|
Post by helens on Aug 31, 2013 12:21:42 GMT -5
I would imagine that if there is real doubt which side used chemical warfare, it's a good excuse to let them duke it out. I don't think there's much question that we don't want either side to win in this conflict. Our best course is to help the losing side til they are strong enough to keep it at some more. The war between Iran and Iraq lasted 7 years.
|
|
bushmanbilly
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2008
Posts: 4,719
|
Post by bushmanbilly on Aug 31, 2013 12:49:08 GMT -5
" RIGHT HALF" I would imagine that if there is real doubt which side used chemical warfare, it's a good excuse to let them duke it out. I don't think there's much question that we don't want either side to win in this conflict. " Left half"Our best course is to help the losing side til they are strong enough to keep it at some more. The war between Iran and Iraq lasted 7 years. Wow Helen, the right half of your brain is working today, but then your left half took control again.
|
|
|
Post by helens on Aug 31, 2013 12:50:59 GMT -5
Wow Billy, your brain never works, so if we ever agreed on anything, I'd have to recheck my own logic. Conveniently, I never agree with you.
|
|
bushmanbilly
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2008
Posts: 4,719
|
Post by bushmanbilly on Aug 31, 2013 12:57:23 GMT -5
I agreed with half of your post. To bad there is not a half like button.
The difference between our brains is that yours has no common sense. And when you see one that has common sense, you think it is not working. To much education can be a bad thing if it is taught by the wrong people. ie: progressives and liberals.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2013 13:04:47 GMT -5
Man, don't know if it's true or not but there's a You tube video going around now about a credible BBC/UP reporter's story that the al kaida affiliated rebels are admitting they received chemical weapons from the Saudi's, with no training, and accidentally set them off causing the mass deaths......Mel Mel, How does one "accidentally" set them off and live to tell the tale? I am sure neither you nor I understand how those things are deployed. It just seems top me that one would need to be present to have an "accident".
|
|
Sabre52
Cave Dweller
Me and my gal, Rosie
Member since August 2005
Posts: 20,466
|
Post by Sabre52 on Aug 31, 2013 13:36:38 GMT -5
Scott, according to the BBC story, the rebels were supplied two types of weapons. One description sounds like some kind of shoulder fired missile and the other sounds like some kind of cylinder filled with chemicals. Story said all the rebels ( 20 or so) present in the tunnel or room when the device went off were killed almost instantly then the gas dispersed causing the other deaths. Reporter is quite famous I guess as the story was brought up at the UN press conference. The news story is on you tube if you are interested....Mel
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2013 20:47:40 GMT -5
The rat bastard is going to do it. S P C F C M T George Carlin "the seven words you can not say on TV. Plus a lot more cuss words. Damn I am pissed. I wish I could write here what I really feel. news.yahoo.com/obama-to-make-1-15-p-m--statement-on-syria-161723103.htmlHe/it is ready to go and it looks like he is going to send missiles whether the other dumb asses ok it or not. THIS REALLY SUCKS Jim
|
|
grayfingers
Cave Dweller
Member since November 2007
Posts: 4,575
|
Post by grayfingers on Sept 1, 2013 7:27:08 GMT -5
Glad to see he got cold feet. Yeah, it sucks that we are a country that has often been involved in false flag operations. Makes it tough to trust our own government. From what I see in the international media, Obama is a laughingstock. They see he is not in his element when it all gets real. Putin seems to have it together well, he looks like a statesman in comparison to our guy.
|
|
chassroc
Cave Dweller
Rocks are abundant when you have rocktumblinghobby pals
Member since January 2005
Posts: 3,586
|
Post by chassroc on Sept 1, 2013 10:53:08 GMT -5
You boys have to remember that our side is not a dictatorship.
It is easy to look authoritative when you have no one to answer to. Putin is a hero in Russia for restoring some pride after more reasonable leaders like Gorbachev stood by as the USSR was dissolved and the free war was ended. Putin would never be reasonable in a matter of pride like that...as a result, like Stalin, he looks authoritative. Bush was considered a leader because he was decisive. But being decisive about things you cannot and are not sure of is false leadership. There are very few things in this world that are much more than fifty- fifty. When you are a little boy and a teen, things are black and white, but like people, everything gets gray with age. Very little is wrong and right, most things are somewhere in the middle. Some people like a leader to run whether they fully understand where they are going or not. I do not. I want a leader who realizes the quicksand a decision may lead them do. Unseen at the beginning, but quicksand just the same. Has anything you've seen(in world decisions) in our lifetime brought anything but unforeseen circumstances. It happens over and over and we still don't recognize that it will happen. WW2 was about Germany getting it's pride back and Japan getting an empire...and the USA emerged on top. In Viet Nam we tried to bomb the NVA into submission and it was us who found, just like we found in Korea, just how hard it is to fight a war thousands of miles from home against an enemy that will die before they surrender. In Iraq, we brought shock and awe to a people who wanted no part of it, only to find that the people we fought were not the real enemy. and it brought our economy crashing down to boot.
We have a Democracy and Obama, even after he said I will act if Assad uses chemical weapons, though he wanted to avenge the slight to his name and pride, is swallowing his pride for the good of the country...kind of refreshing given our pre-occupation in family conflicts in the middle east for about two decades now. Yes, leaders around the world from monarchies and dictatorships are laughing at Obama for bowing to the will of the American people instead of acting on impulse. Do we care how Putin views Obama, how the Saudi monarch feels...I dare say we care a tad more about the USA and how the American people feel. We care that we are not the laughing stock of the world over ruining our economy again for the sake of defeating some BAD men in the Middle East.
South Korea is worried over what North Korea will do if we don't punish Assad for using Chemical weapons. If we don't punish Assad, why should they be obligated to prohibiting their usage. But is that a concern to America... enough to punish Assad just because the rest of the world think that shows American weakness. I don't know about you but I think America is pretty strong and certainly whether we do or dont spank Assad has little to do with how I feel about this country.
I am happy if we have a national dialog on this issue. Assad will be there in October, no need to punish him immediately, if at all. Let's decide as a nation where to go with this...Do we become a recluse in the world...do we continue police actions around the world...If we do not act, is it like the appeasement of Hitler as he annexed countries to the fatherland...does inaction make thngs better or worse...Let's decide as a nation, not as the Bush family or the Obama family...let's decide as America where we want to go as a nation. We are sick of war and involvement in things we don't really understand. We protect Japan and Korea and Europe and Israel and Central America. But do we want to continue this course forever. When have we done enough or do we ever. If we are lucky, we can have a national consensus on what to do. If not, we are no worse off than we are as a nation today.
Charlie
We are most
|
|
|
Post by helens on Sept 1, 2013 13:05:46 GMT -5
Glad to see he got cold feet. Yeah, it sucks that we are a country that has often been involved in false flag operations. Makes it tough to trust our own government. From what I see in the international media, Obama is a laughingstock. They see he is not in his element when it all gets real. Putin seems to have it together well, he looks like a statesman in comparison to our guy. Interesting that you admire a Communist Dictator more than our own President. Particularly when Putin was the former head of the KGB, you know, during the time when Russians had all the freedoms we enjoy here, and rock bands don't get sentenced to prison for simply defending freedom. Oh wait, Pussy Riot is still in prison, and that only happened last year. You would love him more if he threw Black Sabbath, Led Zeppelin, Rolling Stones, etc, in prison too for being degenerates by his morality standards. And the KGB never spied or restricted freedoms of course. What an admirable guy. Really funny Bill:).
|
|
grayfingers
Cave Dweller
Member since November 2007
Posts: 4,575
|
Post by grayfingers on Sept 1, 2013 14:01:48 GMT -5
Helen, you are too funny. Just stating what I see. Putin is coming off as a statesman, Obama is coming off like someone unsure of what he is doing, besides looking weak while losing face. Just because I recognize Pootie-Poot is a better chess player, does not make me a fan. That is why (IMO) in times such as these, America is best represented by the reviled "Cowboy" type. There is little respect or fear of this administration in Europe, or worse yet by our enemies in the mid-east who despise a weak, indecisive adversary. Israel and many others are stunned at the obvious dangers posed by such amateurish foreign policy.
|
|
|
Post by helens on Sept 1, 2013 14:45:07 GMT -5
I agree. So what would you say Obama could do to improve his image and seem more the 'cowboy' you'd admire? Fire some missiles at Syria? Because I don't think ANYTHING Obama does would make you happy with him... am I wrong?
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,175
|
Post by jamesp on Sept 1, 2013 15:05:51 GMT -5
I agree. So what would you say Obama could do to improve his image and seem more the 'cowboy' you'd admire? Fire some missiles at Syria? Because I don't think ANYTHING Obama does would make you happy with him... am I wrong? If you hire me to delete your bad posts i could 'get er done' in about 40 hours/week . Now that i understand the quote/edit/delete functions. It would be a huge undertaking. I will PM you a quote.
|
|
|
Post by helens on Sept 1, 2013 15:08:31 GMT -5
I agree. So what would you say Obama could do to improve his image and seem more the 'cowboy' you'd admire? Fire some missiles at Syria? Because I don't think ANYTHING Obama does would make you happy with him... am I wrong? If you hire me to delete your bad posts i could 'get er done' in about 40 hours/week . Now that i understand the quote/edit/delete functions. It would be a huge undertaking. I will PM you a quote. Why not answer the question honestly wise guy:)?
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,175
|
Post by jamesp on Sept 1, 2013 15:14:28 GMT -5
Cat herder*\_/*
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2013 15:23:44 GMT -5
Jim what breed of dog do they use for cat herding?
|
|
|
Post by helens on Sept 1, 2013 15:34:08 GMT -5
That's as close to admitting I'm right as I would expect from you:).
I see 'liberal tactics 101" #2) Obfuscate and re-direct
Are you 2 liberals now?
|
|
jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,175
|
Post by jamesp on Sept 1, 2013 15:40:08 GMT -5
Chihuahua's for the cats. Wolves for Helen.
|
|
grayfingers
Cave Dweller
Member since November 2007
Posts: 4,575
|
Post by grayfingers on Sept 1, 2013 17:23:10 GMT -5
I agree. So what would you say Obama could do to improve his image and seem more the 'cowboy' you'd admire? Fire some missiles at Syria? Because I don't think ANYTHING Obama does would make you happy with him... am I wrong? Helen, That is a question deserving an honest answer. I shall set aside my predilection for indulging in schadenfreude for a bit. Believe it or not, I hope he succeeds in turning his/our somewhat awkward position/image to something more favorable than we have presently. The best way for Obama to improve his image would be to go back in time before chemicals were first reportedly used, and re-think the "red-line" rhetoric. Actually, Obama has done something I am very happy with him for. He pulled back from the brink of acting unilaterally, swallowed his pride and is taking his lumps. I admire that he was not quick to spill blood to save his honor as a warrior, or the right to wear the 10 gallon hat. Thing is, he is in a spot that he could have easily avoided had he not done the very things he campaigned against in 2007. (War Powers Act) At this point he is doing the right thing by deciding to consult congress, hard to believe he was not savvy enough to know to do that before he found himself in CYA mode. Makes one wonder who the heck is advising him on this. . . "If you must play, decide on three things at the start: the rules of the game, the stakes, and the quitting time"....Chinese Proverb.
|
|
grayfingers
Cave Dweller
Member since November 2007
Posts: 4,575
|
Post by grayfingers on Sept 1, 2013 17:40:32 GMT -5
Case in point: When the headlines are like the following, things are not going well for "The Last Superpower"
FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER...
Confusion, Anger, Mockery After Decision...
Syrian media calls 'historic American retreat'...
McCain: Assad 'Euphoric'...
Putin emboldened; sees chance to turn tables at G20...
Obama's proposal seeks broad war power despite vow of limits...
President risks embarrassing loss...
Hollande facing pressure to put intervention to vote...
Pope announces world day of prayer, fasting...
|
|