jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 11, 2018 4:59:25 GMT -5
Warm weather machine for coarse grind is done outside and only during the warm season. Coarse shaped rocks are stock piled for the vibes to finish inside at leisure. Treated as a separate operation because it is filthy. Outside machine rolls up to 100 pounds. Back shafts turn 6" jars at 30 RPM, 8" poly jars at 24 RPM +/- Front shafts are for fastest shaping and turns 6" poly jars at 90 RPM and 8" poly jars at 78 RPM +/-  This is a small quiet machine for winter rotary tumbling in climate control. 30 RPM, holds two 6" poly jars  This is 700 pounds of silicon carbide metallurgical additive purchase for $300. Should last 10 years easily. Cheapest coarse silicon carbide but requires minimum 6" barrels and slurry additive to float it. Acts in time release fashion since the particles are larger.   SiC metallurgical additive sifted into different grades  Home made 8" poly jar being charged with clay slurry additive and metallurgical grade SiC  Eight home made poly jars ranging from 6-7-8-10 pound capacities for 6" jars, and 8-10-12-16 pound capacities for 8" jars.  Poly jars all use the "30 second cap". Fernco brand with one screw clamp available at Home Depot. They begin to bellow out if gas is present, a hint to burp.   Making poly jars using the stove top to "weld" an HDPE reducer to an HDPE end cap. No leak lifetime rugged using easy to remove and clean Fernco caps. These jars and Fernco caps are the only barrels I have found that hold up to 90 RPM and extreme coarse grit. They are fairly soft and very quiet when used with clay slurry additive.   After grinding weld bead and cutting mouth down. Takes about 45 minutes to perform entire jar build. Cost ~ $55 for 6", $90 for 8".  So that is my coarse grinding operation and is treated as a separate process from the vibratory finishers. Performed during non-freeze time of year and outside. for further details consult this flickr link, thanks for looking www.flickr.com/photos/67205364@N06/27640664979/in/album-72157673297787998/ |
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Post by HankRocks on Sept 11, 2018 6:47:11 GMT -5
jamesp How are your home-made barrels holding up to the heavy duty SiC. I know the Plastic(HDPE?) is resistant to wear, just curious how they are doing with the over-sized SiC.
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Post by fernwood on Sept 11, 2018 7:00:43 GMT -5
Great inventions you have. Also the grit process.
Leave it to an engineer.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 11, 2018 7:16:49 GMT -5
jamesp How are your home-made barrels holding up to the heavy duty SiC. I know the Plastic(HDPE?) is resistant to wear, just curious how they are doing with the over-sized SiC. They are wicked Henry. The internal weld bead is still there. In one of the highest wear zones in the barrel. They also clean well being polyethylene since it is so slick. Love those Fernco caps for the 30 second grit additions every couple of days. Think about this, I spent $1000 dollars on 8 barrels and 10 years worth of coarse SiC running 50 to 100 pounds of rock/glass. I could have built 3 barrels and purchased 300 pounds of coarse SiC for about $350. That would last (guessing) 10 years running those 3 barrels full-time. Before I would spend $110 for 50 pounds of SiC 30 every 6 months. Coarse grind is x10 the most costly part of tumbling. I really think I have the coarse grind figured to a tee. And there is no need to do 90 RPM, 30 does fine. I tumble so much glass, it is shaped fine after 48 hours, 72 starts to remove too much material. I even re-use the slurry and the abrasive because there is abrasive left after only 2 days. Then I roll it in SiC 500/30 RPM which surprisingly will remove too much glass and certainly removes the monster abrasions form the #4 grit. After 3 days in SiC 500 it is straight to the vibes. |
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mud
having dreams about rocks
Member since May 2018
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Post by mud on Sept 11, 2018 7:18:22 GMT -5
Excellent information! Thank you for taking the time to share it.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 11, 2018 7:22:42 GMT -5
Great inventions you have. Also the grit process. Leave it to an engineer. I have worked as an engineer and been responsible for dialing in some seriously complicated industrial processes. It is a love of mine. This tumbling process has been a real challenge. Right at home in my leisure. And have been amazed at how much the tumbling process could be improved. I may not be Mr. Popular because I speak my mind but experimentation often leads to facts no one else wants to hear. I want to be objective and honest in my findings. |
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 11, 2018 7:23:14 GMT -5
Excellent information! Thank you for taking the time to share it. Love the handle mud |
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Sept 11, 2018 7:44:56 GMT -5
Always impressed by your innovations jamesp. No doubt that you have customized your equipment and your process to suit your needs to a tee. Chuck |
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Post by fernwood on Sept 11, 2018 7:49:04 GMT -5
Great inventions you have. Also the grit process. Leave it to an engineer. I have worked as an engineer and been responsible for dialing in some seriously complicated industrial processes. It is a love of mine. This tumbling process has been a real challenge. Right at home in my leisure. And have been amazed at how much the tumbling process could be improved. I may not be Mr. Popular because I speak my mind but experimentation often leads to facts no one else wants to hear. I want to be objective and honest in my findings. This engineer at heart loves your analytical mind and descriptions. Also like how you describe things in a way that is easier for those who are not as analytical to understand. You are an inspiration for others and can guide them to tweek their own equipment to best meet their needs. |
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Post by oregon on Sept 11, 2018 10:51:14 GMT -5
Atlanta, sigh the easy access to all things industrial - Can you post the source for your HDPE fittings here so it'll be easier to find someday as well? thx jamesp |
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 11, 2018 11:42:03 GMT -5
Atlanta, sigh the easy access to all things industrial - Can you post the source for your HDPE fittings here so it'll be easier to find someday as well? thx jamespWe used to grow cotton, things have changed. CAVCO in Birmingham Alabama. Also Consolidated Piping(all over the US) hdpepipeco.com/HDPE_Fittings.htmlTry to get sch 17. sch 11 will work but it is really thick. I bought the end cap and 6x4 reducer for 6 inch jars and 8x6 reducer for 8 inch jars. The 6 and 8 inch are the inside diameters I believe. Best to use a teflon coated fry pan for welding but not totally necessary. |
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 11, 2018 11:46:17 GMT -5
I have worked as an engineer and been responsible for dialing in some seriously complicated industrial processes. It is a love of mine. This tumbling process has been a real challenge. Right at home in my leisure. And have been amazed at how much the tumbling process could be improved. I may not be Mr. Popular because I speak my mind but experimentation often leads to facts no one else wants to hear. I want to be objective and honest in my findings. This engineer at heart loves your analytical mind and descriptions. Also like how you describe things in a way that is easier for those who are not as analytical to understand. You are an inspiration for others and can guide them to tweek their own equipment to best meet their needs. Thanks for those words Beth. Communication is key, gotta have it. If you tinker with gadgets constantly the words come easy I suppose. |
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 11, 2018 12:01:17 GMT -5
Always impressed by your innovations jamesp. No doubt that you have customized your equipment and your process to suit your needs to a tee. Chuck Thanks for the words Chuck. I like it simple, cheap and efficient. I recommend these easy open barrels and the use of slurry thickener to all that tumble rocks. The super coarse grit only for those with HDPE barrels. High RPM's for coarse grind only for those with HDPE barrels. I had trouble with the Lortone 12 pound barrel leaking at 70 to 90 RPM. And the cover seal wearing to fast on the Thumler using the super coarse grit. |
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Post by Pat on Sept 11, 2018 12:45:33 GMT -5
jamesp you are the super fast coarse grind system KING!
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Post by rockpickerforever on Sept 11, 2018 13:00:30 GMT -5
jamesp you are the super fast coarse grind system KING! Yes, he is! He is also "simple, cheap and efficient." Leastwise, that's what he says he likes. You go, jamesp. Keep marching to that different drummer! And I don't think this statement you made is true: "I may not be Mr. Popular because I speak my mind but experimentation often leads to facts no one else wants to hear." It is what makes you, you! Don't change a thing, or be someone you are not. |
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pizzano
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Post by pizzano on Sept 11, 2018 18:04:26 GMT -5
Awesome application of HDPE pipe material......!
I really like the practical approach James........your engineering aptitude has shined through again....!
Often considered a way to increase the tumble volume of the dual 3lb - 4"x 4" barrel rotary's I use.......your application could very well make that happen for me. Seems one dedicated HDPE barrel applied to a dual could increase the grinding effectiveness and possibly speed-up the rough grinding process considerably, even only running at + 40rpms..........doesn't appear weight would be an issue if restricted to + 6lbs of media and stone.
I have access to scrap HDPE in various diameters, as well as bell type couplings and end caps..........the stuff is tossed aside at many construction sites I work at.
Thanks for stimulating my old gray matter again....!
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surreality
starting to spend too much on rocks
is picking up too many rocks at the beach again
Member since January 2012
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Post by surreality on Sept 11, 2018 18:40:07 GMT -5
I have to agree with rockpickerforever here -- these experiments are the kind of thing that provides useful advances, innovations, and improvements for everybody to learn from! |
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Post by rockpickerforever on Sept 11, 2018 18:58:07 GMT -5
See James, don't discount yourself. You ARE Mr. Popularity!
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 11, 2018 20:51:16 GMT -5
Well thanks for the words guys.
Fast speeds in a bulletproof barrel using coarser grit will flat grind some rocks fast IF you add fresh grit more often say every 2-3 days.
Yes @pizanno you can build you a couple of 8-10 pound 6" barrels and grind a bunch of rocks in a hurry.
The Fernco's makes it inviting to add grit every couple of days being so quick and easy to remove/clean/replace.
At the higher RPM you will be surprised how fine the coarse grit becomes if you let it run longer say a week the last grit addition for skipping the 220 step.
It all happens faster.
I don't notice much difference in grinding speed with barrel at 70% or 85% fill at the higher speeds which means 15% more rocks finished per load.
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rockbiter
having dreams about rocks
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Post by rockbiter on Nov 2, 2019 19:36:25 GMT -5
jamesp How are your home-made barrels holding up to the heavy duty SiC. I know the Plastic(HDPE?) is resistant to wear, just curious how they are doing with the over-sized SiC. They are wicked Henry. The internal weld bead is still there. In one of the highest wear zones in the barrel. They also clean well being polyethylene since it is so slick. Love those Fernco caps for the 30 second grit additions every couple of days. Think about this, I spent $1000 dollars on 8 barrels and 10 years worth of coarse SiC running 50 to 100 pounds of rock/glass. I could have built 3 barrels and purchased 300 pounds of coarse SiC for about $350. That would last (guessing) 10 years running those 3 barrels full-time. Before I would spend $110 for 50 pounds of SiC 30 every 6 months. Coarse grind is x10 the most costly part of tumbling. I really think I have the coarse grind figured to a tee. And there is no need to do 90 RPM, 30 does fine. I tumble so much glass, it is shaped fine after 48 hours, 72 starts to remove too much material. I even re-use the slurry and the abrasive because there is abrasive left after only 2 days. Then I roll it in SiC 500/30 RPM which surprisingly will remove too much glass and certainly removes the monster abrasions form the #4 grit. After 3 days in SiC 500 it is straight to the vibes. how does the HDPE compare to the PVC? I started collecting materials for PVC barrels before I saw your more recent threads about HDPE. I may try to return them if the HDPE is significantly better. Where do you get your HDPE fittings? |
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