Enigman
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since December 2013
Posts: 163
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Post by Enigman on Nov 25, 2020 14:40:06 GMT -5
Hi All,
I have been tumbling with Lortone rotary tumblers for many years. Long ago I started doing all my final polish stages in Diamond Pacific MT4 vibe machines because I was having little success with rotary polishing the final stages. In rotary's I was plagued with edge impact damage over and over or just plain poor final polish. So I gave up and went to vibes for final polish and that has worked well. However, I have 45 pounds of rotary capacity feeding 12 pounds of vibe capacity and everything is backlogged to oblivion. I need to expand my final polish capacity and with the COVID issues, Diamond Pacific is not offering any new equipment. Therefore, I need to go back to using rotary tumblers to augment my final polishing needs.
So I am asking all of you for your best most successful recipes for loading rotary barrels for a successful final polish.
My rotary machines:
2 x Lortone QT66 1 x Lortone QT6 2 x Lortone 45C 3 x Lortone 33B
I am looking for recipes of media, grit and loading specific to those barrels in 6, 4.5 and 3 pound sizes. I tumble a range of rough hardness from Mohs 5 to 8 (never mixed).
Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.
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Post by Mel on Nov 25, 2020 21:34:22 GMT -5
For final polish in my QT66, I fill it about an inch, inch and a half below the top. I use a fair amount of ceramic filler, a couple cubes of homemade soap, and 4-5 tablespoons titanium dioxide. Works great, however the TD is from a rock shop that had it in stock from eons ago, and doesn't seem to be available now (and also mildly carcinogenic with long term exposure so....). The only real issue I have is that I can't buy another QT66 yet. I've got some 3 micron alumina on order though, and have high hopes. I'll share some results when it comes in.
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Enigman
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since December 2013
Posts: 163
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Post by Enigman on Nov 25, 2020 22:12:00 GMT -5
... I fill it about an inch, inch and a half below the top. I use a fair amount of ceramic filler, a couple cubes of homemade soap, and 4-5 tablespoons titanium dioxide... Thanks for that.
That's basically what I was doing except for the soap chunks. I used about an 1/8 cup of Borax for degassing. Grit was aluminum oxide polish. Still had impact problems.
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Post by Mel on Nov 25, 2020 22:19:29 GMT -5
Yeah, impact is because of free space. How's the water level? I've never used borax because I used to make soap and have a stockpile to last until the third apocalypse.
If it's fairly full, what about the water? I use water just to the point I can see it or slightly level with the top of rocks.
I was using plastic as cushioning but I read that some people were seeing microscratches, plus the damn cats kept trying to eat it, and it rolled everywhere, so went to ceramic cylinders (broke them in in stage 1) and never looked back. I think for polish stage overfill might be a better strategy as long as your machine can take it.
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Enigman
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since December 2013
Posts: 163
|
Post by Enigman on Nov 26, 2020 12:34:43 GMT -5
... I was using plastic as cushioning but I read that some people were seeing microscratches, plus the damn cats kept trying to eat it, and it rolled everywhere ... Yeah I tried plastic in various forms. You can get little plastic X's from hardware stores that are used to separate ceramic tiles while they are being installed. They tended to knit together and arrest tumbling motion. Then I tried little plastic beads that were intended for tumbling. HUGE mess. They got everywhere and were tough to separate from the load when you dump out the barrel contents.
What I'm looking for in this thread is that unique "works every time" or "why didn't I think of that" recipe. Otherwise I'll be left to experiment again and waste much time in trial and error.
Thanks.
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Post by aDave on Nov 26, 2020 13:02:05 GMT -5
Here's an old thread of mine with some photos and a post or two about how I finished rocks in a 45C. forum.rocktumblinghobby.com/thread/86625/final-all-rotary-batchesI swear by plastic pellets and used them in all stages after the coarse stage. I saw your comment about separating them from the rocks, and I found that not to be an issue for me since they float. I simply dumped barrel contents into a colander and did a preliminary rinse. Then I poured what was in the colander into a bucket of water. I'd then mix the rocks around with my hand to "release" any trapped pellets and did so until all floated to the surface of the water. From there, I'd simply use a small screen strainer to scoop the pellets from the surface. It was pretty painless at the end of the day.
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Post by greig on Nov 26, 2020 14:07:16 GMT -5
I used to outthink and try special "secret" recipes in stage 4 rotary. White sugar, baking soda, etc along with polish. This caused more grief than worthwhile. Sometimes, I would get gas in the barrel. Never figured out what combo of rock and funky additives caused the gas. Now, I just pay attention to having really clean rock and barrel, adding enough water so the rocks swim rather than crash, add tumbler media to at least 80% full barrel. A few observations: - plastic media floats and I bet it does the same inside the barrel whereas the rocks and ceramic sink, so I prefer ceramic (or a combo thereof). However, I will still use plastic alone if I am short of ceramic, but usually overfill. - The 6 lb Lortone barrel is relatively narrow when in the tumbler, compared to 1.5 lb, 3 lb or 12 lb barrels. This may be a concern when tumbling fragile rocks or large slices. During a tumble, I prefer a wider bottom (insert joke here). - One or more large rocks in a tumble can result in bruising or crushing, especially if not enough water or media.
One more thing. 2+ weeks in stage 4 gives better results on +6 Mohs rocks than the standard 1 week
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Post by aDave on Nov 26, 2020 14:58:32 GMT -5
A few observations: - plastic media floats and I bet it does the same inside the barrel whereas the rocks and ceramic sink, so I prefer ceramic (or a combo thereof). However, I will still use plastic alone if I am short of ceramic, but usually overfill. One more thing. 2+ weeks in stage 4 gives better results on +6 Mohs rocks than the standard 1 week I don't think pellets floating with a contained space (barrel) is an issue IMHO. I could see it potentially happening if a minimal amount was being used, but I'm using them to take up space/volume and fill the barrel quite well. I would typically put down a layer of rocks and then add plastic pellets to just about cover that layer. Then add another layer of rocks and cover with pellets...and continue repeating until I filled the barrel to about 75%. When water was added, the pellets really didn't do much since there was so much used. You're spot-on with your comment about extended polishing time, and I agree wholeheartedly. My polish stage ran for three weeks non-stop. To me, there was a noticeable difference even above two weeks.
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Enigman
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since December 2013
Posts: 163
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Post by Enigman on Nov 26, 2020 16:45:59 GMT -5
... Never figured out what combo of rock and funky additives caused the gas ... Actually, gas production is a normal part of the grinding process, especially with obsidian and glass. Without something like Borax or soap to mitigate the gas pressure it can blow the lid off of the barrel, most commonly with Thumler barrels. Not so much a problem with vibes since they rarely have sealed lids.
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