daisyd681
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2011
Posts: 104
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Post by daisyd681 on Feb 11, 2014 8:47:24 GMT -5
Alright, one last question before I brave the chill and go start slicing. I have some turritella that I want to make a bolo tie for my dad with. How does it fair in the vibe? Being a fossil I'm thinking it might tend to undercut a bit. Anyone done turritella in a vibe?
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Feb 11, 2014 16:08:03 GMT -5
turritella material can vary quite a bit. With all that I have done it seems the darker and more black it is the more stable it will be in the tumbler. The stuff that has more of a brown or dark brown matrix does not seem to do as well.
Chuck
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The Dad_Ohs
fully equipped rock polisher
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Member since September 2012
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Post by The Dad_Ohs on Feb 12, 2014 13:12:20 GMT -5
I usually check my vibe tumbler 2 times/day to make sure it is going good and always check it before I go to bed to make sure everything is good. ( i usually give it an extra squirt or 3 of water at night as I have has it dry out on me once during the summer and ruin the bowl (ground a hole in it!!) as it is colder season now I would still add an extra squirt of water at night and then check it 1st thing in the am to make sure it is ok, no you don't have to run out to check it in your undies or Pj's, but check it in the am to make sure everything is ok.
When I say squirt, I am referring to a spray bottle of water I keep next to it so I can add a little as needed.
When I first set it up I will use between 2-3 squirts of water and then turn it on and see how it does, and if needed, add a squirt or 2 more and it should have plenty of moisture to run!... once you get it going you will see how much faster it is than a rolling tumbler, but after a few days of having to check it 2-3 times a day and add drops of water or it will be too wet and not work, you will appreciate the set it & forget it attitude that goes with a rolling tumbler !! lol ....
OHHHHHHHH THE MADNESSSSSSS... Such sweet Music To My Ears !!!!!!
Bwah-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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daisyd681
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2011
Posts: 104
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Post by daisyd681 on Feb 12, 2014 21:57:40 GMT -5
Yeah, I have to wait until next week to get it going because we are going camping this weekend. Dh races dirt bikes in the desert during the winter. I have amassed quite an extensive bunch of rocks to cut up in the process.  The rotary will be left on while we're gone, but the vibe will have to wait. In the mean time I can work on cutting up the dyed agate slice that was my soon to be brother-in-law's into a pendant, earrings and cufflinks for their wedding. He had it since he was a kid and it broke during their last move. He gave it to me with a bunch of other stuff to "do whatever I want with it". My sister said he looked "quite disjointed" when he saw it broken. He plays it pretty close to the vest. I'm thinking that this is an appropriate way to honor his treasured "rock". I want to cut teardrops for the pendant and earrings. I'm nervous about putting it in the vibe after I cut it though. It would be fairly tragic if it broke in there. The teardrop shape I want to do is fairly skinny at the top. It's agate, so it should be strong enough, but it did break once, so it might be compromised... |
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milto
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2010
Posts: 162
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Post by milto on Feb 13, 2014 9:19:09 GMT -5
I live in Yuma Az, we have very low humidity and fairly warm, hitting 90 today.I have to add much more water 3or 4 times a day and a lot the last check before bed.In Wisconsin checking and squirting twice a day works. The important thing is having the correct slurry and that comes with experience. The only other thing I would add is once you have your AO polish go dry on you, I'm sure you will remember it and not allow that to ever happen again.
Get going, experiment, come up with your own procedure, not all are going to come out perfect but you will most likely learn the most from them.
Good Luck
milto
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daisyd681
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2011
Posts: 104
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Post by daisyd681 on Feb 17, 2014 17:02:55 GMT -5
I need your expertise. What do I need to do to it? |
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daisyd681
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2011
Posts: 104
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Post by daisyd681 on Feb 17, 2014 19:05:44 GMT -5
I've got some movement but no slurry forming. I can see some grit but the stones aren't grey all over like I've seen in videos. Anyone? I'm at a loss right now on this. I don't know if I haven't added enough water, or if I've added too much. The stones were wet when they went into the bowl and I did spritz it a few times trying to get some movement going. I'm scared I'm going to add too much water and ruin my bowl...
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MrCoffee
has rocks in the head
Member since December 2005
Posts: 634
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Post by MrCoffee on Feb 17, 2014 21:02:43 GMT -5
Too much water won't ruin your bowl. However, you should take a close look at the size of material you're running. If you got huge slabs, they may get stuck on one of the turns in the bowl. Smaller sizes will flow more freely. If you are running a Lot-O Tumbler, then it'll shake just about anything that's big enough to fit its opening. No problem there, mine would spit out anything it thought was too big.
OK, so here's what you do: Put the rocks in the bowl, without grit or water. Run the thing, and see if they move. If they do, then great! Add water, enough to coat them. Then, add a a couple tablespoons of what ever grit you're using for the first grind, depending on the size of your tumbler. If it's a smaller 4 pounder, then a couple tablespoons is enough. Bigger, then add a half tablespoon per extra pound capacity. Let it go for oh, say, 6 hours or so. If everything looks like its all covered with mud and moving slowly, then add water to thin it real good, and let it run for 10 minutes or so, then dump the excess water/mud like you were straining spaghetti, in a bucket. Do that every time it muds up like that. They should start to shine after the first stage of grit is worn out. Then, they're ready for the 600, and so forth. Keep us updated.
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daisyd681
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2011
Posts: 104
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Post by daisyd681 on Feb 17, 2014 21:28:46 GMT -5
So should it have that grey covering everything from the get go, or does that build up over time? The videos I've seen have that covering from the get go. The problem is, it's not doing it. I don't have that even coating on everything like all the videos I've seen show. There is grit on everything, just not to where everything is colored grey. Is that okay? Will it still work? Everything seems to be moving fine. It was bunching up on one side, so I pulled a few of the bigger pieces out. I started with 2 TBS of 120/220 grit, I've got about 2 2/3 TBS in there now. I just can't get that slurry like everyone keeps talking about. I have a Raytech T-5 tumbler, it's a 4 lb tumbler, but I had to put 5 lbs worth of rock and ceramic to get it to move. So I added a little extra grit to compensate. I did have it sitting on the dryer at first, now it's on the floor, and seems to be moving a little better.
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The Dad_Ohs
fully equipped rock polisher
Take me to your Labradorite!!
Member since September 2012
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Post by The Dad_Ohs on Feb 18, 2014 0:35:01 GMT -5
looks to me like you have good motion, but either too much water or not enough grit. the spinning while moving up from the outside and then down into the inside is what you want, but everything should be grey.
My suggestion is to shut it down dump everything out into a colander (get it at the dollar store or your wife will hate you!!) and then put it back into the bowl and add grit, NO WATER, then start it going. It should stay wet enough to move and with a proper amount of grit turn grey quickly. If it doesn't move as it was before you dumped it use a spray bottle and 1-2 squirts should be enough to get it going, but no more than that or you will have too much water in there and rinse the grit off nstead of causing it to stick to the materials!!
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The Dad_Ohs
fully equipped rock polisher
Take me to your Labradorite!!
Member since September 2012
Posts: 1,860
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Post by The Dad_Ohs on Feb 18, 2014 1:00:46 GMT -5
OK, so here's what you do: Put the rocks in the bowl, without grit or water. Run the thing, and see if they move. If they do, then great! Add water, enough to coat them. It takes very little water to coat the rocks to carry grit, while I agree with the basic statement, You're doing a disservice by not explaining the amount of water need and how small it is! I feel that if he does this he will be right back in the same place he started, lots of movement and no grit. If he has a spray bottle and gets that really thick, looks like its dry mud, grit, then a squirt or 2 of water from a spray bottle will get everything going again and he won't have to dump it out continually. It seems to me to be a waste of grit if he has to dump it out every time it starts to thicken more than is good for tumbling to occur. Water evaporates and gets absorbed by the combination of rock dust and broken down grit. If he just adds a squirt of water and watches it to make sure it keeps moving properly, and has good coverage, he can put the lid back on and come back in 6 hours to check it again. After the first day I never check my tumbler more than twice a day and have never had a problem. I tend to add an extra squirt or 2 at night during warmer weather, but that's just so that I can be a little slower getting out there in the am to check it. If he follows my advise he will be ready for the next grit within 3-4 days a week at most depending on what he in tumbling and it's Mohs rating. I not trying to knock your info, I just don't agree with the way it's put and while it may work great for you and is something you are used to doing. I feel you both would save time & money by doing it the way I outlined. there is no reason to have to continually dump out the grit until he has reached the point where you are ready to move to the next grit. anyways... it my opinion and if it insults anyone, not my intention, it's what I've learned from the people here and my own experience having used a vibe tumbler for most of 2yrs straight, and I've not had these problem since I started using the method I spoke of here. do what you gotta do, and good luck with it... post pics and keep asking questions... they more info you get the better your decisions will be!! |
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daisyd681
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2011
Posts: 104
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Post by daisyd681 on Feb 18, 2014 9:32:14 GMT -5
I dumped it out and restarted yesterday, following the the wet rocks to begin with then add grit method. I added 2 TBS of grit and waited and watched. They were moving fine and there was grit on everything,but I wasn't getting that grey paint look. So I started with the spray bottle, squirt squirt wait. Eventually I saw that there was a small amount of standing water and I still hadn't seen the grey paint. So I drained it and added 1 tsp more grit. A few squirts of water to get the best movement and decided that that was as good as it was going to get. There was grit on everything, it just didn't look like paint. I could still see the color of the rocks. I gave it a couple more squirts before bed and decided that was as good as it was going to get and went to bed. This morning I have grey paint! It had slowed down quite a bit so I squirted a little more water in it and got it moving again. I'm wondering if the problem is my interpretation of "coating". I looked at videos online and saw lots of grey "paint" looking slurry. The only video I could find of someone actually starting from the beginning didn't show very closely what it looked like before they put the lid on. I'm guessing that I had it right from the start, but didn't know it because I wasn't looking for the right kind of coating for the first part. When I really think about it, it makes sense that the texture would be chunkier with brand new 120/220 and no rock dust. The dust makes it creamier and the grit breaks down.
This is all just theory, and I do really appreciate you all having patience with me while I panicked yesterday. Please let me know if I'm off base on this.
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The Dad_Ohs
fully equipped rock polisher
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Post by The Dad_Ohs on Feb 18, 2014 12:27:20 GMT -5
to me it sounds like you're right there... The material I tumble doesn't get the 'painted' look until a day later.
You have to remember that even though a vibe tumbler works faster than a rolling tumbler, the actual results are much slower. This happens because the vibe tumblers action attacks sharp edges first, and works more slowly on the rest of the rock. this is the main reason why people tumble pre-forms and polish the final items in a vibe too... the amount of material loss is minimal!!
The " squirt squirt wait." method is correct, but I think your wait time might have been short.If you have good movement and the rocks are not wet, but damp, they have the glisten of being wet but without any standing water, then that's right about where you want to be. You may have a Tablespoon of standing water in the bottom and that is fine because the tumbled material needs to pick up moisture to continue its motion and it also gives the grit something to stick to.
As long as it is moving properly, I would let it sit for 8 hours and then take a look, if you see the same thing, some grit but no paint look yet, leave it go for another 8 hours and look again. It takes time to build up a slurry, even in a vibe tumbler. Remember the amount of material being removed in minimal compared to a rolling tumbler so it will take longer to get the same results. Also, I noticed that the tumbler looks to be almost completely full in the video, this may be part of the problem.
I never fill mine more than 3/4 full. If you overfill it the weight will make the motor work harder and the bottom layer may not be moving as fast as the top layer and this could also be a cause of you not getting the 'paint look'.
This all goes back to the statement by MrCoffee when he said if it looks like dry mud, add water... this is correct, if it dries out too much it will cut right through the bowl and then you will need a new bowl.
When/If you get to the dry mud look, then 1 squirt, wait a minute, 2nd squirt if needed and you will have the painted look you saw in the pictures. The dry mud look means you have plenty of grit to cover everything just a little light on moisture to let the material slide/rub against each other. Hence the Squirt, wait, squirt method.
The stupidest/dumbest/most ridiculous thing about all this is that once you have it right, you'll always have it right and you'll do an impersonation of the V8 commercial because it is suddenly so simple. I wouldn't be surprised if you muttered "Duh!!" once you have it going... I know I did.
I printed a copy of the instructions at the beginning and kept it next to my tumbler because I thought I would need it keep referring to it, after the first batch I put it up on a shelf and I have not had to touch it since, but I know its always there if I need it. If you haven't I would go take a moment and look at it, not saying you need to, but if it was up to me I would say it was recommended reading for anyone who wants to use a tumbler. Biker Randy's thread (this one we are using) is the one I started with and have never looked back. I really think you are right there, just missing it by this much [ ].
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daisyd681
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2011
Posts: 104
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Post by daisyd681 on Feb 18, 2014 14:35:44 GMT -5
Thanks Mario. I think it was a case of thinking I knew better than the directions (that's really bad since I'm a girl.  ). I will add PATIENCE in red to the directions I printed out. I thought that painted look was just from the grit and water and that it was supposed to be there from the beginning. Thank you again for all the help. I think I've got it going now (until the next time I over think it that is. ) |
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The Dad_Ohs
fully equipped rock polisher
Take me to your Labradorite!!
Member since September 2012
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Post by The Dad_Ohs on Feb 18, 2014 20:25:41 GMT -5
Thank you again for all the help. I think I've got it going now (until the next time I over think it that is. ) That's half the reason we're all here!!!! so that when we stumble, we have plenty of help to get back up and continue on!! the people here have been such a huge help to me that I try to give back and help others whenever I can!! |
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daisyd681
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2011
Posts: 104
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Post by daisyd681 on Feb 21, 2014 23:23:59 GMT -5
I did two rounds of 120/220 and got it all cleaned out today for 500. Added the 1/2 tsp of 500 and it's moving really well. I do have one question though. Does anyone else's vibe run so loud on this stage? Is it the lack of thick slurry? It's like twice as loud as the last stage...
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deedolce
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since October 2006
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Post by deedolce on Feb 22, 2014 2:38:19 GMT -5
Super thread! I'm about to pull the trigger to order my own Lot-O. Have too many slabs and I use polished rocks to award the kiddies in my classroom, and now my jar is 1/2 empty. What a good excuse for me! lol. Thank you to all the experts sharing your experience.
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The Dad_Ohs
fully equipped rock polisher
Take me to your Labradorite!!
Member since September 2012
Posts: 1,860
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Post by The Dad_Ohs on Feb 22, 2014 19:40:23 GMT -5
Super thread! I'm about to pull the trigger to order my own Lot-O. Have too many slabs and I use polished rocks to award the kiddies in my classroom, and now my jar is 1/2 empty. What a good excuse for me! lol. Thank you to all the experts sharing your experience. I was about to say your welcome when I noticed The word "Experts" in your reply... so I'll leave it to them to accept the kudos!!!! I'm just another one of them Rock Nutz that likes to hang around and babble!!! Gratz on choice of tumbler, the Lot-O is supposed to be a really good tumbler!!! Probably going to go raytech myself as $$ is tight and the small raytech will keep me going until I can upgrade to something bigger/better!! |
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The Dad_Ohs
fully equipped rock polisher
Take me to your Labradorite!!
Member since September 2012
Posts: 1,860
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Post by The Dad_Ohs on Feb 22, 2014 19:43:05 GMT -5
the tumbler is loudest at the start and gets quieter as it runs, building up slurry helps quiet it down and you won't get much slurry during the polishing portion of the tumble, so yeah, it's going to be a little louder!
But the polish portion doesn't last as longer as the tumbling phase does either.
Good Luck/Post pics!!!!
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deedolce
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since October 2006
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Post by deedolce on Feb 22, 2014 21:40:39 GMT -5
Dad-Ohs, that means you too you Seriously Silly rockhound! I ordered it and can't wait till it gets here!!
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The rotary will be left on while we're gone, but the vibe will have to wait. 
). I will add PATIENCE in red to the directions I printed out. I thought that painted look was just from the grit and water and that it was supposed to be there from the beginning. 
