anubis63
off to a rocking start
Member since February 2018
Posts: 18
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Post by anubis63 on Mar 9, 2018 12:29:02 GMT -5
I was thinking about getting a Vibratory tumbler but I found the a most all descriptions say they are for mettle, Glass, Coins, Shells but what about rocks. Are they as good at polishing rocks a the rotary tumblers? I wish I knew.
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Post by woodman on Mar 9, 2018 14:51:18 GMT -5
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Post by grumpybill on Mar 9, 2018 15:55:49 GMT -5
The main advantages to vibes are that they're a lot quicker and use very little grit. The only disadvantages are that they require a bit more attention/babysitting and won't turn an odd shaped stone into a round pebble.
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Fossilman
Cave Dweller
Member since January 2009
Posts: 20,711
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Post by Fossilman on Mar 9, 2018 17:46:04 GMT -5
I like my rotory (6 of them)... Will be buying a vibe soon,but to just do Obsidian in it.. I hate babysitting anything though...
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Post by Jugglerguy on Mar 9, 2018 18:08:45 GMT -5
Having both is best. Start them in the rotary and finish them in the vibe. I agree with Grumpy Bill about the pros and cons, although I think the con of having to babysit more is exaggerated by some.
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Post by grumpybill on Mar 9, 2018 19:13:47 GMT -5
I didn't mean to imply that vibes require excessive babysitting, but they do require more than a rotary. I load up a rotary barrel and only check it every couple days for progress and adjust the slurry if needed. Some people wait a week or longer. I check my Lot-o vibe about an hour after loading it, then add water before I go to bed and again first thing in the morning. (Of course, being the curious type, I pop the lid and look in any time I'm in the basement.)
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Post by gmitch067 on Mar 9, 2018 21:40:47 GMT -5
I started this hobby a year+ ago using rotary tumblers (all stages to polish). I thought I was happy with the polish achieved... until I tried the vibratory tumblers. Now I only use my rotary tumblers to shape the rocks with the coarser grits, then shift to the vibs for 220 grit to polish stages. I am MUCH happier. I have a Thumler's Ultra Vibe UV-10 and UV-18. For the past half year my UV-10 is collecting dust on the shelf. I love the UV18+++ ... Even tho the noise level in my garage is horrendous... I wear my shooting ear muffs... a must! (good cross hobbies... shooting and rockhounding... lots of opportunities... LOL) The woodman link to the RockTumbler.com is very informative regarding vibe use... I highly recommend it. I am retired, and was seeking some hobby that would keep my "Type-A" personality in-check... gotta be busy all the time. I realized that dream by adding vibe tumbling into the mix. I am busy ALL the time now. Lol! If you are the type to leave the house and travel around (business or pleasure), rotary tumbling is good... BUT vibe tumbling requires daily (even hourly - in the beginning stages!!!) attention... not a good fit... BUT better shine!
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ingawh
starting to spend too much on rocks
The rock wants to shine, I just help it get there
Member since February 2011
Posts: 194
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Post by ingawh on Mar 10, 2018 1:20:06 GMT -5
I started this hobby a year+ ago using rotary tumblers (all stages to polish). I thought I was happy with the polish achieved... until I tried the vibratory tumblers. Now I only use my rotary tumblers to shape the rocks with the coarser grits, then shift to the vibs for 220 grit to polish stages. I am MUCH happier. I have a Thumler's Ultra Vibe UV-10 and UV-18. For the past half year my UV-10 is collecting dust on the shelf. I love the UV18+++ ... Even tho the noise level in my garage is horrendous... I wear my shooting ear muffs... a must! (good cross hobbies... shooting and rockhounding... lots of opportunities... LOL) The woodman link to the RockTumbler.com is very informative regarding vibe use... I highly recommend it. I am retired, and was seeking some hobby that would keep my "Type-A" personality in-check... gotta be busy all the time. I realized that dream by adding vibe tumbling into the mix. I am busy ALL the time now. Lol! If you are the type to leave the house and travel around (business or pleasure), rotary tumbling is good... BUT vibe tumbling requires daily (even hourly - in the beginning stages!!!) attention... not a good fit... BUT better shine! I totally agree that rotary is best for shaping, while a vibe great for the final shine. My drug of choice is the Lot-O-Tumbler. I had one of the bigger bowl-style vibes and gave it away. (Mine was a Gy-Rok - maybe I'd have been happier with the Thumler...?) The problem was partly the noise, but also, it was just finicky beast that I gave up trying to tame. The thing would get all out of balance if I tried to polish large stuff. So I found I greatly preferred the ease and versatility of the Lot-O-Tumbler. The Lot-O will do about 4.5 pounds at a time, but I've put some pretty BIG stuff in there -- Basically, if you can fit it into the jug, you can polish it -- And I'm not above squeezing and bending the mouth of the jug to get a piece to fit! Maybe I'll break down some day and try the Thumler (now that I have the support of all the great wisdom on this board to help me over the hurdles) but in the meantime, I swear by my little Lot-O-Tumber (available at The Rock Shed: therockshed.com/tumbler1.html).
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anubis63
off to a rocking start
Member since February 2018
Posts: 18
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Post by anubis63 on Mar 10, 2018 14:44:01 GMT -5
My drug of choice is the Lot-O-Tumbler I like what you said so I bought a Lot-O-Tumbler but now I'm not sure when to take the stones from the rotary tumbler and put it in the Lot-O-Tumbler and what amount of grit to add to it not to mention how long I tumble on the last stages. I'm sure there will be instructions but those can be a bit ambiguous I want to make sure I get it right the first time.
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Mar 10, 2018 15:24:24 GMT -5
My drug of choice is the Lot-O-Tumbler I like what you said so I bought a Lot-O-Tumbler but now I'm not sure when to take the stones from the rotary tumbler and put it in the Lot-O-Tumbler and what amount of grit to add to it not to mention how long I tumble on the last stages. I'm sure there will be instructions but those can be a bit ambiguous I want to make sure I get it right the first time. Rocks get moved from the rotary to the lot-o as soon as you are happy with the shaping and surface quality. If there are still any pits or flaws when you move them to stage two they will still be there all the way to polish. Stage 2-5 does not remove flaws. Ask 10 people for tumbler instructions and get 10 different answers. This is a generic recipe that works on 80% of the loads for the lot-o Stage 2 fill to 80 percent with wet rocks and add 2 tablespoons of 120/220 SC or 220 graded SC. Run 24-48 hours checking often for motion. Spray with water when motion slows. Stage 3 fill to 50-60 percent with wet rocks and add enough ceramic filler to get to 80% full. Add 1/2 teaspoon of 500 AO and 1 tablespoon of borax. Run 24-48 hours checking every 12 hours for motion. Spray with water if motion slows. Stage 4 fill to 50-60 percent with wet rocks and add enough ceramic filler to get to 80% full. Add 1/2 teaspoon of 1000 AO and 1 tablespoon of borax. Run 24-48 hours checking every 12 hours for motion. Spray with water if motion slows. Stage 5 fill to 50-60 percent with wet rocks and add enough ceramic filler to get to 80% full. Add 1/2 teaspoon of A/O polish and 1 tablespoon of borax. Run 24-48 hours checking every 12 hours for motion. Spray with water if motion slows. Stage 6 is optional. This is just a 2 hour run with the rocks and ceramics after polish using 2 tablespoons of borax. *** the proper amount of water to add at each stage is achieved by adding the rocks and ceramics then filling the barrel with water. Put your hand over the barrel opening and drain all the water out. That leaves just enough water to run each stage. Chuck
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ingawh
starting to spend too much on rocks
The rock wants to shine, I just help it get there
Member since February 2011
Posts: 194
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Post by ingawh on Mar 10, 2018 15:26:12 GMT -5
My drug of choice is the Lot-O-Tumbler I like what you said so I bought a Lot-O-Tumbler but now I'm not sure when to take the stones from the rotary tumbler and put it in the Lot-O-Tumbler and what amount of grit to add to it not to mention how long I tumble on the last stages. I'm sure there will be instructions but those can be a bit ambiguous I want to make sure I get it right the first time. I tend to only use the Lot-O when the stones are ready to polish. I only do two stages, but you don't need to jump to that process if this is still pretty new. I would recommend going through the regular first three steps in your rotary, then polish in the Lot-O-Tumbler. I do not follow the instructions that come with the Lot-O. I finally wrote up my instructions, as I have given demonstrations. I'll try to locate at attach them later today.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Mar 10, 2018 15:46:42 GMT -5
I like what you said so I bought a Lot-O-Tumbler but now I'm not sure when to take the stones from the rotary tumbler and put it in the Lot-O-Tumbler and what amount of grit to add to it not to mention how long I tumble on the last stages. I'm sure there will be instructions but those can be a bit ambiguous I want to make sure I get it right the first time. Rocks get moved from the rotary to the lot-o as soon as you are happy with the shaping and surface quality. If there are still any pits or flaws when you move them to stage two they will still be there all the way to polish. Stage 2-5 does not remove flaws. Ask 10 people for tumbler instructions and get 10 different answers. This is a generic recipe that works on 80% of the loads for the lot-o Stage 2 fill to 80 percent with wet rocks and add 2 tablespoons of 120/220 SC or 220 graded SC. Run 24-48 hours checking often for motion. Spray with water when motion slows. Stage 3 fill to 50-60 percent with wet rocks and add enough ceramic filler to get to 80% full. Add 1/2 teaspoon of 500 AO. Run 24-48 hours checking every 12 hours for motion. Spray with water if motion slows. Stage 4 fill to 50-60 percent with wet rocks and add enough ceramic filler to get to 80% full. Add 1/2 teaspoon of 1000 AO. Run 24-48 hours checking every 12 hours for motion. Spray with water if motion slows. Stage 5 fill to 50-60 percent with wet rocks and add enough ceramic filler to get to 80% full. Add 1/2 teaspoon of A/O polish. Run 24-48 hours checking every 12 hours for motion. Spray with water if motion slows. Stage 6 is optional. This is just a 2 hour run with the rocks and ceramics after polish using 2 tablespoons of borax. *** the proper amount of water to add at each stage is achieved by adding the rocks and ceramics then filling the barrel with water. Put your hand over the barrel opening and drain all the water out. That leaves just enough water to run each stage. Chuck Drummond Island Rocks, you don't run ceramics in the 220 stage? I have always used ceramics there, but that's where they get the most worn down, so I'd love to leave them out. I believe you also add a tablespoon of borax to the 500 - polish stages, right?
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Post by Jugglerguy on Mar 10, 2018 15:52:05 GMT -5
I like what you said so I bought a Lot-O-Tumbler but now I'm not sure when to take the stones from the rotary tumbler and put it in the Lot-O-Tumbler and what amount of grit to add to it not to mention how long I tumble on the last stages. I'm sure there will be instructions but those can be a bit ambiguous I want to make sure I get it right the first time. I tend to only use the Lot-O when the stones are ready to polish. I only do two stages, but you don't need to jump to that process if this is still pretty new. I would recommend going through the regular first three steps in your rotary, then polish in the Lot-O-Tumbler. I do not follow the instructions that come with the Lot-O. I finally wrote up my instructions, as I have given demonstrations. I'll try to locate at attach them later today. ingawh, I have always been super impressed with your tumbled rocks. I don't use the same technique as you, but we get similar results. So what I'm about to disagree with you on is not about the results you get, but about your method of getting there. I don't see any reason to run the first three stages in a rotary tumbler. I do what Chuck does and go to the Lot-O as soon as the rocks are done with the first stage. My reasons are that it saves a ton of time and grit. I can do stages 2 and 3 in two days each in the Lot-O, but those stages would take at least a week each in a rotary tumbler. The Lot-O also uses almost no grit compared to rotary tumblers. So by going to the Lot-O earlier, I save grit, time, and electricity. Since I respect your tumbling abilities so much, I'd love to hear your reason for doing stages two and three in the rotary.
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Post by Drummond Island Rocks on Mar 10, 2018 15:52:33 GMT -5
Rocks get moved from the rotary to the lot-o as soon as you are happy with the shaping and surface quality. If there are still any pits or flaws when you move them to stage two they will still be there all the way to polish. Stage 2-5 does not remove flaws. Ask 10 people for tumbler instructions and get 10 different answers. This is a generic recipe that works on 80% of the loads for the lot-o Stage 2 fill to 80 percent with wet rocks and add 2 tablespoons of 120/220 SC or 220 graded SC. Run 24-48 hours checking often for motion. Spray with water when motion slows. Stage 3 fill to 50-60 percent with wet rocks and add enough ceramic filler to get to 80% full. Add 1/2 teaspoon of 500 AO. Run 24-48 hours checking every 12 hours for motion. Spray with water if motion slows. Stage 4 fill to 50-60 percent with wet rocks and add enough ceramic filler to get to 80% full. Add 1/2 teaspoon of 1000 AO. Run 24-48 hours checking every 12 hours for motion. Spray with water if motion slows. Stage 5 fill to 50-60 percent with wet rocks and add enough ceramic filler to get to 80% full. Add 1/2 teaspoon of A/O polish. Run 24-48 hours checking every 12 hours for motion. Spray with water if motion slows. Stage 6 is optional. This is just a 2 hour run with the rocks and ceramics after polish using 2 tablespoons of borax. *** the proper amount of water to add at each stage is achieved by adding the rocks and ceramics then filling the barrel with water. Put your hand over the barrel opening and drain all the water out. That leaves just enough water to run each stage. Chuck Drummond Island Rocks, you don't run ceramics in the 220 stage? I have always used ceramics there, but that's where they get the most worn down, so I'd love to leave them out. I believe you also add a tablespoon of borax to the 500 - polish stages, right? Oh yeah. Forgot the borax during those stages. I'll edit above. For the most part I do not use ceramics in the 120/220 stage (mainly because of wear). I really only add them if there are too many 3/4" - 1" rocks and not enough smalls or if I don't have enough rocks to fill the barrel properly. Chuck
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Post by grumpybill on Mar 10, 2018 16:49:47 GMT -5
The woodman link to the RockTumbler.com is very informative regarding vibe use... I highly recommend it. Unless they've changed it in the last few months, their instructions for a Lot-O are wrong. They say to use 2 tablespoons of prepolish and polish instead of the 1/2 teaspoon the manufacturer (and everyone else) recommends.
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ingawh
starting to spend too much on rocks
The rock wants to shine, I just help it get there
Member since February 2011
Posts: 194
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Post by ingawh on Mar 10, 2018 19:22:22 GMT -5
I tend to only use the Lot-O when the stones are ready to polish. I only do two stages, but you don't need to jump to that process if this is still pretty new. I would recommend going through the regular first three steps in your rotary, then polish in the Lot-O-Tumbler. I do not follow the instructions that come with the Lot-O. I finally wrote up my instructions, as I have given demonstrations. I'll try to locate at attach them later today. ingawh , I have always been super impressed with your tumbled rocks. I don't use the same technique as you, but we get similar results. So what I'm about to disagree with you on is not about the results you get, but about your method of getting there. I don't see any reason to run the first three stages in a rotary tumbler. I do what Chuck does and go to the Lot-O as soon as the rocks are done with the first stage. My reasons are that it saves a ton of time and grit. I can do stages 2 and 3 in two days each in the Lot-O, but those stages would take at least a week each in a rotary tumbler. The Lot-O also uses almost no grit compared to rotary tumblers. So by going to the Lot-O earlier, I save grit, time, and electricity. Since I respect your tumbling abilities so much, I'd love to hear your reason for doing stages two and three in the rotary. Hey Jugglerguy - Thanks, you are very kind. Everybody seems to find their own sweet-spot of how to make this thing work the way they like it - and that's half the fun! I guess I was just thinking that if someone wasn't as experienced, it might be easier to stick with rotary for the middle stages. As you know, I now usually just skip any middle steps altogether and just go straight from course grind to final step in the Lot-O, but when I used to do middle steps in the Lot-O, I found they were more of a bother, because there is more material coming off the stones, thickening the slurry and therefore requiring more babysitting and adjusting of the slurry. Plus, just doing the polish stage in the Lot-O saves your Lot-O barrel for just the one grit -- Otherwise, I recommend different Lot-O barrels for the different grits (especially because of the little hard-to-clean punt at the bottom). Question: Do you recharge the grit during middle steps like their instructions say? As you may have discerned, my two-step invention was really a product of laziness and impatience. I let my big tumbler run too long one time on course grind, and out came stones that I could just rub with a cloth and begin to get a shine on. Light-bulb moment! Into the Lot-O with AO pre-polish, let it run "too long" too - in this case 24 hours, without changing the grit, and bingo - total polish. (Well, I guess there were a few other little tweaks and inventions along the way, plus just getting the feel of how the Lot-O should look, act and sound when all was going well, but you get the idea.) All that said, every now and then I will do a middle stage in the Lot-O. Like if I find I've stopped the course grind a little too soon, or I'm working with a tricky material, and I almost never do middle stages in rotary anymore, unless I'm working one special, large piece that won't fit in the Lot-O. So I guess this is just up to the individual and what they want/feel comfortable trying.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Mar 10, 2018 19:53:50 GMT -5
ingawh , I have always been super impressed with your tumbled rocks. I don't use the same technique as you, but we get similar results. So what I'm about to disagree with you on is not about the results you get, but about your method of getting there. I don't see any reason to run the first three stages in a rotary tumbler. I do what Chuck does and go to the Lot-O as soon as the rocks are done with the first stage. My reasons are that it saves a ton of time and grit. I can do stages 2 and 3 in two days each in the Lot-O, but those stages would take at least a week each in a rotary tumbler. The Lot-O also uses almost no grit compared to rotary tumblers. So by going to the Lot-O earlier, I save grit, time, and electricity. Since I respect your tumbling abilities so much, I'd love to hear your reason for doing stages two and three in the rotary. Hey Jugglerguy - Thanks, you are very kind. Everybody seems to find their own sweet-spot of how to make this thing work the way they like it - and that's half the fun! I guess I was just thinking that if someone wasn't as experienced, it might be easier to stick with rotary for the middle stages. As you know, I now usually just skip any middle steps altogether and just go straight from course grind to final step in the Lot-O, but when I used to do middle steps in the Lot-O, I found they were more of a bother, because there is more material coming off the stones, thickening the slurry and therefore requiring more babysitting and adjusting of the slurry. Plus, just doing the polish stage in the Lot-O saves your Lot-O barrel for just the one grit -- Otherwise, I recommend different Lot-O barrels for the different grits (especially because of the little hard-to-clean punt at the bottom). Question: Do you recharge the grit during middle steps like their instructions say? As you may have discerned, my two-step invention was really a product of laziness and impatience. I let my big tumbler run too long one time on course grind, and out came stones that I could just rub with a cloth and begin to get a shine on. Light-bulb moment! Into the Lot-O with AO pre-polish, let it run "too long" too - in this case 24 hours, without changing the grit, and bingo - total polish. (Well, I guess there were a few other little tweaks and inventions along the way, plus just getting the feel of how the Lot-O should look, act and sound when all was going well, but you get the idea.) All that said, every now and then I will do a middle stage in the Lot-O. Like if I find I've stopped the course grind a little too soon, or I'm working with a tricky material, and I almost never do middle stages in rotary anymore, unless I'm working one special, large piece that won't fit in the Lot-O. So I guess this is just up to the individual and what they want/feel comfortable trying. I do almost exactly what Chuck said above. I do have two Lot-O barrels, one for polish and one for all the other stages. I don’t see any of the Lot-O stages a pain, except maybe for the 220 stage since it takes a little more babysitting.
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ingawh
starting to spend too much on rocks
The rock wants to shine, I just help it get there
Member since February 2011
Posts: 194
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Post by ingawh on Mar 10, 2018 19:58:34 GMT -5
Ingas Lot-O-Tumbler 2-step instructions.docx (306.47 KB) Found it! I haven't tried to attach a file before, so I hope this comes through. It is a handout I prepared to give a couple talks on my 2-step method using rotary for the course grind and a Lot-O for the second and final stage. As I review it, I see that the opener is a bit of a pitch for why the Lot-O is such a great cost and bother saver. Anyway, feel free to ask questions, point out typos, etc.
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ingawh
starting to spend too much on rocks
The rock wants to shine, I just help it get there
Member since February 2011
Posts: 194
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Post by ingawh on Mar 10, 2018 20:30:59 GMT -5
I do almost exactly what Chuck said above. I do have two Lot-O barrels, one for polish and one for all the other stages. I don’t see any of the Lot-O stages a pain, except maybe for the 220 stage since it takes a little more babysitting. You begin to learn just how impatient and lazy I can be... I never even bother to clean out the little punt at the bottom of the jug, since it's one grit per barrel. I have the 220 SC barrel, the 500 AO barrel, and I do actually have a polish barrel, though I can't remember when I used it last. I love the set-it and forget-it method!
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Post by Jugglerguy on Mar 10, 2018 22:38:34 GMT -5
I do almost exactly what Chuck said above. I do have two Lot-O barrels, one for polish and one for all the other stages. I don’t see any of the Lot-O stages a pain, except maybe for the 220 stage since it takes a little more babysitting. You begin to learn just how impatient and lazy I can be... I never even bother to clean out the little punt at the bottom of the jug, since it's one grit per barrel. I have the 220 SC barrel, the 500 AO barrel, and I do actually have a polish barrel, though I can't remember when I used it last. I love the set-it and forget-it method! After the first couple of loads I filled that hole with epoxy. I’ve never had a rock or piece of ceramic stuck in there since then.
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