don't care too much for these but I only tried a couple times way back when I first started. 20 gauge half hard copper wire. Chuck
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Post by MrP on Apr 16, 2018 12:05:35 GMT -5
I was also going to say round wire is tough to work with unless it is a single wire. With the square wire you can also get a couple of pin vices and give the wire a real twisted look. Twisted is a little harder to work with but better then round......................MrP
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Post by rockjunquie on Apr 16, 2018 14:12:54 GMT -5
Sounds like you want to do more traditional work. I really can't add to what Chuck has said. Go for the silver fill. And shop at a better shop not a crafts store. What they have is crap and you'll be wasting money. I like Rio and their tools.
20 g round, 1/2 round and square would be a good start. I would recommend 1/2 hard square and soft square (in case you want to twist it). Ditto for 22 g. I like to have a little of everything on hand, but you can start with 20 and 22. 22 for the smaller projects. If you like a patina, get some liver of sulfur.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 16, 2018 18:23:36 GMT -5
You guys got me fixed up enough to get a start. Guessing I will figure out the pros and cons of various cross sections/hardnesses/gauges. Really appreciate the consult. Looks like my wife has put me on this project, she may be the wrapper of the household. May start one of our competitions though. I can't hold a paper clip without bending it in some form. Always enjoyed bending metal. And have always been impressed with the art forms created by you guys using wire.
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Post by drocknut on Apr 16, 2018 18:54:09 GMT -5
I don't have much to add but since I'm a wrapper too thought I'd better at least give my 2 cents. You will figure out about the hardness after you try wrapping. I have used dead soft and half-hard but prefer half-hard unless I'm twisting it or wrapping a more delicate cab. I personally hate silver filled wire because I think even the 1/2 hard is too soft but then again I usually wrap with sterling silver or Argentium which definitely act different from the filled wire. Filled is a good alternative to craft wire that is usually just plain cruddy. I do use gold filled wire because it is less expensive but I get it in half-hard so it isn't too soft for me to work. You might check out Parawire for black wire. I tried their wire for doing Viking knit but the coating didn't stand up to the harsh treatment when doing Viking knit and drawing it through a draw plate. I think Parawire is a tad better than craft store wire but for the good stuff I stick with Rio Grande. There's my 2 cents for you.
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Fossilman
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Post by Fossilman on Apr 16, 2018 19:58:24 GMT -5
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Post by captbob on Apr 16, 2018 21:56:41 GMT -5
I would like to try wrapping with jewelry grade wrapping wire. WHO ARE YOU ??
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Apr 16, 2018 22:55:25 GMT -5
Ditto what rockjunquie and drocknut said. I have never used craft wire and never will. I am a wire snob. If you must, use silver filled. I save all my scrap sterling and fine silver and use it for decorative elements when I'm making a smithed piece. You can send precious metal scrap back to Rio and they will give you a credit for your next order. I haven't done it yet, but someday maybe I will. I'm not sure about the silver filled, but I don't see why they wouldn't accept that, too. Save every little single bit, no matter how small. It all adds up to weight. If you want black wire, liver of sulfur it until it's black. Get the gel LOS. It lasts longer. Just keep it in a dark space.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 17, 2018 4:50:23 GMT -5
Drummond Island Rocks and all you other master wire wrappers: This is way beyond any wrap that I could ever perform. I am actually looking for a partner to help with this glass 'manufacturing' gig if it takes off. A local person, maybe a retiree that would like to do minimal wraps, attend Atlanta arts festivals and help with possible internet listings. Minimal wraps for $20 pieces for instance. Or captbob a young nubile lol. Anyway, they need to live close by and hopefully have some internet savvy. But I need to have high quality wire on hand to get them started. I may go down to Amalgam Arts Jewelry school and see if I can find someone that wants to work out of their home wrapping. I just want to make the glass and oversee the tumblers because I really enjoy those functions. And the marketing aspect because I feel I have a product that is going to sell eventually.
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Post by MrP on Apr 17, 2018 5:14:39 GMT -5
Drummond Island Rocks and all you other master wire wrappers: This is way beyond any wrap that I could ever perform. I am actually looking for a partner to help with this glass 'manufacturing' gig if it takes off. A local person, maybe a retiree that would like to do minimal wraps, attend Atlanta arts festivals and help with possible internet listings. Minimal wraps for $20 pieces for instance. Or captbob a young nubile lol. Anyway, they need to live close by and hopefully have some internet savvy. But I need to have high quality wire on hand to get them started. I may go down to Amalgam Arts Jewelry school and see if I can find someone that wants to work out of their home wrapping. I just want to make the glass and oversee the tumblers because I really enjoy those functions. And the marketing aspect because I feel I have a product that is going to sell eventually. James, JMO but I would not do anything other then a very simple wrap, for anybody, for less then $10, even if they supply the wire. A multi wire wrap can cost $4 or more for the wire. I can do a nice wrap in as little as 15 min but most take 30 or more min. You take the cost of wire plus paying the person to wrap and your $20 pendant price gives you no extra $ from the sale. As you know that anything extra has to bring you a $ value or it is not worth doing. Remember this is JMO......................MrP
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Apr 17, 2018 7:12:12 GMT -5
Drummond Island Rocks and all you other master wire wrappers: This is way beyond any wrap that I could ever perform. I am actually looking for a partner to help with this glass 'manufacturing' gig if it takes off. A local person, maybe a retiree that would like to do minimal wraps, attend Atlanta arts festivals and help with possible internet listings. Minimal wraps for $20 pieces for instance. Or captbob a young nubile lol. Anyway, they need to live close by and hopefully have some internet savvy. But I need to have high quality wire on hand to get them started. I may go down to Amalgam Arts Jewelry school and see if I can find someone that wants to work out of their home wrapping. I just want to make the glass and oversee the tumblers because I really enjoy those functions. And the marketing aspect because I feel I have a product that is going to sell eventually. James, JMO but I would not do anything other then a very simple wrap, for anybody, for less then $10, even if they supply the wire. A multi wire wrap can cost $4 or more for the wire. I can do a nice wrap in as little as 15 min but most take 30 or more min. You take the cost of wire plus paying the person to wrap and your $20 pendant price gives you no extra $ from the sale. As you know the anything extra has to bring you a $ value or it is not worth doing. Remember this is JMO......................MrP The more I learn the more I see tough dollars. Even with an efficient production process. Give an example, I did 70 of these in the kiln. I made them out of a nice vase with a very peculiar melt process. Nothing like it, good/bad, not sure. The vase cost $28 after shipping. It takes about 70 minutes to nip all the extra clear glass away and silhouette shape/compose after melt. Set up and melt prep another say 70 minutes. So basically I am into these 70 for 3 hours and $28. FAR FROM MASS PRODUCED. Then the tumble process which I am going to do anyway because I love to mass tumble stuff. That part I don't consider a cost. Then come selling, grrrr. 70 at $10 is $700 and that would tickle me. 70 at $5 would be OK, darn sure pay all costs and some and fund my fun of making them. Now maybe there will come a time where I become an acclaimed glass pendant artist if such a thing exists and my weird stuff becomes a sought after item and they sell themselves. Becoming acclaimed would be a dream come true, rock star status for me as I would be very happy with that. I do feel I have a one-of-a-kind product people will buy. Studying 100's of glass pendants on Etsy, there is nothing like this stuff. It is thinner(fused glass pendants notoriously heavy), it has more variety in silhouette shape, and the patterns are completely different. These crazy melts I do are useless(trash) to a fuser because they rarely melt to a polish. And very few tumble polish glass. No polish/no sale. No one even dares to melt vases. Don't know why. Guessing because they can't polish the melts. Well, certain of it. All my melts are bizarre as compared to what is being produced in the glass jewelry business. And the edges will feather in the tumbler revealing more color pattern making them yet more eye catching. A few of the 70 after melt, before nipping and shaping on lap After nipping and shaping on lap, very peculiar for fused glass pendants And a large 12X12 inch plate of these hand blown shards, photo is 3" X 4" section. This is also very peculiar. VERY But being way different than the crowd can make windfalls as being odd man out you may have a wave of clients. And this is what I am banking on. NOT a great artist, just a different process. I have zero training/experience with fusing glass. And don't want any. color feathering on lap before tumble feathering
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Post by drocknut on Apr 17, 2018 10:11:04 GMT -5
Ditto what rockjunquie and drocknut said. I have never used craft wire and never will. I am a wire snob. If you must, use silver filled. I save all my scrap sterling and fine silver and use it for decorative elements when I'm making a smithed piece. You can send precious metal scrap back to Rio and they will give you a credit for your next order. I haven't done it yet, but someday maybe I will. I'm not sure about the silver filled, but I don't see why they wouldn't accept that, too. Save every little single bit, no matter how small. It all adds up to weight. If you want black wire, liver of sulfur it until it's black. Get the gel LOS. It lasts longer. Just keep it in a dark space. I have turned in my scrap for credit many times and it sure helps with the cost of buying wire. Rio will also pay you for the scrap but you get less than if you get credit for it. I have sent in sterling, silver filled, gold filled, and Argentium. I usually save it up and then send it in when I need more wire (I know, vicious cycle...lol). I just wish I could send in copper wire but haven't found any place that will buy scrap copper wire other than the junkyard and they don't pay diddly for it and they want large quantities not just baggies of scrap pieces.
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