sheriam
starting to shine!
Member since December 2019
Posts: 34
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Post by sheriam on Feb 13, 2020 4:53:12 GMT -5
Hi everybody I am Kris, from Germany. I just introduced myself and asked some questions, but was adviced to open an extra thread for these. So her goes:
I ran the first patch over the past week, and I noticed a couple of things: 1. Smaller stones (smaller than 2 inches) were mostly gone, by the time I finished the first three stages (10 days each). So, do I adjust the duration of each stage according to the size of the stones? 2. My stones seem to acquire a lot of grooves during tumbling, and also some cracks. What am I doing wrong?
Add. info: I have a Lortone 3A, I ran each step for 10 days, adding 2 to 3 tb grit, as recommended. I used different rocks in various shapes and sizes, I don't know whether they were of the same hardness or not.
I did not use ceramic fillers or any other kind of fillers, as I can't seem to get them here in Germany (see below). I just reduced the water, when the rocks no longer came up to 1/2, as adviced in the user manual
My other questions concern logistics: For some reason it is near impossible to purchase the aluminum oxide for the last step in Germany, and shiping from the US is costly. The same goes for the ceramic fillers. Does anyone know, where I can get them for a reasonable prize?
And lastly, if there is anybody else from Germany, do you know of any great sites to go rock hunting in Southern Germany?
Puh, sorry for all the questions. Looking forward to a lively exchange
Kris
p.s. I read that you like pics here, so this is a pic of my favorite stone in the first batch so far. It was just a pretty stone I found near a lake and decided to throw in with the others. I love how it turned out
bit.ly/2UMBVkd
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Post by fernwood on Feb 13, 2020 5:07:59 GMT -5
Welcome to RTH.
The rocks that "disappeared" may have been too soft to tumble with harder ones.
You can make your own ceramic and plastic filler. I know some who break old toilets or ceramic dishes. Then tumble them some before using. Just enough to remove the sharp edges. Others cut apart plastic hangers for plastic filler.
I have never tried the above, but others say they work great.
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sheriam
starting to shine!
Member since December 2019
Posts: 34
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Post by sheriam on Feb 13, 2020 5:10:31 GMT -5
Oh, thanks, fernwood, maybe I can try that. Do you know whether I could also use some random small stones as fillers, that I find outside?
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Post by joshuamcduffie on Feb 13, 2020 9:06:59 GMT -5
sheriam, I think fernwood is correct, you may have a mix of softer and harder stones, which is causing the extreme losses of the softer stones. Try to make up a batch of similar hardness stones. Where in Germany are you located? You might search for a lapidary or rock club in your area.
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Post by manofglass on Feb 13, 2020 9:22:16 GMT -5
Welcome to the forum from Michigan
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sheriam
starting to shine!
Member since December 2019
Posts: 34
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Post by sheriam on Feb 13, 2020 10:13:36 GMT -5
Thanks everybody So, Joshuamcduffie, how do I know the hardness of the stones. I am totally new at this, and I also want to polish random stones that I find around here, for example
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gatorflash1
spending too much on rocks
Active in Delaware Mineralogical Society, Cabchon Grinding and Polishing, 2 Thumlers B's and a UV-18
Member since October 2018
Posts: 375
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Post by gatorflash1 on Feb 13, 2020 13:27:31 GMT -5
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sheriam
starting to shine!
Member since December 2019
Posts: 34
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Post by sheriam on Feb 13, 2020 14:38:34 GMT -5
Thanks, gatorflash1, I'll definitely take a look at the book and the website. I read a few other threads and it keeps coming up as a great resource. And wow, there is a german-gemstone-route? Never heard of that. I hope I'll be able to check it out soon
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Post by joshuamcduffie on Feb 13, 2020 15:17:47 GMT -5
Thanks everybody So, Joshuamcduffie, how do I know the hardness of the stones. I am totally new at this, and I also want to polish random stones that I find around here, for example sheriam , you could do a scratch test Scratch Test Explanation but over time you'll figure out which stones tumble well together, and which ones don't. There's a "Gem Trail" in Germany that I was able to travel a portion of. There's a "German Gemstone Road" you might want to research. It's not too far from you, maybe a few hours, and you could get a great idea of what is out there to look for. www.edelsteinland.de/de/index.html
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Post by pauls on Feb 13, 2020 15:50:23 GMT -5
Welcome from Australia. The easiest way to do a scratch test to check for suitable stones for tumbling is with a piece of Quartz, if Quartz easily scratches it then it is probably too soft, Some softer stones can be polished but it really requires some additional techniques.If Quartz doesn't scratch it or scratches it with a lot of pressure then it should be hard enough. You can scratch Quartz with Quartz but not easily. Another thing to avoid is grainy stones like sandstone, try to gather things that have a nice hard smooth feel on a broken edge. Notice I said a broken edge, some really suitable stones often have a rough rind that you need to check under. Agate can be like this and have really rough bumpy exterior but nice inside. Most of the best stones for tumbling are in the Quartz family, Jasper, Agate, Flint, Petrified wood, Amethyst etc. Try getting some of these.
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Post by knave on Feb 13, 2020 15:59:50 GMT -5
Thanks everybody So, Joshuamcduffie, how do I know the hardness of the stones. I am totally new at this, and I also want to polish random stones that I find around here, for example sheriam , you could do a scratch test Scratch Test Explanation but over time you'll figure out which stones tumble well together, and which ones don't. There's a "Gem Trail" in Germany that I was able to travel a portion of. There's a "German Gemstone Road" you might want to research. It's not too far from you, maybe a few hours, and you could get a great idea of what is out there to look for. www.edelsteinland.de/de/index.html
I was hoping you would show up Joshua.
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Post by knave on Feb 13, 2020 16:01:08 GMT -5
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Post by rmf on Feb 13, 2020 16:21:52 GMT -5
sheriam First learn hardness. Look up Mohs scale of hardness. It is a simple relative hardness test. 1 - Talc 2 - Gypsum-selenite 3 - Calcite 4 - Fluorite 5 - Apatite 6 - Orthoclase 7 - Quartz 8 - Topaz 9 - Corundum 10 - Diamond Make your self a kit to test rocks. (your finger nail about mohs 2.5, so it will scratch Talc and Gypsum) Next a pocket knife (about hardness of 5 similar to normal window glass) usually rocks less than 5 are not tumbled unless special care is taken and for sure do not tumble these when starting out. Softer rocks are harder to get a good polish on so wait until you understand the process and can diagnose your problems. Next get a piece of quartz, agate, flint or chert. this is hardness of 7 on mohs scale. Learn rock tumbling with rocks that are about here normally agates and jaspers. They are hard and take a good polish generally. Match the hardness of the rocks in your tumbler otherwise soft ones grind away too fast(as you discovered). Small filler rocks need to be the same hardness as the larger ones and you should have about 35% 1cm or less to cushion the larger rocks. Tumble in coarse until they are as rounded as you like. The next steps medium and fine do not need to run 10 days. Usually no more than 7. their only purpose is to grind off the scratches from the previous grit. Polish should also take about a week (5-10 days). Quartz/chert landscaping rock is a good source of filler. Ceramic pellets can be made from broken china and the size can be fine tuned with a hammer. Also, Ceramic bathroom tile is a good source. good polishes for tumbling include tripoli, unitain (TiO2), Cerium oxide. Check if there is a place that sells metal cleaning abrasives and see if they can order aluminum Oxide from them. It needs to be -3000 mesh to be a polish. finer is better.
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sheriam
starting to shine!
Member since December 2019
Posts: 34
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Post by sheriam on Feb 13, 2020 17:03:41 GMT -5
Thanks guys, I have bookmarked the Mohs Hardness Scale on rocktumbler.com. Then I stopped my tumbler and took a close look. Turns out the "hardest" stone I could determine was a carnelian (7). All the others were soft stones (argh). Fluorite, apatite, jade. Should ask questions first and tumble later. Well, I guess my first free tumble will just have to be an adventure^^ Anyway, I resigned to finishin this "soft rock tumble" and probably get a less than ideal tumble, as I am sure I will learn a lot along the way. So I took the carnelian out, since it was the only one harder than 5. Then I took the apatite, which was the hardest of the remaining known stones, and used it to scratch-test the other stones, which were mostly river pebbles. I took away all that did not scratch, and startet it up again. Now the waiting begins
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Post by joshuamcduffie on Feb 13, 2020 19:46:52 GMT -5
Good luck!
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Post by As I in does tries! on Feb 14, 2020 3:11:04 GMT -5
Greetings sheriam, unfortunately most if not all stones below Moh's 5.0 a polish will be nothing more than a silk finish with no high gloss shine whatsoever! That shop in Germany should be able to get Lortone Aluminum Oxide polish as well anything within the Lortone catalogue as they are a Lortone Dealer, also ask them about rock and lapidary clubs too!
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sheriam
starting to shine!
Member since December 2019
Posts: 34
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Post by sheriam on Feb 14, 2020 5:41:03 GMT -5
Greetings sheriam, unfortunately most if not all stones below Moh's 5.0 a polish will be nothing more than a silk finish with no high gloss shine whatsoever! That shop in Germany should be able to get Lortone Aluminum Oxide polish as well anything within the Lortone catalogue as they are a Lortone Dealer, also ask them about rock and lapidary clubs too! Ah! And I bought my Lortone in the US *facepalm* That's a great idea, I'll ask them. I did a google search for rock and lapidary clubs, but couldn't find any
Thanks
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sheriam
starting to shine!
Member since December 2019
Posts: 34
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Post by sheriam on Feb 17, 2020 12:47:36 GMT -5
So, I hatched a few more questions^^ 1. I read in a few posts that some of you reuse the leftover SiC after cleanout. Also that some of you reuse old slurry to thicken their current slurry. So how do you harvest these (leftover SiC and old slurry)? 2. Since for various reasons (mostly for being running headlong into things without reading first) I am currently running a "soft stone tumble": Can I use the (SiC?) ceramic fillers or will they chip my stones? 3. I have a few that stones I haven't identified, and I am unsure as to whether they can be tumbled or not:
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sheriam
starting to shine!
Member since December 2019
Posts: 34
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Post by sheriam on Feb 17, 2020 12:49:44 GMT -5
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sheriam
starting to shine!
Member since December 2019
Posts: 34
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Post by sheriam on Feb 17, 2020 12:51:12 GMT -5
What about cracked open agates like this one, can they be tumbled
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