jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 28, 2018 9:32:22 GMT -5
These are roughed perimeter shaped on a coarse tile saw. Soon to get some finer abrasive cutters to reduce terrible chipping. Dome and polish formed by melt. Need to know optimum shoulder/edge height grind target. 3mm 4mm 5mm ? Thanks in advance. ETA They seem a bit thick at 5.5mm to 7mm at thickest point. I can grind the backs. To what thickness at thickest point ? 5.5mm 6mm ? This is the batch out of the kiln from yesterday after rough shaping w edge chipping. They about all need silhouette adjustments. I know it is just glass but they seem to meet quality standards for jewelry. well, a cab's a cab....
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 28, 2018 9:53:37 GMT -5
I was hoping to send some of these out as free samples in small quantities to put them in hands in no hassle quicky envelopes. Feel free to PM me your address so that I can send you a few. These require more labor and result in some failures mostly due to polish. I may ask $5 each in small batches if I ever market them.
For now I would like to get a few in circulation.
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Post by fantastic5 on Feb 28, 2018 10:23:25 GMT -5
Here's a document that I found. I would be interested in hearing what the more experienced cabbers think about the specifications outlined.
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Post by rockjunquie on Feb 28, 2018 10:39:24 GMT -5
I think it depends on how it will be set. Wire wrappers like a thinner girdle while silver smiths like one a bit thicker. I generally shoot for about 3-4 mm. Thinner than that and I state it would be good for wire wrapping, but could could also be smithed. This coming from the limited amount I know. I'm sure others have their own preferences. But, I do consider the 7mm range to be a bit too thick.
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Post by rockjunquie on Feb 28, 2018 10:40:08 GMT -5
Looking great, BTW!
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zekesman
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Post by zekesman on Feb 28, 2018 10:48:31 GMT -5
@jamessp you need to bevel that side at an angle 5 to 10 degrees. The height isn't as important because bezel strip comes in different height. I prefer taller cabs, especially on clear / translucent stuff. and a shallow angle but to each his own. Vic
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Post by rockjunquie on Feb 28, 2018 10:55:02 GMT -5
@jamessp you need to bevel that side at an angle 5 to 10 degrees. The height isn't as important because bezel strip comes in different height. I prefer taller cabs, especially on clear / translucent stuff. and a shallow angle but to each his own. Vic I haven't done a whole lot of smithing, but couldn't a thick cab also have a rather thin girdle? Hi dome cabs often have no girdle at all. Some people like to bend the bezel wire over the girdle edge, while I prefer to rely on the girdle angle to hold the stone in. So many variables....
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Post by Pat on Feb 28, 2018 11:19:50 GMT -5
jamesp You can always raise a cab up if you need to have it taller. We use the soft plastic lids from ice cream containers. The lids are translucent, have a little give, and can be cut to size. If the stone is transparent at all, you would need to use the part of the lid without writing! You don't want "vanilla" to show through your cab : ).
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Feb 28, 2018 11:20:05 GMT -5
I have been thinking about your glass cabs as I have watched your progress. I have tried to figure out how they will be used. I do not like to groove wrap anything that will show the wire so that may not work. I have fully wire wrapped a completely clear optical quartz cab but even that is tricky because all the wires on the back can be seen through the cab from the front. Silversmithing may be the answer but that is a much more labor intensive and costly method of setting. Generally speaking I would not make a silversmith setting for a $5 cab. I think your stuff is cool looking so I hope some others come up with a way to use them.
As far as smithing goes the bezel wire used on the edge of the stone is available in a few different heights and spacers can be used to adjust thickness behind the cab. My only concern when it comes to girdle height is that it needs to be very consistent all the way around.
What are your thoughts James? When you look at your cabs what setting are you thinking of?
Chuck
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Don
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Post by Don on Feb 28, 2018 11:46:25 GMT -5
Bezel strip comes in 1/2" 1/4" 1/8" 3/16" and 3/8" widths at most jewelry making supply stores. Your stone girdles should ideally match one of those. It doesn't matter to me that much because I use a shear to cut my own to the width I need. So long as the girdle is even around the stone, I'm happy. I believe 1/8" is most common.
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Feb 28, 2018 11:54:26 GMT -5
As the others have already stated, bezel wire comes in various sizes. My question is when you say the cabs are between 5.5 and 7 mm at the thickest point, are you measuring from the middle of the cab or just the ground girdle area? If it's the middle, not a problem, you just need to measure the girdle height of the cab. I took a quick look and the widest bezel wire I saw was 4.78 mm, but I didn't look at gallery wire either, and there could be some that are wider. If I were you, I'd probably shoot for between 3-4 mm for the girdle or thereabouts.
I personally would just refinish the bottoms if I needed to take one down a bit.
The other points made are all good and valid. It's personal preference on girdle angles and heights of cabs. I've wrapped thick cabs and set thin ones. There's always a way to do it.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 28, 2018 12:05:25 GMT -5
@jamessp you need to bevel that side at an angle 5 to 10 degrees. The height isn't as important because bezel strip comes in different height. I prefer taller cabs, especially on clear / translucent stuff. and a shallow angle but to each his own. Vic Excellent. I can tip the table to get a 5 to 10 Thank You Vic
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
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Post by jamesp on Feb 28, 2018 12:11:50 GMT -5
I think it depends on how it will be set. Wire wrappers like a thinner girdle while silver smiths like one a bit thicker. I generally shoot for about 3-4 mm. Thinner than that and I state it would be good for wire wrapping, but could could also be smithed. This coming from the limited amount I know. I'm sure others have their own preferences. But, I do consider the 7mm range to be a bit too thick. Being that I have random shaped tumbles, flat back tumbles, ground girdles - and all of various thicknesses there is both wrap able and bezel able. 6 and 7 mm girdle seems THICK to me for a bezeled jewel, bit of a brick eh Tela ? 3 to 4mm sounds like a fine girdle. You know I appreciate the input.
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
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Post by jamesp on Feb 28, 2018 12:14:29 GMT -5
jamesp You can always raise a cab up if you need to have it taller. We use the soft plastic lids from ice cream containers. The lids are translucent, have a little give, and can be cut to size. If the stone is transparent at all, you would need to use the part of the lid without writing! You don't want "vanilla" to show through your cab : ). Vanilla cabs might entice some w/an appetite ! Thanks for the tip about the spacer Pat. Many of these have a layer of milk glass as a backing, to accentuate color layer in front. A frosted backing is looking good as a back drop with this clear glass.
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Post by Pat on Feb 28, 2018 12:21:24 GMT -5
Diamond Pacific makes a gizmo that puts your cab at a 12.5 degree angle. I suspect YOU could make a similar gizmo/ramp at any angle.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 28, 2018 12:37:03 GMT -5
I have been thinking about your glass cabs as I have watched your progress. I have tried to figure out how they will be used. I do not like to groove wrap anything that will show the wire so that may not work. I have fully wire wrapped a completely clear optical quartz cab but even that is tricky because all the wires on the back can be seen through the cab from the front. Silversmithing may be the answer but that is a much more labor intensive and costly method of setting. Generally speaking I would not make a silversmith setting for a $5 cab. I think your stuff is cool looking so I hope some others come up with a way to use them. As far as smithing goes the bezel wire used on the edge of the stone is available in a few different heights and spacers can be used to adjust thickness behind the cab. My only concern when it comes to girdle height is that it needs to be very consistent all the way around. What are your thoughts James? When you look at your cabs what setting are you thinking of? Chuck As mentioned to Tela I am generating several different products. A lot of fully tumbled flat easy to wrap material. With this particular product I am curious about girdle height and standard cab dimensions in the event someone wants to smith a bezel. I agree, silversmith efforts are a huge labor. But have had requests surprisingly and am trying to send out roughed out samples. The constant height of the girdle is not far away, looking at methods. This grind is where the rubber hits the road, more skill demand than shaping silhouette. This concerned me so that one could use a constant width bezel strip. As far as groove wraps. The more opaque colored cabs with color layer above the groove may work. This glass about all has a thin color layer. Composition is 95% clear and 5% color. Some close to the back(not good), some close to the front( do able). Some of this glass is off the chart. The pieces with the color layer to the bottom look deep. And the glass blower put some real fancy detail into it. The dome and layer of clear glass above serves as an optical magnifier and gives a fine effect. Me, I'm into it.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 28, 2018 12:41:44 GMT -5
Bezel strip comes in 1/2" 1/4" 1/8" 3/16" and 3/8" widths at most jewelry making supply stores. Your stone girdles should ideally match one of those. It doesn't matter to me that much because I use a shear to cut my own to the width I need. So long as the girdle is even around the stone, I'm happy. I believe 1/8" is most common. Thanks Don. The 1/8" dimension seems like a great target, about 3mm. Most common is a great target, most common appeals. But you can/do cut your strip to any size, get that. Thanks for your time Don. I appreciate these comments. I believe my questions are answered. I had an idea and y'all basically reinforced my thoughts.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 28, 2018 13:02:01 GMT -5
As the others have already stated, bezel wire comes in various sizes. My question is when you say the cabs are between 5.5 and 7 mm at the thickest point, are you measuring from the middle of the cab or just the ground girdle area? If it's the middle, not a problem, you just need to measure the girdle height of the cab. I took a quick look and the widest bezel wire I saw was 4.78 mm, but I didn't look at gallery wire either, and there could be some that are wider. If I were you, I'd probably shoot for between 3-4 mm for the girdle or thereabouts. I personally would just refinish the bottoms if I needed to take one down a bit. The other points made are all good and valid. It's personal preference on girdle angles and heights of cabs. I've wrapped thick cabs and set thin ones. There's always a way to do it. Yes hummingbirdstones, about 6mm at tip of dome. And 4mm is working good as girdle height for the most common melt dome. Glass with a high content of colored glass melts high dome. Glass with little color usually melts low dome. Thin glass melts low dome. Thick glass melts high dome. so I get various domes....but most are low to medium. The 4mm girdle looks optimimum for the most common domes generated. I am perfecting the ovals and rounds by nipping the glass to perfect size before melt. Time spent here makes very accurate slopes making it easy to grind a consistent girdle height because of fine oval and roundish shapes. Peninsulas and pointed shapes make flatter slopes as moving away from center, girdle tricky there.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 28, 2018 13:06:09 GMT -5
Diamond Pacific makes a gizmo that puts your cab at a 12.5 degree angle. I suspect YOU could make a similar gizmo/ramp at any angle. As of now I am grinding girdles on one side of a tile saw blade with a wide diamond band and from one side of the blade Pat. Easy to slope table 10 to 12 degrees making the desired slope. It is wetter than a Genie lol. This slope is great info. never ever thought about that approach to holding stone.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Feb 28, 2018 13:07:17 GMT -5
Thanks everyone. I get it. Thanks for your time and input. Back to work I go !!
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