saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Mar 25, 2018 14:27:07 GMT -5
Hello all, let me just preface by saying thanks for all the tips and suggestions I'm getting here! Learning quickly.
I tumbled a lot growing up but my father handled all the aspects of stone select etc. I suspect he mostly picked out mixed stones.
I'm wanting to start up my first tumble with my kiddos - and I have a large mix of stone from TRS (can I name rock suppliers here?). I literally have a mix of about all the rocks they sell. I bought a bit =) I'm thinking my first tumble should be a mix of jasper (and I'll try agate next). I have their desert, mexican red, sea, serape, zebra, kambaba and leopard skin.
What would you all suggest for my first tumble for a jasper mix? Would all those be ok together? I can probably do a load of only desert jasper, but the others I bought 1-2 lbs only of each.
I would like to start this tonight in my Lortone 45-C. I bought some 46-70 SiC grit from them and I'm thinking 3 TBS of that in my barrel 75% full of mostly medium stones and a mix of 1-2 larger ones and several smaller ones.
Thoughts? Again - thanks for the advice and tips - it has been a long time since I tumbled. Last time I did this you could not buy an amazing mix of stone on the internet. Since I have some nice quality rough I don't wanna mess up my first tumble.
Alternative options - large selection of mixed different kinds of agate as well as quartz and quartzite.
Thanks!
Grant
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Post by grumpybill on Mar 25, 2018 17:28:57 GMT -5
I fill my 45C about 75-80% full of stones from pea sized to a couple inches. It's often a mix of jasper, agate and granite. I add 4 or 5 Tbls of 60/90, 2 Tbls cat litter and 2 Tbls of borax.
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saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Mar 25, 2018 17:47:39 GMT -5
I fill my 45C about 75-80% full of stones from pea sized to a couple inches. It's often a mix of jasper, agate and granite. I add 4 or 5 Tbls of 60/90, 2 Tbls cat litter and 2 Tbls of borax. Thanks! I don’t have borax (will look into it) yet so will that matter? Any kind of cat litter specifically?
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rockcat11
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since August 2017
Posts: 176
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Post by rockcat11 on Mar 25, 2018 18:02:22 GMT -5
I have never used borax.... to each his own. Some use kitty litter.
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Post by grumpybill on Mar 25, 2018 18:08:34 GMT -5
I use the cheapest clay cat litter I could find. It has some fine particles of sand or something in it, so I don't use it beyond 500 grit.
I started using borax to break up the foam/bubbles I sometimes get. I found it also works as a "slickener", making it easy to rinse the slurry off the stones and barrels, so I always add some now. Can't see that it would hurt anything if you didn't.
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saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Mar 25, 2018 20:46:20 GMT -5
I use the cheapest clay cat litter I could find. It has some fine particles of sand or something in it, so I don't use it beyond 500 grit. I started using borax to break up the foam/bubbles I sometimes get. I found it also works as a "slickener", making it easy to rinse the slurry off the stones and barrels, so I always add some now. Can't see that it would hurt anything if you didn't. I just did 4 TBL 46-70 grit this time around. Barrel prob 80% full. How quickly should I check it to start out? What am I looking for to know if I need anything? Should I check it in 4-5 days and re-charge with maybe 2-3 tbl? I'll feel the grit to see if it is breaking down. Thanks.
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Post by grumpybill on Mar 25, 2018 21:04:51 GMT -5
I check after 2 days to see if the slurry looks right and adjust as needed. I open after 4 days and feel the slurry. If it doesn't feel gritty, I do a cleanout. If it's gritty, I give it another day and check again. Your 46/70 will take longer to break down than the 60/90 or graded 80 I use. I don't do recharges unless all the stones in the barrel were started at the same time...a rare occurrence.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Mar 25, 2018 21:12:06 GMT -5
I have never heard of using borax I the first stage. I use it in later stages in a vibratory tumbler. I clean out my barrels weekly and almost never have bubbles by that time. I wouldn’t worry about it if I did have bubbles then. Personally I don’t use kitty litter as a thickener either. I find that it makes cleanouts a pain. I would use 4 or 5 tablespoons of grit in a tumbler of that size as Bill recommended. I like to keep things simple.
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saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Mar 25, 2018 21:20:52 GMT -5
Thanks all. All of my rock started together as its my first tumble since I was a child =)
I'll update more later this week.
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saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Mar 26, 2018 11:38:26 GMT -5
Alright - I sprung and went with a QT-66 (and a 12 lb barrel too) as well as the Lot-O to do stages 2 through final polish.
Hoping I can crank out some major stones this way =)
Now to find someone to grab my new 45-C =)
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saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Mar 26, 2018 11:42:41 GMT -5
Also - I checked the barrel about 4 hrs after starting it to be sure there weren't any issues. When I opened it - it basically looked like water with the grit suspended... no slurry (I assume obviously) yet.
I'll wait 48 hrs to re-open and see what it looks like then.
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goatgrinder
spending too much on rocks
Make mine a man cave
Member since January 2017
Posts: 368
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Post by goatgrinder on Mar 26, 2018 17:29:34 GMT -5
Wow, you move fast. Welcome to the family from Atlanta, Georgia. Best of luck.
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saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Mar 26, 2018 20:49:54 GMT -5
Wow, you move fast. Welcome to the family from Atlanta, Georgia. Best of luck. Thanks =) I thought about it for a few days and figured I wouldn't get anywhere very quickly with one 45-C tumbler. Since the Lot-O seems to move much faster I figured I need a lot of barrels to keep the rough stage 1 completion rate up with the polishing rate of the Lot-O ! Here are some pictures of my first tumble 24 hrs after starting. 1) Barrel too full? I shot for 80% 2) Slurry look after 24 hrs is thin.. but it is all jasper (harder). Should I just let it go 4-5 days and recheck or should I add something now? 1 b 2 by grantbleeker, on Flickry grantbleeker, on Flickr
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Post by Jugglerguy on Mar 26, 2018 21:22:01 GMT -5
I run my batches for seven days. That breaks the grit down and is easy to schedule. When I first started, I peaked at it before seven days like everyone else does. The more you do this, the easier it is to wait. I actually clean out my tumblers on Saturday and Wednesday. I empty my two big barrels on the weekend and my four small barrels mid week. That way I get to play with rocks twice a week and I don’t have a huge job either time.
I keep things simple and only use rocks, water, and grit in the first stage. In the 500 throu polish stages in the Lot-O I add borax to the mix.
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saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Mar 26, 2018 21:27:24 GMT -5
Juggler, how does that slurry look after 24 hrs? Too early to tell anything? I was assuming its too thin, but I don't have a base for comparison.
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Post by aDave on Mar 26, 2018 21:33:35 GMT -5
This barrel check is only after 24 hrs? Too soon in my opinion. At this rate you really haven't given any time for a slurry to form...especially if you are working with hard stuff. If you want to to jump start a slurry, add kitty litter. I don't use the stuff, but add a couple of tablespoons at the outset and then check from there. I'm with Rob Jugglerguy when it comes to using Borax in initial stages in a rotary. It's not needed in my opinion. I strictly am a rotary tumbler, and I don't add Borax until I'm doing a pre-polish or after polish with the stuff. It's run alone as a separate issue if need be. That's just me.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Mar 26, 2018 21:34:12 GMT -5
I have no idea what it looks like after 24 hours because I don’t look at it then. I find it a pain to clean the lid and rim of the barrel to put the lid back on. I can’t imagine it being very thick after only one day. Slurry thickness varies a lot based on the hardness of the rock. Slurry in a batch of agates isn’t super thick after a week. On the other hand, when I tumble very soft Petoskey Stones, I double the water and use 1/6 of the grit and the slurry is like pudding in a week. Soft rock just wears down much quicker and produces more dust. I don’t get too worrried about how thick the slurry is. If the grit has broken down after a week, then I figure it has done its job.
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saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Mar 26, 2018 22:46:39 GMT -5
I have no idea what it looks like after 24 hours because I don’t look at it then. I find it a pain to clean the lid and rim of the barrel to put the lid back on. I can’t imagine it being very thick after only one day. Slurry thickness varies a lot based on the hardness of the rock. Slurry in a batch of agates isn’t super thick after a week. On the other hand, when I tumble very soft Petoskey Stones, I double the water and use 1/6 of the grit and the slurry is like pudding in a week. Soft rock just wears down much quicker and produces more dust. I don’t get too worrried about how thick the slurry is. If the grit has broken down after a week, then I figure it has done its job. Thanks, I understand not to expect anything after 24 hrs. I was just curious if my initial recipe looked ok. I’ll let it go 5-7 days and check later and refresh if needed.
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jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,155
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Post by jamesp on Mar 28, 2018 8:12:05 GMT -5
I have never heard of using borax I the first stage. I use it in later stages in a vibratory tumbler. I clean out my barrels weekly and almost never have bubbles by that time. I wouldn’t worry about it if I did have bubbles then. Personally I don’t use kitty litter as a thickener either. I find that it makes cleanouts a pain. I would use 4 or 5 tablespoons of grit in a tumbler of that size as Bill recommended. I like to keep things simple. Most abrasive process use slurry for higher efficiency. I suggest newbies and veterans alike consider the benefits of slurry additives. For the benefit of better grinding rates from the point abrasive is added to the barrel. Simple not always better. It is simpler to not change the oil in your car for 20,000 miles but long term effects not so good. Soaps and anything that causes foam in a sealed rotary barrel is probably the wrong way to go.(Borax in a rotary for instance)
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Post by grumpybill on Mar 28, 2018 10:13:34 GMT -5
...anything that causes foam in a sealed rotary barrel is probably the wrong way to go.(Borax in a rotary for instance) Interesting comment. I have been operating under the impression that Borax reduced/prevented foam by breaking/reducing surface tension on the bubbles. As I mentioned somewhere else, I use it mainly because it makes rinsing the stones easier...important to me during the winter months when I'm rinsing and cleaning indoors over buckets.
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