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Post by Cher on Dec 3, 2005 16:04:03 GMT -5
I am so upset I could cry, I was sooooo excited about this load and so impatient waiting for it. (See newbies, even the oldies can get impatient.) I opened this barrel this morning, expecting to find things well on their way to being nicely shaped AND expecting to be able to move on some of my slabs. NOT!!! Is there such a thing as bad grit? This is a new 25 lb bag that I'm using and so far it seems that every one of the loads I've done have ended up like this after a week. AND I've been going down and shaking them to help keep them stirred up. My first clue when I lifted the cover off.  I dumped out the load to find this.  Bottom of the barrel  Close-up, look at the size of this grit after 7 days.  Another close-up.  You can see how rough the rock still is (and the size of the grit).  The load washed off, not much shaping here.  Another view of how rough the rock is.  Look at the pointed edge on the center rock, that should have been rounded off more by now. This is Flint Ridge Flint so harder than agate, I don't know but there were a few lakers in here too.  There's a good variety of different sizes and shapes of rock in here and for the most part, common hardness. I have another 3 lb barrel with obsidian in, some small cut slabs, others rough cracked shapes. I went 3 freakin' weeks with that one doing the same darn thing and barely shaping up the obsidian or apache tears that are in there. I've got a 6 pounder ready to open but I'm afraid to. I don't know what I'll do if that one is the same as this. Other than freak out. Oh yeah, the barrel was about 2/3rds full and consisted of flint, agates, quartzy stuff, mookite, jasper and pet wood. All stuff I've tumbled together before without any problems. *sigh* I guess I might as well go down and open the big one to find out whether or not it's doing anything. So Gurus ... Any thoughts? Any suggestions? |
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Post by krazydiamond on Dec 3, 2005 16:09:17 GMT -5
i've had that happen now and then, not consistently tho as you describe. i chalked it up to not chaging the barrel properly or having a rabid foamer in the mix (like some jasper or obsidian will do). try adding some borax into the mix, Cher, see if that has any effect in making better slurry. or try adding some smaller pea sized fillers in....
that is all i can come up with at the moment.....
KD
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Post by Alice on Dec 3, 2005 16:12:54 GMT -5
that happens to me when I over load the barrel.
Doesn't seem to be your case though
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joanna
spending too much on rocks
Member since November 2004
Posts: 385
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Post by joanna on Dec 3, 2005 16:36:17 GMT -5
What you haven't seen that happen before!!  Every so often this happens to me also (I agree, very frustrating). Seems it mainly occurs in the 3 pound barrels and only with the 60/90. I'd reuse the grit in the 15 pound tumblers and had no problem with it breaking down, so it wasn't the grit. Ever since I've been adding borax with the grit I haven't seen this happen anymore. (fingers crossed) |
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Post by Cher on Dec 3, 2005 16:57:43 GMT -5
Yes, I've seen it happen before, way back when I first started tumbling. It happened only one time so I guess I've been very lucky. This has been happening to me all month in the 3 pound barrels but I did just check the big barrel, same grit and it was gone. I did add some borax this time to both of the 3 pound barrels that have been giving me grief so we'll see if it helps.
I was so relieved to see the 6 pounder had no grit left in it and I was able to take quite a bit out for 120. Still don't have enough yet to do a load in the 6 pound barrel so maybe in another week or so. I've got that big ol' rock of Bill's (icetres) ready to move on but can only do it in the big barrel so that's why I was so disappointed that I couldn't move anything on.
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WyckedWyre
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since April 2007
Posts: 1,391
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Post by WyckedWyre on Dec 3, 2005 21:49:03 GMT -5
That's happened to me before, as well. I don't think it's a grit issue. I had that problem with some lace agate, and with some Apache Tears. Haven't been able to figure it out. Barrel too full? Rocks not sized properly?Too much grit? Not enough water? Tumbler turning too slow? Not sure - hope it doesn't happen again!  S |
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Post by rockds on Dec 4, 2005 2:27:18 GMT -5
It has happened to me also, rocks were all the same size - not your problem. It does make you mad, at least it did me and its got to be worse if you don't know why.
robert
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rollingstone
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since July 2009
Posts: 236
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Post by rollingstone on Dec 4, 2005 3:12:32 GMT -5
I don't think the problem is the grit -- since so much of it is left after a week it is obviously nice tough grit. I'm pretty much at a loss to explain it. I wonder if it wouldn't help to go larger instead of smaller -- get rid of the smaller stones, leaving only the larger ones in the barrel. The big stones might be better at scouring the grit/mud mix from the sides of the barrel and keeping it suspended. Just a thought.
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SteveHolmes
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since July 2009
Posts: 1,900
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Post by SteveHolmes on Dec 4, 2005 3:59:12 GMT -5
Cher,
Had that happen to me as well..just the other day. My thoughts were that I had either too big of rocks in my 3lb'er or I added to much grit. I'm tumbling Crazy Lace, and I reloaded it, and it's running again for 10 days. We'll see if this shapes up the rocks any better...but my first thought was, I had a few to bigger sized rocks in it. Don't get too frustrated...it sounds like it's happened to quite a few of us. Good-luck, and keep us posted.
Steve
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Post by creativeminded on Dec 4, 2005 10:41:48 GMT -5
I would say you are putting too much grit or not enough water, there is some break down of the grit because your slurry is grey in color. I tried following the rule of thumb 1 TBSP per pound and found out that after 2 weeks I had alot of unused grit I now use 2 TBSP in my 3# tumbler, I check it after 1 week and if the slurry feels like the grit is almost used up then I will add another 1 TBSP. I currently did that with some Quartz crystals that I started a week ago.
Tami
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Post by Cher on Dec 4, 2005 11:13:33 GMT -5
I've used 3 tablespoons of grit in these barrels since I got them. I've tried more (back when I first started), but there was always some left so I cut back until I landed here. I let my barrels roll for a week minimum, sometimes more and it's always been gone until this new grit and these last few loads. Since the grit in the bigger barrel was all gone, I'm hoping it's the lack of borax which let the foam become an issue. We shall see in four more days which is when the other barrel that's had this problem will be done.
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MichiganRocks
starting to spend too much on rocks
"I wasn't born to follow."
Member since April 2007
Posts: 154
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Post by MichiganRocks on Dec 4, 2005 11:36:58 GMT -5
Hey Cher, I'm not sure what the sizes are of the slabs but here are a few things that I have learned about doing flat slabs or cabs in my rotaries: - I make sure that I have lots of smaller more rounded rocks in with the flat slabs or cabs. Too many flat surfaces rolling around in the barrel will result in very little actual surface contact between the pieces. Hence the smaller rounder rocks.
- Unless the slabs/cabs are fairly small (no more than 1.5 inch at longest) I run them in my Model B. They need room to move, I just fill the barrel to 3/4 full and use lots of padding.
- Try to avoid running any large rocks with the slabs. Their weight is too likely to cause damage to the slabs/cabs.
Just some of the things that work for me, and I've done a lot of slabs in my rotaries. Ron |
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Post by Cher on Dec 4, 2005 12:04:04 GMT -5
Ron, do your Thumler's have the flat sides in them? Almost all of mine are under 1.5 inches but I may have had too many slabs but I thought I had enough irregular pieces in there to make up for it. You mention padding, you talking about pellets?
Cher
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MichiganRocks
starting to spend too much on rocks
"I wasn't born to follow."
Member since April 2007
Posts: 154
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Post by MichiganRocks on Dec 4, 2005 12:14:37 GMT -5
Hey Cher, I use several things for padding. I use the plastic pellets, which I just hate, and I also use tile spacers. I also have a bag of small pieces of Oak that I cut up and sometimes use. I've tried to tumble slabs in my Lortone 45C, but it just doesn't do much of a job unless the slabs/cabs are quite small.
I would use the borax though. I use borax in everything. I was also wondering if maybe a little more water might have helped. If the slurry is too thick, then the rocks stop moving as much. How high did you fill the water?
Ron
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Post by Cher on Dec 4, 2005 12:26:13 GMT -5
There really was no slurry, just muddy gray water. The grit hadn't broken down enough to make any slurry. I had the water maybe 3/8th's of an inch below the top level of the rocks. Should I have had it level?
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MichiganRocks
starting to spend too much on rocks
"I wasn't born to follow."
Member since April 2007
Posts: 154
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Post by MichiganRocks on Dec 4, 2005 12:29:49 GMT -5
Hey Cher, that's an issue I really struggle with. When I am running regular rocks of that kind of hardness, I normally keep the water down below the rock level a bit, as you did. When I'm running a load with slabs/cabs, I have found myself completely covering the rocks with water and it doesn't seem to work better for them. Not sure why, and maybe it's just my imagination. You might try it though with just adding a little more water.
Ron
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Post by xenaswolf on Dec 4, 2005 12:34:13 GMT -5
Well at least I know others have the same trouble as I do, which makes me feel a bit better. I find that is what my barrel looks like almost every time when I use 46/70. I just add a little more water and let it run longer.
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Post by Cher on Dec 4, 2005 12:59:57 GMT -5
Xena, it would drive me nuts if it was happening every time. Maybe you should cut back on the grit if it does. Being that it's coarser grit you might not need as much?
Ron, do you run your cushioning (pellets, tile spacers etc.) right from coarse or starting in the 2nd stage?
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Post by xenaswolf on Dec 4, 2005 13:22:17 GMT -5
Cher it seems with that coarser grit no matter how much or how little I put in, it does that. I just grind my teeth and keep going /sigh
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MichiganRocks
starting to spend too much on rocks
"I wasn't born to follow."
Member since April 2007
Posts: 154
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Post by MichiganRocks on Dec 4, 2005 13:23:43 GMT -5
Hey Cher, I only use it in my 600 grit prepolish stage (I normally let my 600 grit run for at least 10 days, 14 if I can stand the wait), and my polish. I only use it in the 600 stage if I'm doing slabs/cabs. I don't use it when I'm running regular rocks. I run and stockpile rocks at all stages so I have a float between each stage. That way my barrel is always full so I don't need to add pellets just to raise the level. Of course I have boxes of rocks setting all over the place with signs on them saying what they are ready for. My wife (who is Polish) saw one box with the sign, "Ready for polish", and was wondering what I meant that they were ready for "Polish". I grew up in a Polish neighborhood and was made an "honorary Polack" a long time ago so I understood. Made the same mistake myself.  Ron |
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