lostwilly
off to a rocking start
Member since November 2010
Posts: 17
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Post by lostwilly on Dec 3, 2010 20:52:11 GMT -5
Hello everyone. :help: I'm new to the boards and to rock tumbling, but, have caught the "Rock" bug bad. I'm thinking of buying a combo unit, The SwapTop™ All-In-Wonder™ (can be seen at this URL -- deltaonelapidary.com/detail.php?id=95 ). I was wondering if anyone has some experience with this machine, cost, utility, and/or how you rate it. I'm retired so not wanting to work too hard and will be only working with baseball sized rocks (and smaller) and a cheap-skate, so, all costs have to be considered. I'd appreciate any and all advise, thanks.~~ lostwilly (aka Frank). contact here or direct to lostwilly929@yahoo.com.
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tomcloss
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since October 2008
Posts: 158
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Post by tomcloss on Dec 3, 2010 21:38:06 GMT -5
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Post by jakesrocks on Dec 3, 2010 21:39:51 GMT -5
I don't have the complete unit, but I have the 8" flat lap. On a scale of 1 to 10, I'd rate the machine around a 3. It's under powered, has a small water tank with a poorly designed valve, and is almost all plastic. I only use mine for doing the flat backs on cabs, which it does a decent job on. On the plus side, they have a good selection of diamond disks for it, at a pretty decent price. They range from 60 grit up to 3,000 grit.
Don
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chromenut
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since December 2009
Posts: 1,971
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Post by chromenut on Dec 4, 2010 2:41:55 GMT -5
I researched this too, ad nauseum, before jumping into the flat lap circuit. Almost, like was just about to, bought one of these but got a Hi-Tech instead. Now glad I did, it runs day and night, and plows through the toughest stone without any whining from the motor. The all in wonder is a good idea, I just don't think it's made for a serious cabber.
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keystonecops
freely admits to licking rocks
Member since October 2010
Posts: 957
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Post by keystonecops on Dec 4, 2010 10:21:07 GMT -5
Willy, do you have any rock clubs close to you? Here in Salem we do, and they have a lapidary shop yhat you can use. I realize you dont have much money, but you need to try and get the best you can. Rocks are tuff lil animals. Keep an eye on Craigs LIST, YARD/ESTATE SALES ETC. kEEP US POSTED. lATER cLYDE
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Post by jakesrocks on Dec 4, 2010 11:00:44 GMT -5
You might also want to contact Tony, (catmandewe). He bought a huge load of used equipment a while back. He might be able to set you up with what you need, for a lot less than what new equipment would cost you.
Don
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drjo
fully equipped rock polisher
Honduran Opal & DIY Nut
Member since May 2008
Posts: 1,581
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Post by drjo on Dec 4, 2010 13:06:51 GMT -5
Are you handy? As in DIY?
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lostwilly
off to a rocking start
Member since November 2010
Posts: 17
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Post by lostwilly on Dec 4, 2010 13:13:33 GMT -5
Hey new friends!, Thank you for all the replies and insights on the SwapTop...it was a lot more info than I expected, again thanks. The general sense I got from y'all was the Inland machine isn't the machine I should start with. Crestfallen, but, undaunted, I'll ask another question~~
If you had it to do over, what machine (s) would you buy to be able to do both, shape and polish, and, shape and tumble polish an assortment of stones... for the average (enthusiastic) hobbyist with alot of time available to play with them?
I live in northwest lower Michigan where there are a lot of river banks and gravel outcrops to pick through. I even found a couple pounds of obsidian in the parking lot of my mechanic (while he was busy working on the best way to empty my wallet).
Lostwilly (aka Frank)
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chromenut
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since December 2009
Posts: 1,971
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Post by chromenut on Dec 5, 2010 0:23:50 GMT -5
Maybe others might disagree, but tumbling is totally separate, at least to me, than shaping. Sort of sounds like you're talking cabbing and not tumbling. For tumbling, a wide variety of tumblers in almost as wide a variety of cost.
For cabbing, seems to me to be a very personal thing. I personally do not like the wheel/belt laps. I prefer the flat lap, similar to what you have in the Inland. I've got a Hi-Tech 8" flat lap and I love it. Can literally sit in my living room and work stones, it throws no water. None! Long as you have a catch bucket, it produces very little mess. I'm just now buying a vibrating flat lap as I have complete collections of specimens that I want to face polish, lots of geodes, etc. Vibe flat lap does that much easier than hand holding it. Drop it in the lap pan and let 'er go.
I started my lapping hobby on a serious budget. Came across this flat lap on sale in ebay for $160, complete steal! Had all new pads/laps, had hardly been used. I mean a STEAL! I watched and waited for months while lurking around these forums to get one that was priced right for me. Now you may very well like the verticle cabbing machines, me, I can't stand long so they were out of the question. Add to it, the one's I learned on were a total mess to work with. Had to wear an apron just to start on a stone.
Anyway, you can get at least a dozen varied opinions on whats best to start with, but to tell you the truth, you should find a club nearby somewhere, or someone who has lap equipment, and see if they'll show it to you, let you mess with it a bit. If you were near me I'd offer mine up in a heartbeat, but then all my stuff is totally portable.
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chromenut
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since December 2009
Posts: 1,971
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Post by chromenut on Dec 5, 2010 0:33:45 GMT -5
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lostwilly
off to a rocking start
Member since November 2010
Posts: 17
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Post by lostwilly on Dec 5, 2010 6:45:10 GMT -5
chromenut, Being very new to the hobby I haven't picked a particular vein (pun intended) to be partial to. I started with a Harbor Freight $30, 3 pound single tumbler and a starter kit of rough and grit. After the first 4 step grind (5 weeks worth) I saw some really nice rocks. In some of the tumbled rocks I saw parts I'd like to cut out and shape for necklaces or other settings. I've also collected near a 100 pounds of of "pretty" common rocks (most I can't ID yet) found where ever I happen to be looking down. These I'd like to cut to the same size and shape, like 1" by 1" by 1/4" squares and tumble to round the corners and edges. Light and dark stones could be a checkers set, for an example. To my eye every rock, agate or slate, has a potential nice piece in it for me to bring out. I guess I'm in that awkward "can't ask an intelligent question cause I don't know enough about the hobby" state, so, I'm asking for guidance based on what I'd like to do...and afford to do. I'd like to keep up the dialogue with you, even use the chat room here, I'll be in the room every night at 8pm (est) for the next week or so if you'd like to chat. Thanks for the replies. lostwilly
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chromenut
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since December 2009
Posts: 1,971
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Post by chromenut on Dec 5, 2010 16:16:34 GMT -5
Well I'm no expert but I went through exactly what you did about two years ago. I bought the cheapest tumbler of the two-3 pound tub variety I could find from Harbor Freight. I ran it constantly and it didn't last more than 6 months. Then I moved up to cabbing, which I have had so much fun with as for tumbling all you do is put in the rocks and wait around for it to get done, burping, rinsing, changing grit, etc. Now I'm moving up to a way more expensive tumbler that should be able to produce much nicer results, and am expanding now also to a flat vibe lap. So, I can only speak from my personal experiences and what I've learned on this site, which has been plenty. I'll check in with you tonight.
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Post by deb193redux on Dec 6, 2010 15:48:27 GMT -5
I did not like the system. I really really hated the saw. I only use it as a grinder now.
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lostwilly
off to a rocking start
Member since November 2010
Posts: 17
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Post by lostwilly on Dec 6, 2010 19:31:48 GMT -5
I have pretty much given up on the all-in-one, very few responders were happy with it. Most likely I'll buy a tile saw or 2 (7" and 10") and then indulge my creative side in making a lap or two. I'll know better when I start putting odds and ends together and see what works.
I have 2 harbor freight tumblers, a single and dbl. With the single I made a piggy-back arrangement turning a peanut butter jar with the drum. Worked great till I burned through a bushing. Lucky those are easy to replace. I bought the dbl, re-designed the piggy back to hold 2 one pound jars, and used plumber's stem grease on the bushings. So far no wear seen into the second month. When my daughter comes home from college I'll have her teach me how to load pictures here...is prolly simple, but, technology and I don't really care much for each other.
lostwilly
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chromenut
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since December 2009
Posts: 1,971
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Post by chromenut on Dec 6, 2010 22:43:27 GMT -5
The all in one is great for glass work, my wife is getting it next summer when she starts her stained glass classes. Just not really sturdy enough for what we do here. You might want to consider looking around at flat laps. I searched and searched and found one offered at $300 and I ended up paying $250 plus shipping. Here's the thread on it: forum.rocktumblinghobby.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=ccabs&thread=36609&page=1It's a real joy to work with. With Rockmanken's help, plus a very knowledgeable few others, it took me about two days to figure out how to use it and I just love the thing! It's about ready for new pads but I use it almost all the time, so been about 9 months since I bought it and I think that's good for the main pads to last, since they were used when I bought it, only very slightly used. Anyway, I was so happy to get this one. I had an entire shop in my last house but in June this year lost that house and downsized almost half. Now I'm really happy I bought this type of lap as it fits in the closet next to my office on a single shelf with no issues. I can use it indoors and not make a mess. So it really was worth the money I spen ton it. Again, speaking from my own experience only.
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lostwilly
off to a rocking start
Member since November 2010
Posts: 17
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Post by lostwilly on Dec 7, 2010 9:14:58 GMT -5
chromenut, From my replies on the 6" ALL-IN-ONE (Inland machines), I can see there is a quality and utility difference between the 6" and 8" models. The 8" pieces are getting better reports. Not sure if this is design changes or upgrades in the models or more experienced users working them. I'm as guilty as any one for mis-using a tool and/or trying to get it to do more than it was designed to do. Advertisers like to say their machines are fool-proof... I've proved a lot of them wrong. Guess I'm a better fool than the average. I'm pretty sure I'm going to get into the hobby a bit slower than I thought. I will buy a saw (mid-priced wet tile) and cheap tumblers to start, and build my own laps and vibes to better understand how and what they do. If you saw my all-in-one garage & junk shop combo, with all the old motors, housings, and stuff I never threw away, you'd see I can create (cobbel) a wide variety of things together. Hopefully some will work lol. lostwilly (I really need to learn how to add pictures to posts)
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chromenut
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since December 2009
Posts: 1,971
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Post by chromenut on Dec 7, 2010 14:07:46 GMT -5
On images, you need to find a place to host them (IMO ImageShack is the best, and FREE), then when you upload to them all you need to do is take what they call the Direct link and post it to your message here. Then you need to make sure the image link is surrounded by the appropriate BBC code. Here's an example: Here's my picture: [img]httblah://wwblay.yadayadayada.com/imagesoandso.jpg[/img] So, put that img in boxes before and the /img in boxes after. Now for the real example: And the code looks like this: [img]http://img808.imageshack.us/img808/6610/setteled201001.jpg[/img]
One thing to note, when posting using this method the board no longer controls the size of the item you are embedding, so make sure you do not exceed 780 pixels wide so that members on slower connections don't get bogged down, and those using older monitors can see the entire picture. If you need any photo editing software I believe I have some free shareware I can hook you up with that allows you to very easily resize your pictures for posting on the web.
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lostwilly
off to a rocking start
Member since November 2010
Posts: 17
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Post by lostwilly on Dec 7, 2010 19:38:13 GMT -5
@ chromenut,
thanks for the info. I'll read through it a few times and try to get a picture up. Most likely out come my daughter will show me how when she comes home at break. is 7:30 est, I'm going up to the chat room at 8PM. And, I put a poll on my chat room thread this afternoon, 2 voters so far for a gathering time and day.
lostwilly
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lostwilly
off to a rocking start
Member since November 2010
Posts: 17
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Post by lostwilly on Dec 11, 2010 21:59:36 GMT -5
Took the plunge today and bought a Kobalt 7" tile saw. It and two extra blades set me back 4 C-notes, good thing rocks are cheap and just laying around waiting to become works of art. Going to start slow with some common stone, making rounds and ovals to tumble. May further carve or acid etch. In between times I have to build a lap or two. They're going to have to be homemade... I spent my allowance for this and next year.
My Daughter will be home this week from school so she can teach me how to post pictures.
lostwilly
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