pizzano
Cave Dweller 
Member since February 2018
Posts: 1,390
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Post by pizzano on Jan 8, 2020 16:49:06 GMT -5
Was out on a ride this morning along one of my favorite trails in the Angelus Oaks area, next to one of the streams that runs about 4' deep and 8' wide during the Winter and Spring months..........It's generated by Big Bear lake area snow fall. Anyway, I always take a look around for rocks, along the banks, when I'm taking a breather (which is often)....lol Came across this little gem that was just sitting up out of the mud, kind-of sparkling in the sun under the tree canopies, noticed it was metallic the size of a ping-pong ball, pretty heavy for it's size......got it home and once I discovered it wasn't magnetic and NOT gold....lol......cleaned it up with a muriatic acid solution. It had the Pyrite features and colors.....bluish/red/purple tarnish hue, but not flaky, once cleaned most of the tarnish came off, and I lost some of the pretty colors (my bad).....So I looked it up and believe it's Chalcopyrite. Here's some pic's from my Nikon, under a 50 watt Halogen......playing with the white balance and manually focused....:     Can it be polished or does/will the Beilby effect (https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/286525.pdf) prevent it from ever really developing a stone type shine/gloss since (because) of it's metallic chemistry.........? |
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AzRockGeek
has rocks in the head
Member since September 2016
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Post by AzRockGeek on Jan 8, 2020 17:00:42 GMT -5
Wrap some copper wire around it a few times and throw in in a jar of white vinegar for a few hours, you will get the peacock colors back.
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Jan 8, 2020 19:43:36 GMT -5
You can polish it. It's not going to be a wet polish, but it will be shiny. Use Zam with a buff. Then you can let it oxidize again and have pretty colors.  |
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Post by rockjunquie on Jan 8, 2020 20:00:12 GMT -5
Wrap some copper wire around it a few times and throw in in a jar of white vinegar for a few hours, you will get the peacock colors back. Will that work with covellite, too? |
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pizzano
Cave Dweller
Member since February 2018
Posts: 1,390
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Post by pizzano on Jan 9, 2020 11:24:35 GMT -5
Wrap some copper wire around it a few times and throw in in a jar of white vinegar for a few hours, you will get the peacock colors back. Will that work with covellite, too? I doubt it would have the same effect since Covellite's main element is copper, whereas, Chalcopyrite has three elements that stand-out, Zinc, Copper and Sulfur with a splash of Iron......both are sulfides. but Covellite does not become as magnetic as Chalcopyrite when heated, that condition may be why Copper will have such a dramatic effect on the Chalcopyrite when charged with an acid.........jsut a thought. |
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pizzano
Cave Dweller
Member since February 2018
Posts: 1,390
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Post by pizzano on Jan 24, 2020 11:53:39 GMT -5
Wrap some copper wire around it a few times and throw in in a jar of white vinegar for a few hours, you will get the peacock colors back. Tried that trick last night.......here's what changed overnight......:   The lighting doesn't show the orange/red colors well.......but it's "pretty" again..! |
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Post by rockjunquie on Jan 24, 2020 16:00:59 GMT -5
Very cool!
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Jan 24, 2020 17:14:46 GMT -5
Turned out pretty! I would leave it as it is.
I'm going to try the vinegar trick on a piece of Apache Gold and see if anything happens.
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AzRockGeek
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Member since September 2016
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Post by AzRockGeek on Jan 24, 2020 17:42:36 GMT -5
That turned out nice. Here are a few pics of some Apache Gold I played with a few years back. I think I soaked the sphere for a few days.    |
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Jan 24, 2020 17:45:38 GMT -5
Wow! I'm going to do that. The sphere is amazing.
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AzRockGeek
has rocks in the head
Member since September 2016
Posts: 703
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Post by AzRockGeek on Jan 24, 2020 17:48:54 GMT -5
The finish is only on surface, so if your doing a cab shape it first or you will grind through the patina.
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Jan 24, 2020 18:27:53 GMT -5
The finish is only on surface, so if your doing a cab shape it first or you will grind through the patina. I have some cabs already finished. I'll plunk them in some vinegar and see what happens. Thanks for the advice! |
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pizzano
Cave Dweller
Member since February 2018
Posts: 1,390
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Post by pizzano on Jan 24, 2020 20:54:35 GMT -5
Turned out pretty! I would leave it as it is.
I'm going to try the vinegar trick on a piece of Apache Gold and see if anything happens.
Don't forget the copper wire wrap......lol |
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Post by rockjunquie on Jan 28, 2020 9:16:47 GMT -5
I did an experiment on covellite. It didn't work.  |
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pizzano
Cave Dweller
Member since February 2018
Posts: 1,390
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Post by pizzano on Jan 28, 2020 11:27:39 GMT -5
I did an experiment on covellite. It didn't work. It was an educated guess, now I'm wondering about the Apache Gold........given the lack of "magnetic" properties it possess as well.....?.......Acids combined with conductive properties (heat & electric transfer), often generate magnetic fields, which cause corrosion. My ex-father-in-law used to work for Santa Fe R/R in the electric shops reconditioning the batteries for the diesel/electric locomotives used in mining. We had long discussions related to conductivity/corrosion/heat transfer and the lengths of safety requirements they went through when dealing with copper/tin/iron/sulfur's.........mining vehicles were maintenance nightmares. That's back in the 70'sand 80's.........I'm sure today it's a little different story since acids aren't used in modern locomotive batteries. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2020 14:43:26 GMT -5
Just a comment about acids and metal-bearing material: it is possible to start a chain reaction (known as "metal disease") that will eventually destroy a piece from within, even if you temporarily get a nice effect. This seems to particularly affect sulfides (including pyrite, marcasite, chalcopyrite, etc.), as I've seen for myself over the years. It can also occur with silver alloys and other metals - basically unstoppable without toxic chemicals and/or special equipment. Not saying you shouldn't experiment, but there are tried-and-true methods that work to achieve certain effects on certain metals (e.g., liver of sulfur on copper or silver), while others can be pungent disasters-in-waiting. Some pieces go for a decade without noticeable changes, while yet others start to deteriorate noticeably within several months - just the variability in the composition of natural ores.
If natural color is what is desired, you might prefer a solid piece of actual bornite, which quickly acquires those colors upon exposure to air, rather than attempting to treat chalcopyrite to mimic the look of bornite. Bornite does need to be buffed with a polishing cloth occasionally to keep its colors. But for treating chalcopyrite, better IMO to just lightly dab the surface with something like Super Iron Out or vinegar than to soak, just to prevent acid from seeping into any porous areas and continuing the reaction from the inside-out.
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Post by rockjunquie on Jan 28, 2020 14:51:24 GMT -5
Just a comment about acids and metal-bearing material: it is possible to start a chain reaction (known as "metal disease") that will eventually destroy a piece from within, even if you temporarily get a nice effect. This seems to particularly affect sulfides (including pyrite, marcasite, chalcopyrite, etc.), as I've seen for myself over the years. It can also occur with silver alloys and other metals - basically unstoppable without toxic chemicals and/or special equipment. Not saying you shouldn't experiment, but there are tried-and-true methods that work to achieve certain effects on certain metals (e.g., liver of sulfur on copper or silver), while others can be pungent disasters-in-waiting. Some pieces go for a decade without noticeable changes, while yet others start to deteriorate noticeably within several months - just the variability in the composition of natural ores. If natural color is what is desired, you might prefer a solid piece of actual bornite, which quickly acquires those colors upon exposure to air, rather than attempting to treat chalcopyrite to mimic the look of bornite. Bornite does need to be buffed with a polishing cloth occasionally to keep its colors. But for treating chalcopyrite, better IMO to just lightly dab the surface with something like Super Iron Out or vinegar than to soak, just to prevent acid from seeping into any porous areas and continuing the reaction from the inside-out. This may not be related, but we had an old Renault (R-12) that had a notorious problem with rust where the fender met the door column. Seems that galvanized metal was used against steel (or something like that.. my memory isn't what it used to be) and it cause a reaction. The decay could not be stopped, you had to remove one or the other. Anyway, speaking of chain reactions reminded me. |
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AzRockGeek
has rocks in the head
Member since September 2016
Posts: 703
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Post by AzRockGeek on Jan 28, 2020 14:59:26 GMT -5
Just a comment about acids and metal-bearing material: it is possible to start a chain reaction (known as "metal disease") that will eventually destroy a piece from within, even if you temporarily get a nice effect. This seems to particularly affect sulfides (including pyrite, marcasite, chalcopyrite, etc.), as I've seen for myself over the years. It can also occur with silver alloys and other metals - basically unstoppable without toxic chemicals and/or special equipment. Not saying you shouldn't experiment, but there are tried-and-true methods that work to achieve certain effects on certain metals (e.g., liver of sulfur on copper or silver), while others can be pungent disasters-in-waiting. Some pieces go for a decade without noticeable changes, while yet others start to deteriorate noticeably within several months - just the variability in the composition of natural ores. If natural color is what is desired, you might prefer a solid piece of actual bornite, which quickly acquires those colors upon exposure to air, rather than attempting to treat chalcopyrite to mimic the look of bornite. Bornite does need to be buffed with a polishing cloth occasionally to keep its colors. But for treating chalcopyrite, better IMO to just lightly dab the surface with something like Super Iron Out or vinegar than to soak, just to prevent acid from seeping into any porous areas and continuing the reaction from the inside-out. Thanks for the great info. I made that sphere back in 2012, and it was gifted shortly after that, so I have no idea how well it held up. But, I do have that slab still around and it shows no sighs of deterioration. Would I do it again? Yes! |
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Post by rockjunquie on Jan 28, 2020 15:01:21 GMT -5
Just a comment about acids and metal-bearing material: it is possible to start a chain reaction (known as "metal disease") that will eventually destroy a piece from within, even if you temporarily get a nice effect. This seems to particularly affect sulfides (including pyrite, marcasite, chalcopyrite, etc.), as I've seen for myself over the years. It can also occur with silver alloys and other metals - basically unstoppable without toxic chemicals and/or special equipment. Not saying you shouldn't experiment, but there are tried-and-true methods that work to achieve certain effects on certain metals (e.g., liver of sulfur on copper or silver), while others can be pungent disasters-in-waiting. Some pieces go for a decade without noticeable changes, while yet others start to deteriorate noticeably within several months - just the variability in the composition of natural ores. If natural color is what is desired, you might prefer a solid piece of actual bornite, which quickly acquires those colors upon exposure to air, rather than attempting to treat chalcopyrite to mimic the look of bornite. Bornite does need to be buffed with a polishing cloth occasionally to keep its colors. But for treating chalcopyrite, better IMO to just lightly dab the surface with something like Super Iron Out or vinegar than to soak, just to prevent acid from seeping into any porous areas and continuing the reaction from the inside-out. Thanks for the great info. I made that sphere back in 2012, and it was gifted shortly after that, so I have no idea how well it held up. But, I do have that slab still around and it shows no sighs of deterioration. Would I do it again? Yes! You said it only takes a few hours right? What if you soaked it in water first and then gave it a quick acid bath. That might decrease chances of anything getting in too deep. |
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AzRockGeek
has rocks in the head
Member since September 2016
Posts: 703
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Post by AzRockGeek on Jan 28, 2020 15:21:30 GMT -5
The sphere I soaked for a day or two, I later found that if you wrap the object with bare copper wire, it reacts much quicker, hours time frame. R2D would be better to answer your question on a quick acid bath, much more knowledgeable then me. Keep in mind, I don't sell rocks or finished goods, this was for my own personal enjoyment.
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