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Post by broseph82 on Jan 26, 2015 22:18:26 GMT -5
fantastic5 said "And to answer the PM, the bubble gum pink sapphire is HARD to find. If you got a few pieces you did really well!! Soak that stuff in muratic acid and it will really show off the pink." Now you tell me. In your directions it made it seen like the pink corundum was everywhere until I actually got there and wasn't seeing schist ( jamesp pun). The two pieces I found aren't even worth showing it's so small. The pink garnets in the lighter schist from the rock slide is pretty cool stuff.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 27, 2015 0:10:46 GMT -5
James, garnets with different chemical makeups are sometimes found in the very same deposits, to emphasize what Dave said about metamorphism. A clear example occurred in the 1980s when rhodolite (pyrope-almandine) miners in Africa started finding very pretty garnets with non-rhodolite colors: orange, pinkish, etc. alongside the red-purple rhodolites. They sent them to dealers who set them aside and called them Malia (meaning "out of the family") in Swahili. The same word is commonly used to describe prostitutes and did the American gem marketers ever have fun with that! It turns out that Malaia is another garnet with "intermediate" chemistry like rhodolite. When some of the minerals that make up rhodolite were depleted during metamorphism the garnet-formation handily adapted to what was available, resulting in a pyrope-spessartine intermediate and some of them are very beautiful. In fact it's garnet's chemical adaptability that results in its many beautiful colors -- and makes it so bloody complicated! Some of the rare formulations must be valuable. For instance, have they discovered blue garnets somewhat recently ? Or Malaia, due they command high prices ? Certainly a stone that has so many variations of rich colors has to have rare and costly forms. I suppose this answers the question on blue garnets- www.civilminerals.com/id105.htmlThey are tiny and fetch incredible prices. The color is a light blue. Google images show darker blue faceted images, hmmm.
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gemfeller
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Post by gemfeller on Jan 27, 2015 1:15:26 GMT -5
James: yes, there are many valuable garnets. Tsavorite, the green grossular, can bring several thousands of dollars a carat. Demantoid, the green andradite with exceptionally high dispersion or "fire," is probably the most expensive of all with prices that can reach well into 5 digits per carat for large, fine gems. "Demant" in Dutch means "diamond." They sparkle with every spectral color.
Blue garnet was unknown until 20-25 years ago when a deposit in Bekily, Madagascar, began producing color-change garnets with blue as one hue position. Sometimes, very rarely, they remain blue in all lighting and both types are very expensive relatively speaking. Fine color-change garnets with alexandrite-like change can retail in the thousands. So can fine spessartines and Malaias although exact color, size and clarity are important in valuations. Many garnet types sell in the hundreds per carat. Unfortunately -- so far -- most of the really valuable ones come mainly from East Africa, Madagascar, the Russian Urals, India, Sri Lanka, Burma and other foreign locations. The U.S. produces some very nice stones but none I'm aware of that retail in the highest ranges. But there's always that next canyon to explore...
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 27, 2015 1:38:15 GMT -5
James: yes, there are many valuable garnets. Tsavorite, the green grossular, can bring several thousands of dollars a carat. Demantoid, the green andradite with exceptionally high dispersion or "fire," is probably the most expensive of all with prices that can reach well into 5 digits per carat for large, fine gems. "Demant" in Dutch means "diamond." They sparkle with every spectral color. Blue garnet was unknown until 20-25 years ago when a deposit in Bekily, Madagascar, began producing color-change garnets with blue as one hue position. Sometimes, very rarely, they remain blue in all lighting and both types are very expensive relatively speaking. Fine color-change garnets with alexandrite-like change can retail in the thousands. So can fine spessartines and Malaias although exact color, size and clarity are important in valuations. Many garnet types sell in the hundreds per carat. Unfortunately -- so far -- most of the really valuable ones come mainly from East Africa, Madagascar, the Russian Urals, India, Sri Lanka, Burma and other foreign locations. The U.S. produces some very nice stones but none I'm aware of that retail in the highest ranges. But there's always that next canyon to explore... i remember as a kid they said garnet does not occur in blue. And I remember a news blip that blue had been discovered. Strange that you could retire with a hand full of the right garnets. But we filled a bucket of old iron garnets this weekend. Great ammunition for a sling shot, and that's about all. Never knew Madagascar was such a rich gem location. and a diverse mineral spot too. Large gem grade garnets are really rare. The size seems to impact cost greatly, true for all gems. Odd thing about garnets, they may form in such large quantities. And if a deposit of a rare garnet was found in mass it would be incredibly valuable. I understand the US is not the place for the finest garnets. Imagine poking around in one of these locations and finding a large trove of say Demantoids, what a rush that would be. I can not think of a better way to get rich. I took Jimi garnet hunting Sunday. Looking for a higher grade. We drove miles on soil roads. Stopped at many schist veins where the garnets in the area form. To no avail, all about the same heavy iron garnets. The garnets in Georgia seem to get higher in quality as the topography gets steeper, the higher the hills, the glassier the garnet in many cases. The movie 'Deliverance' was filmed in high grade garnet territory for instance. It drains from the area close to the Cowee Valley. The mountains that it drains are about impossible to explore. Am certain that many garnets remain unfound in those areas, not to mention the dense forests that make mineral exploration impossible. The intense networks of creeks would yield many garnets to chase upstream, but there is a great portion that the creeks would not come in contact with matrix. Many spring heads in the higher elevations that are unable to wear rock enough to wear garnets out of their matrix, where garnets occur. Having romped around the granite quarries as a kid me used to find black tourmaline crystals 6 inches in diameter and several feet long. Or the Hog Mine that has low grade aquamarine crystals 6 feet long and 8 inches in diameter. As you move north to the mountains extreme formations exist there too.
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Post by gingerkid on Jan 27, 2015 10:47:38 GMT -5
broseph82, do you have any pics of the corundum that you found? Would like to see them. jamesp, 'squeal like a pig!' Just kidding with you, but had to throw that in. Elise Skalwold had an article on her website (nordskip.com) about a blue garnet that gemfeller shared with us a wealth of information, but her website is under construction. Here's a Mindat discussion on the blue garnet from Madagascar. www.mindat.org/forum.php?read,6,75782,118736#msg-118736 I have a teeny tiny (1.02 carat) color change garnet from Madagascar. It likes to show off in different light sources. It turns a beautiful shade of blue in sunlight, purple and red and some indoor lighting. Terrible pics, but here it is: Bekily, Madagascar color change garnet outdoors Here it's more of a purplish color in indoor lighting Also have a reddish-orange spessartite from Madagascar that I wore every day, but it needs a recut since I managed to mess up the table facets. Spessartite from Madagascar (seller's pic, my ring)
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Post by broseph82 on Jan 27, 2015 14:23:22 GMT -5
gingerkidI handed them over to my wife so now I'll have to find them. Hopefully they didn't get washed in the washing machine.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 28, 2015 4:43:03 GMT -5
gingerkid that is a serious color change. Noticed those blue garnets have a 'roof shingle' texture on the surface when they are raw. Spessartite is wow in color too. What were you doing to scratch it ?!? broseph82 beware of rocks in the washing machine and dryer. I messed up the washing machine when a rock got jammed in the seal.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 28, 2015 7:55:16 GMT -5
This looks like a good habitat for garnets in Appalachia. Folded and angled schist in thick layers in high elevation creek. Never been to this spot but would give it a high probability for garnet production. Another folded up schist layer on the Chattahoochee River in north Atlanta. This one full of what looks like pyrope/almandine mixes. This schist ridge runs a good distance and is also cut in half by Rottenwood Creek about a mile NWW of this river cut. Rottenwood requires no kayak though, and is rich in various colors of fine quartzite and felspars.
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Post by gingerkid on Jan 28, 2015 11:09:04 GMT -5
broseph82, I hope your gal didn't wash your corundum. Will be in a conundrum of corundum if she did by accident, but they will be squeaky clean. jamesp, haven't ever seen any ccg rough in person. I'm pretty sure that gemfeller can explain what you are seeing that looks like roof shingles. When I first read your comment about how the rough looks like roof shingles to you, I thought of the spessartine crystals that are etched or show growth features on the xtals. Like this one: But I don't think that's what you are seeing, is it?? Messed up the spessartite from everyday wear. Won't wear it again until I can get it recut.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 28, 2015 11:34:11 GMT -5
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Post by gingerkid on Jan 28, 2015 12:04:35 GMT -5
jamesp, can see the etching (?) really well in the second one. Just drooled all over the keyboard. Will hope and wait on gemfeller's call for confirmation on what we're seeing. The lil spessartine etched crystal that I have in my collection and posted is from Brazil. Some call them floater xtals.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 28, 2015 13:12:27 GMT -5
jamesp, can see the etching (?) really well in the second one. Just drooled all over the keyboard. Will hope and wait on gemfeller's call for confirmation on what we're seeing. The lil spessartine etched crystal that I have in my collection and posted is from Brazil. Some call them floater xtals. Guessing that the spessartine is having an effect on the surface 'shingles'. Maybe other garnet forms do that too. Those are some tiny 'in the rough' stones too bring so much money. I got croaker sacks full of them not really.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 30, 2015 19:39:54 GMT -5
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Post by broseph82 on Jan 30, 2015 20:49:04 GMT -5
jamesp anything you could grab with your fingers?
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Post by broseph82 on Jan 30, 2015 23:45:41 GMT -5
When I cut a piece of limonite:
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 31, 2015 6:21:03 GMT -5
jamesp anything you could grab with your fingers? That is Buck Creek @ 3400 feet elevation Jimi. Off Hwy 64 east of Chatuge about 10-15 miles in Nantahala Nat Forest. Buck Creek Road runs next to it. no big stuff. tested about 25 creeks in the area. Buck creek had the highest density. Most of the roads I was heading for were closed due to ice. I would say those are the classic rhodolite garnets that gemfeller mentioned. color named after local rhododendron flower color. My days of romping these steep hills are over, you might want to give it a try. These are 2-3mm gem grade garnets. You just need to find 8-10mm size and then you are on to something. Basically hiking the area and tracing their source starting with big creeks. Conditions favorable for gem grade garnets, just need to find the bigger ones. Better done in the summer. garnets settle like gold since they are heavy. So getting in the creek and finding pockets in the creek where the bigger garnets settle is the way.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 31, 2015 6:35:25 GMT -5
More photos of area Probably Standing Indian mountain @ 5499 from Buck Creek Road Rhododendron (mountain laurel variety) along Buck Creek Entering mountains from Helen One of the rock(and glass) shops in Helen It's all steep
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 31, 2015 6:40:50 GMT -5
gemfeller's mention : I'm a real garnet freak. Is Chatuge anywhere close to Cowee Creek in N.C., where "rhodolite" garnets were "discovered" and mis-named? Garnet species can form solid-solution series' that allow them to commonly mix with each other. Rhodolite is a varying mix of the almandine and pyrope species, both of which are pretty dark-toned as the chemistry nears end-member form. But for some strange reason intermediate blends of the two yield lovely light-toned red-purple gems, which sounds a lot like what you found as a kid. I say rhodolite was mis-named because the same pyrope/almandine blends had been found in India, Sri Lanka and elsewhere since before Roman times. Now garnet experts refer to pyrope-almandine and another species' blend pyrope/spessartine (mis-named Malaia Garnet) as intermediates -- they're not true species. Both rhodolite and malaia are trade-names. Read more: forum.rocktumblinghobby.com/thread/69255/garnets-rutiles-new-pics-page?page=7#ixzz3QOkX9DSM
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Post by gingerkid on Feb 1, 2015 14:15:18 GMT -5
jamesp, those are beautiful garnets! Is this the place where you mentioned your dad would take you? Looks like the limonite made a mess for you, broseph82.
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quartz
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Post by quartz on Feb 1, 2015 23:46:55 GMT -5
If you want a good cheap magnet, pop one off the back of a speaker, epoxy it to something that a handle can be put on. Don't have strength numbers, but I've used them for all sorts of holding needs.
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